Pretty much. If he gets salty, he even purges folks that just “like” something he disagrees with. Not much “discussion.”
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I think it’s deep in dressage’s roots. People were brutal about Baucher, and Fillis was called terrible things because he “wore holes in horses sides” and so on and so forth. I’ve read many old texts where the “correct” way of doing things was hotly debated. When I first started reading them it made me chuckle because I was like “OMG, we’ve been doing this forever!” So people just carry on that venerable tradition today LOL
I also think some of it is because it is a discipline based on the pursuit of a pretty clear standard, so that’s another invitation to critique. So many other disciplines are either time based or they are more subjective, so there isn’t really the same level of “picking apart” that you can do with them.
But even dressage judges judging against the standard try to acknowledge rider progress. The “WRONG WRONG WRONG” brigade is just not very good at that. They seem to think it’s their personal mission to correct everyone about training, and it really does turn me off.
We have one gal in our area who won’t ride a judged test, but has gained quite a following based on her “kinder” biomechanical methods of dressage. What I see is horses dumped on the forehand as “self-carriage” but I try to mind my own business. She seems to have toned down some of the negativity, for awhile that was all that was being posted. But for her, I have spoken to her and she believes she’s on a personal mission to improve things for horses. I do have to commend her on going to dissections and learning about anatomy, but it feels like a religion rather than education and training.
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You are all entitled to your opinions.
They amuse me.
What?
I think based on your screenshots that Kyra was starting to become intentionally provocative, and the good reverend didn’t like that and banned her. And, from what I saw in the group, she was. The 3-4 beat canter thing was evidence of that. Not that I minded what she was doing at all, but I could tell.
EAB wants an echo chamber. Discussion isn’t discussion when it’s “my way or the highway”.
Many were starting to learn from Kyra, as they were starting to ask Paula and Kyra direct questions instead of just waiting for the mob, EAB didn’t like that.
You are entitled to believe that there is good discussion there, just as we’re entitled to believe we’re not seeing it. I’d like to see actual posts where there is good discussion, not someone saying “there’s good discussion”. Someone else’s opinion isn’t going to sway me.
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When I saw that Kyra pointed out Olivera writing about the pirouette being a 4 beat movement I had a feeling he’d lose his marbles.
She also wrote of the trot being not 100% 2 beat, but that’s only visible when you slow a recording down, waaay down, which let you see the hinds landing first. I don’t recall it fully, but as I read it I thought “this won’t be tolerated”.
This might be not what sent him over the edge, but it may have contributed.
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I’m all for seeing some changes in the upper levels of Dressage (and probably lower levels too.) But you can’t simply just say, this is wrong, this wrong, this is wrong, now just change it! Obviously, there is more to riding than just having to poll out the highest point. AB’s riding video makes that point clear.
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Well she did make him agressive but I believe there was something they agreed on and she announced that she would ask the FEI to correct it…. But honestly I am not sure if that made him happy but this thread from her FB page which somebody copied into the board got him over the top!!!
Ohhh:disappointed_relieved:
. I will miss the group 
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Wouldn’t it be easier if we could? For instance, I have a rogue left hand. It drifts toward the sky sometimes. Not terribly high, because that would be obvious, but it’s enough to get in the way sometimes. Why? I’m SURE there is some imbalance in my body that causes that to happen, particularly when I’m focusing. Or because my prioperception (I’m right handed) tells me that my left and right hand are in the same place when they aren’t. Or perhaps I am subconsciously correcting for my right hand being stronger by blocking with the left hand. All possible explanations, and nothing I’ve ever done has fixed it completely.
I’d love it if someone could just tell me something that keeps that from happening. But for years, I’ve been correcting that particular bugaboo and still, every once in awhile…that left hand just…has a mind of it’s own.
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I do think it’s odd that the legit folks on that FB page persevere in having discussion in the shadow of a creepy, ignorant, BSC moderator and just have to ignore his meltdowns. I also think the percentage of newbies to actual serious riders is not the right ratio to have really sustained intelligent discussions as opposed to dumping on things constantly.
I am not surprised no one risks posting a video of doing things right.
My impression is that Paula knows her stuff but is older and may not be riding much any more. I know people who are acquaintances. I think she may be the only poster on that page who has been a legitimate trainer and clinician.
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Yeah, I know she knows her stuff, she’s just very very prolific…I think it just gets tiresome reading “precipitous flexion” on almost every photo ever on the internet. 
I do think that it’s become a mission of sorts for her, to get it into the vernacular, but I’m not sure it has had the desired effect, because I’ve seen it so often I now shudder when I read it. Human psychology is interesting, and I’m sure I’m just reacting to the oft-unasked for critiques.
To be fair, she’s never said anything negative about my riding, but I’m also incredibly careful typically about what I post with a LOT of caveats about what I already know to be wrong in the photo, because most of us are keenly aware of our own inadequacies - at least those of us that aren’t delulu.
It’s just more of a knee-jerk reaction to reading it (I hope that makes sense).
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I was told by someone I basically know nothing so responded. Further comments from others about other aspects of the conversation amused me further for various reasons.
It matters not what I type here. Someone is going to have a problem with it and say all sorts of things back to me. In such an environment one cannot get upset, only amused.
But isn’t that the discussion you want?
I think you and I fundamentally agree on some things but I feel often like you’re trying to provoke people. I’m just not sure why you want that. It hasn’t, in my experience, been a great method of making change happen.
Perhaps it’s unintentional and you don’t mean to sound that way? Some of us are not as good at tone in written word as others, and writing is all we’ve got here.
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Provoke? No.
I’ve posted on CoTH about ethical training for years, then stopped for a long time because every post was a fight rather than discussion. I was told I was crazy when I’d point fingers to the riders in top sport.
I popped out only because of LK posting nonsense on legal matters. So it’s her fault LMAO
It is possible that I post in strong ways anticipating backlash but that is not my intent. I also don’t intend to be bullied or demeaned.
I don’t much care what people think of me but it’s always far more preferable to be liked. I just want things better for the horses. The things I do are toward that end, no matter how small a thing that action is. That’s always the intent.
That’s why I understand Buck. That’s why Buck is not NP because NP only wants what LK wants - to be the admired, worshipped one.
Buck on the other hand wants to leave the world a little bit better for the horses.
As we are all human, things like ego can get in the way. So it’s best to toss it aside sometimes. It’s hard for some to do.
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I think it spun out of control with the emergence of the internet TBH. I do agree that some form of scrutiny and criticism is natural in historical dressage, but at least those who critiqued Baucher were generally horse people themselves and weren’t of the “armchair variety.” Modern tech has amplified it as well by being able to critique to the millisecond (screenshots) and the interconnectivity of riders, etc. People like AB are delusional enough to believe that none of the masters had imperfect moments bc there isn’t tons of dissected video evidence to prove it (like modern competitive dressage).
Yes, exactly. Much of what we see today (not all) existed back then, we just don’t have a ton of evidence. Gait irregularities being a big one.
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That I agree with too (and I swear I posted something similar, but now I can’t find it LOL)
I tend to think that there’s nothing new under the sun in horse training. I recall from my historical readings that there were some pretty nasty battles about bits and kind training too as well as horses being too flexed etc.
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The saddest thing I’ve seen in that group is the member who gave up on riding because she deemed herself incapable of being good enough. That absolutely broke my heart.
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AB doesn’t allow free speech in his group, he only entertains ideas that align with what he perceives as right. Anyone that does not follow his line of thought is booted. IMO he is the poster child for a malfunctioning ego.
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I do appreciate that you don’t want to come across that way and appreciate the history. I was not as much of a participant here for the last several years when I was too depressed because of my physical issues that prevented me riding, but what I’ve noted since I got here in 03, is that usually when people come in with an alternative position, they come in guns-a-blazing and that causes loud and instantaneous pushback.
That can sometimes come across as harsh or bullying, but it’s really not. Though I’ve certainly had my fair share of scrapes throughout the years, it’s usually apparent after a bit whether someone has the chops or not. Defensiveness usually doesn’t go well because those are the signs typically of someone who doesn’t know what they are talking about. I don’t think it’s unique to this board, but I will say that it’s one of the things I’ve loved about it over the years. It separates the wheat from the chaff, and we have less threads that are…foolish. Not saying that yours are, just saying visit other boards and often the tone is far different. They are not really suitable for experienced riders and I don’t visit them because there’s one too many “how do I get a good headset” threads that just…keeps on going.
What about Buck makes you think that? I see in him, and remember him from prior COTH interactions, being very much like NP. He has a platform, but not only can’t walk the walk, but he is…aggressive and shouts people down and threatens to sue people instead of either proving himself or having rational conversations about it. That’s not typically the behavior of someone who wants to actually inform or educate.
I’ll admit, it takes great patience and tact (and humility) to be able to both communicate and communicate in such a manner as to change minds - and we all fail sometimes (usually when I do so I fail spectacularly) but there are patterns of behavior that sometimes are evident of deeper challenges than just a momentary loss of control (for instance, Buck’s continued lawsuits). But if there’s some evidence that you see that the rest of us don’t, I’m all about hearing it.
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Paula has been disagreeing with him for years. She just is tactful about it.
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Yes I don’t see him as someone who truly cares about the horses - look at the video of him riding and jerking at the horse’s head, a bit in an angered fashion to my eye.
I believe he just wants to be seen as correct. I’ve known a few trainers like him. They talked a certain talk. But when they thought no one was looking they were pretty cruel acting. Talk is cheap as we have all learned
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