Count me as one who is not unhappy with the USA team result. Sure, it is disappointing. They went into XC in Bronze position. They all looked the part on day one. USA fielded a brilliant team and individuals. The USA is an an enviable position of running on GREAT footing no matter the time of year. We seldom have boggy/holding ground. We chase sandy footing early in the year down south and follow the nice weather north as things warm and dry out. I do believe had the ground been better that Buck and Phillip’s horses would have crossed the finish line and we would have a team score. It is just one of those things. Some horses like heavy going some like firm going. Today, our horses did not like the heavy going…period. This is the first championships in a long time that you could feel the excitement, the team spirit, the openness of the selectors, the involvement of the riders on social media. It feels like the whole of the USA eventing community came together and were given the opportunity to share in the process.
OK, we are not qualified for RIO and that is an issue but our riders can hold their heads VERY high. Although we do not finish a team…we are on the right path forward.
I think the takeaway is that the US needs tougher, longer XC courses–especially Rolex. Stamina is still a factor in the World Championships and probably will be in Rio as well.
I’m not convinced that Trading Aces and Buck’s horse would have gone well on the full course, even if conditions had been better. But that’s pure speculation.
Most may disagree with me but I feel Marilyn and Demi would have done a great job there.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;7739390]
I think the takeaway is that the US needs tougher, longer XC courses–especially Rolex. Stamina is still a factor in the World Championships and probably will be in Rio as well.
I’m not convinced that Trading Aces and Buck’s horse would have gone well on the full course, even if conditions had been better.[/QUOTE]
I absolutely disagree with you on both points. Yes, Rolex is a bit on the soft side but not by much. I do not think it needs to be longer. Our three star courses could rival any in the world. Our courses are plenty long enough.
Those two horses are a bit “cold blooded” in their nature but this course was well within their capabilities. Had the conditions been a bit better, I am sure they would have come home.
Do any of the teams have four riders left? Or is everyone crossing fingers and toes that their horses pass the jog in the morning? (You know…more than you normally cross fingers and toes. :))
It looks as if the French and Irish may still have 4 riders left.
http://score.normandie2014.com/results/eventing/EVE-PRI-TEA-CR.pdf
Let me put it this way. Horses at that level need to be fit enough to be able to do an 11:30 XC course at maximum number of fences that are mostly maximum height and width. If they never see an 11:30 XC course, how can anyone know how they will handle one.
If US tracks are as tough as any in the world, why don’t US horses shine in overseas competition? What you’re implying is that US horses who do well on US courses are well prepared for overseas competition, and that just isn’t the case–whether we are talking Games or Badminton or Burghley.
Sinead in 2012 was an exception.
I guess only G&J brillant rounds stayed in my memory–hoping the best for them!
[QUOTE=vineyridge;7739416]
Let me put it this way. Horses at that level need to be fit enough to be able to do an 11:30 XC course at maximum number of fences that are mostly maximum height and width. If they never see an 11:30 XC course, how can anyone know how they will handle one.
If US tracks are as tough as any in the world, why don’t US horses shine in overseas competition?[/QUOTE]
It is not our courses as a whole. It is the very fact that North American riders are not competing against the rest of the world like those do in Europe every week. It is all well and good to use these grants a few times a year at major 3/4 stars but we are at a disadvantage competition wise on a regular basis.
Regarding fitness level for these two horses. Are they likely to “make time”…probably not. That is a fact to face and deal with. It is not usual for most horse to make time on the modern course. I am sorry, but I do think these horses have the jumping ability to get round the toughest of courses…albeit with a bit of time. That is okay in my book. Some very good combinations found the conditions tough today. I am not prepared to write them off.
I am implying NO SUCH THING as is evident in my many posts on this subject over the years. I have always maintained that it is a training issue and access to regular competitive outings against those at the top of the sport and not just top in their our country.
And remember when Phillip and Buck rode the footing was definitely more tiring. You could definitely see that it got better as the day went on. For example Micheal Jung was the fastest for most of the day at 29 seconds over, but if he went later I’m quite sure he would have been able to be more in the range of the later rides and below 11 minutes.
Eventing is an individual sport; what other horses and riders do is totally beyond the control of a rider. I’m not sure what competing against the best in the world week by week can do other than set benchmarks for individual achievement.
Are you suggesting that if you are able to watch AN and WFP go week by week, you’ll learn how to ride dressage or XC?
Or are you suggesting that the general level of US riders is lower than in Europe, so less “competitive” horses are able to do well?
If our XC courses are tough enough, a horse that gets around double clear ought to be able to do it anywhere.
I am suggesting that less is achieved when you only have a few in the sandbox to play and measure yourself against. Judging is a factor across all levels. We have the horses, we have the riders. David is only two years in. I believe he will turn this around, our standard of training across the board will improve and our depth will grow. I am not prepared to write off today’s result as anything but tough conditions and a bit of bad luck. Some good combinations faltered today and some had a bit of luck on their side.
Are you suggesting that Phillip’s and Buck’s horses did not deserve to be at WEG? If so, we differ greatly in our opinions and it is a waste of time to continue other than to say that we agree to disagree.
I think Buck would have finished if he had run a little later in the program. His horse answered all the questions up until that last water but was too tired to pull it together after the stop. About the 5th or 6th rider they started taking it a bit easier at the start of the course, realising everyone was going to get time pens so make sure you have some horse left for the end
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvvC484u2y4
In case it’s not already up somewhere, here’s WFP’s full XC.
[QUOTE=DLee;7739395]
Most may disagree with me but I feel Marilyn and Demi would have done a great job there.[/QUOTE]
And may not have passed the jog on Sunday. Again. We are all not privy to all information of selectors. Regardless, while I think highly of the mare, I don’t think Marilyn has the experience yet to be reliable on a course that long and tough. Just looking at the type and experience of riders who finished.
And those who didn’t! (Mark Todd, Phillip Dutton!)
I just realized that for Fox-Pitt to stay off his horse while galoping that he only has his leg on from the knee down which is less support for all his great height above.
You’d be more likely to up your game - because you would need to.
