IMHO a good independent fitter can work with any brand saddle, because fitting is, well… fitting.
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I’d be very curious to slide my hand between the saddle down towards the base of the withers and see if it is tight there (basically, the top part of where the disturbed hair is). The saddle seems very ‘above’ the back, not wrapping around it. From the initial photos it looks like the front half of the panels flare out more than this horse needs, but they also look huge. Super stuffed. I’m not familiar with what the “RP” panels are, maybe they are supposed to be that way? Have they compressed considerably since then?
I have had a very good experience with Stubben in the last few years, including two re-makes of the same saddle (due to materials issues, not a fit problem). But I wholly agree that the fitter is a whole lot more important than the brand… every brand has great ones and not-so-great ones.
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It sure looks like the pommel is higher than the cantle in the new photos, which seems really odd since I thought from the first photos that the front of the saddle may be too wide–which would jive with being told to shim the front of the saddle. If my perception is correct, I can’t think of any way to make this saddle fit and be in balance.
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Er, ok? Weird that my saddle’s gullet went up 3 sizes over the first few years I owned the beast below. Picture with the orange marks on it 7 years old. Less frightening picture 16 years old. I wish I had better 7yo pictures, but I don’t 
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Sounds like you were sold a saddle that never fit your young horse in the first place. Join the club. His fundamental shape is the same in both photos from what little I can see. It’s only his topline that has changed drastically, not his wither or shoulder shape. This is so common with horses and is exactly why I don’t buy expensive saddles for a horse until they’re done growing. For some that’s as late as 8.
No amount of padding or “filling out” is going to change that the saddle sold to OP does not fit the shape of the horse’s back and shoulders.
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Wrong. If I had been sold a saddle that “fit” that monstrosity of a front end perfectly at that time, that front end would never have developed properly because as I tried to develop it, it would have been basically crushed down by a too-tight saddle. Like girdling a tree.
Wrong again and this is where I truly wish I had better images from that 7 year old year because it’s drastic. Where both front legs used to “come out of the same hole” there is now space between front legs. A lot of that was accomplished with shoulder muscling.
The wither shape has basically not changed, that is true, because bones don’t move a whole lot. What did change is the flesh around it, the trapezius is kind of important and runs over the withers, not just in front of it.
Try to think of it this way, although a skinny dudes bones are going to remain the same, if he lifts weights for a whole body workout, there is not a bit of his basic muscling that will remain the same. Hands will get bigger. Neck will get bigger. Everything expands when all muscles are use properly.
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Hello all,
I totally understand the feedback about muscle development, I do expect him to fill out a bit more in his topline, which is why i was originally swayed towards the RP panel so we could remove fill as needed to make room as he fills out a bit more.
For some context, I waited a year before I looked into a custom saddle for him. He will be 9 at the beginning of february, and I religiously worked on rebuilding his topline for the first year with the help of diet changes, the equiband system, and lots of stretching/bodywork. I wanted to move forward with a saddle when I felt he was at a more “baseline” muscle development to hopefully avoid having to purchase an entirely new saddle within a few months.
That being said, i am no stranger to saddle fit changes, as my now retired event horse went through multiple saddles over the years (early on i partially blame myself for lack of knowledge, but I also credit the saddle fit journey with making me learn, observe, and be more insistent on proper fit)
I did go ahead and email the Stubben headquarters today expressing my concerns, so fingers crossed I get a response that is satisfactory.
In the meantime, does anyone have an independent fitter they could recommend that services the Saratoga Springs NY area?
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Is it possible to move the girth points forward on this saddle? Moving the points forward sits the saddle back.Not ideal, but a work around.
So it moved forward a little bit even with no pads? In my experience, scooting forward means too narrow. I’m also surprised by that because the saddle seemed rather wide in the beginning. But I’ve got a young horse who got significantly wider over the past month, which we expected to happen, and my sign to try removing the half pad we had originally fitted with the saddle was that the saddle started creeping forward during the ride.
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Umm…talk to my appendix QH. He outgrew his saddle at age 6 due to his shoulders suddenly getting wider. I actually went to a MW Stubben to accommodate his shoulders. He was in a really basic medium ancient Beval Devon before that.
It is interesting looking at his old wither tracings how much he changed in his shoulders and topline.
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That’s fairly normal for a 6 year old. They are not fully mature, the spine and shoulders are one of the last things to fully develop. That is why I hold off on major saddle purchases until they’re older.
I thought it was obvious I was referring to a fully mature horse in my post. In either event my earlier statement still stands - this saddle doesn’t appear to complement the fundamental anatomy of this horse. He has a decent topline already so I don’t see that changing.
Although the photos aren’t exactly the same views, it does look to me like he’s put on some muscle compared to where you started.
Can you try an anatomic girth? Your guy seems to have a forward girth groove. It might help a bit. I really like this one https://profchoice.com/i-23901601-ventech-contoured-jump-girth.html
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It might just need more flocking in front, but scooting forward on its own means it does not currently fit the horse. Is there an independent saddle fitter that can eyeball this fit for you? Please nobody jump down my throat, but I very recently watched a very nice girl at my barn go through this with a Stubben rep. They must have gone through 3 or 4 different models with the rep saying all fit fine, when in fact, none of them fit at all.
You spent good $$ on this saddle. This one doesn’t fit. They need to make this right.
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Hey all, me again 
So the saga continues…
Saddle was sent back to VA to be inspected fully. Upon inspection, they flocked the sh*t out of it and sent it back up here to give it a go…
My initial impression upon putting it on his back/girthing up? I feel like we still have the same problem since the beginning 
I feel as though the root issue is the dramatic difference in fit from the left scapula to the right scapula. This horse is not glaringly asymmetric for it to be this extreme
I’m feeling quite defeated at this point, my horse’s whole personality has soured during this process and I don’t even feel comfortable taking it for a test ride b/c I’m not seeing any real difference in the fit at his withers 
Does anyone have any reputable independent fitters that service the albany NY area that may be able to offer me some sort of support through this?
I feel like i’m at a loss and i’m not trying to be overly picky or neurotic, but my gut is just not feeling good about this
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Oof. That’s sitting SUPER pommel high. Can you slide it back a bit? Does that help at all? Maybe your flocking is supposed to squish down or something, but that’s perched up there on some very stuffed panels.
I’m not a fitter but I’m not thrilled about the way this is mismatching the shape of BOTH shoulders.
I bet you’re frustrated. I hope someone knows a fitter or pro that can help.
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This is where it wanted to sit when I let it slide back into place
I expect it to squish a bit but its the weird shoulder fit that has continued to give me red flags
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Even though the balance is still way off, I think the tree is actually too wide for this horse and the wrong shape. And they are then trying to get it to fit the withers with this crazy flocking situation. I bet the tree points are no where near the actual horse. Which is the whole criticism about a lot of French saddles—super short tree points and most of the fitting done via the panel. Just does not make sense for Stubben to do this. I feel like it’s just totally the wrong model of saddle.
ETA - or if not too wide, just the wrong head iron shape.
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That saddle couldn’t possibly have been custom-built for your horse. The pommel is way too high. Show me photos of other horses with the flaps covering part of the mane. It looks like you are sitting on his withers looking at the lowest point of the seat. There is no way everything will break-in and settle down so that you and your horse will be happy. If you paid for it with your credit card, look into initiating a dispute. And definitely go after Stubben.
This situation makes me question seriously whether Stubben’s fitters are properly trained and have adequate experience to be working on their own. I watched a fitter (don’t recall saddlemaker) working with a couple of younger riders at the last barn where I boarded my dearly-departed Paint gelding. It was apparent she was not particularly well-versed in saddle fitting generally, let alone attempting to measure and document for a custom or semi-custom saddle.
When I first started looking at used saddles in 2000, when I was riding a school horse, the BO suggested Stubben. I never sat in a Stubben that didn’t cause me severe hip pain. So I axed them from the list and found that Albions that were an excellent fit for both of us,
Finding an expert independent fitter is tough but worth the effort. I spent quite a bit of time learning how to make tracings. I practiced on other people’s horses. I was able to have the Saddle Doctor check the fit of the saddles I owned in his booth at a show. He said the tracings were excellent. I passed them along to the fitter who took over his business when he retired. My Paint gelding was built like a TB with prominent withers and his back dropped as he aged through his 20s. We never had any problems with fit. I used a Supracor pad. I had my dressage saddle reflocked. The only significant change was adding an Acavallo rear riser pad the last few years I rode him.
I am astonished that a Stubben fitter created that saddle for a horse standing right there in front of her. I’ve often wondered over the years if Stubben has gottten too big for their breeches.
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It fits worse now then when you first got it?? 3 months is long enough and hopefully you can just get your money back. What a nightmare!
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