Thank you so much! I love this saddle so much and now I know what I’m looking for. I also think I’ll try to stay prior to 2018 if I’m not able to purchase this one.
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Back again with off-topic (but still leveraging your amazing CWD wealth of knowledge, so I hope you don’t mind) question about flaps.
Is there a difference in the height of the “forward” part of the flap between a 2C and a 4C? I rode in a 2C yesterday and the consensus was both that the flap was too short and there was too much flap above my knee. Would a longer flap # (like a 3 or 4) in a C-style flap resolve that? Or should I be looking for more of the L style flap?
Also, WTH is the difference between a ‘C’ and a ‘CH’ flap? (I’d pay good money for some lovely chart to visually show these differences? 
)
CWD has these charts (I saw them when a rep left her binder at the barn over a few days of fitting visits), but they really don’t want people to understand the codes. If you know what codes mean/what to look for, it’s more likely that you’ll buy a saddle off a third party (Highline, facebook marketplace, wherever) and therefore not give the sales commission to the rep. I’ve had fitters for a variety of brands say that they will not look at the fit of a saddle that was not purchased directly through them or at least from the brand’s used section, even if it’s “their brand/company”.
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Happy to help!
So yes, a 2C and a 4C have different measurements (I don’t remember their exact measurements).
But a 4C is going to be wider and longer than a 2C. So you will have more flap above the knee.
If you don’t like the flap above the knee, you can try an L flap (L flaps are set more forward on 2Gs trees than they are on regular flaps). You can also look at the CH. A CH flap is more like a Voltaire style flap, not so rounded. Its what I call a “long forward”.
And yes @tagsalong is right! There is a chart for the measurements and about all the other stuff. 
In my day, the chart was on the iPad, not a print out or binder. So I didn’t get to keep any of that fun stuff.
Hope that somewhat helps!
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@Belmont, I just have to say, you are a gem. What a wealth of knowledge and willingness to help everyone demystify CWD panels. You should start a consulting gig on the side lol.
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Hey @Belmont. I’ve been going through all these CWD fit threads and learning as much as I can to try to solve this puzzle on my own, but I’m ready to ask for some help.
I’ve got a 17yo with a high wither and a bit of a sway back, so all of the newer CWD saddles with more common panel adjustments in our barn bridge on him and the even the 705 RT ones are too tight on his scapula. I’m borrowing a 2015 SE02 (18" TR 3C, PA 705 210 RT+) right now that fits him okay but the seat and flap are too big on me. This one isn’t obviously bridging on his bare back while standing, but he’s getting friction rubs where the back of it sits in the past couple months.
I’ve found a couple saddles online that I’m wondering if they might be a good fit. One is a pretty similar configuration to the current but a better fit for me, just with RT RG instead of RT+. The other I think would have the freedom he needs around his scapula, but would the 805 905 fix the bridging? Or if you have any suggestions on what panels to look for that could be a match for him, I would appreciate that too!
SE26 S2 TC 2C, PA 705 210 RT RG, 21 90210
SE26 S2 TC 2C, PA 710 805 905 RT+, 19 70071
Hey Pepper!
So first thing to keep in mind with the saddles you’re looking at are:
- They are 2Gs, so a totally different kind of tree than what you’ve been riding in.
- The SE26 is a flat seat, so not the semi-deep seat you’ve been accustomed to in the SE02.
- Going from Classic (SE02) to 2Gs (SE26), the flaps fit differently. Sometimes if a customer was on the verge of 2C in a classic, I could get them in a 2L 2Gs.
As for panel, I will be pretty straight forward - a CWD might not work for your guy. There is a possibility you can find one, I’m not saying it flat out wont, however they are notoriously hard to fit for these types of backs as you tend to find out you need a more curved tree than they have. You get it fitting up front, but now it bridges in the back, etc.
On these types of horses, when I did have to build for them, I did navigate towards 905s & 805s. Trying to keep it as simple as possible without adding too much upfront for the shoulder and not adding too much to the back to prevent bridging. However, one thing to note on the 905/805 panels is that it can get pretty thick around the withers and in those shoulder gussets which can cause problems, when just adding and adding to try and make up for wither clearance. A 905 is shoulder gusset & back, while the 805 is just the shoulder gusset area.
The rubs could be from the saddle being too tight upfront, causing the movement in the back. The way the panels lay may also be causing the issue, which leads back to the “a CWD might not work”. They lay even flatter now in the newer saddles.
So to answer your question, out of the two, I’d probably lean toward the 2nd - 710/805/905. However, the long answer is if you reallllly want a CWD, I’d look into one of those “Sway back” pads and then you could likely get away with a more basic panel configuration vs crazy stuff that might cause problems later.
I hope this somewhat helped!
Thank you so much for responding.
My trainer has a 2G with a 17.5 2C and I like the fit much better for myself, but it bridges just a little on him (I think it’s just got the 705). I’m always craving a bit more forward flap than the SE02 has because my knees run into the blocks when I have my stirrup at a comfortable length for jumping. I’m about 5” shorter than the original owner of that saddle, but she’s been letting me use it while I try to figure out if there’s a better fit out there.
I’m unfortunately in a hard place geographically where we don’t have any awesome independent fitters and our tack store only carries one brand and a very small selection of used saddles that have all struck out. I’ve also put about 30 saddles (from a variety of brands) on him from in my barn and they all bridge or pinch up front. He’s just a tricky build.
We tried everything the reps for every brand had at WEC Ohio in December and nothing was a great fit. They’re all obviously very happy to build me a custom solution, I just don’t have a new high end saddle budget right now. I also don’t want to eat up my entire budget shipping trial saddles back and forth that aren’t likely to work. I’m so tired of saddle shopping!
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Both of those are newer than 2018 so won’t fit like a 2015. I have a 2015 SE26 and it’s definitely different than a 19 or ‘20. The trees are all pretty straight and the 805 could help some, but none of them are made for a more curvy back.
I’ve got a used Equipe EKGO for sale that is made more for a back like this. It was for a horse who was growing and used to fit into my SE26. Then he went through a curvy phase as he got taller and he got too wide for the CWD tree also. So I bought the Equipe as a good enough for now saddle. My horse grew out of that as expected and finished out with a wider flat back and not as high withers, and I didn’t want to invest in changing out the tree when the overall saddle might not work anymore so I went with a new saddle with wide tree in another brand for him.
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I don’t blame you at all for being tired. He definitely has a tricky back to fit without going full custom, but even a full custom CWD might not work unless you wanted to ride with a halfpad or sway back pad of some sort every ride.
What part of the back was the saddle bridging on?
Was it more upfront or true middle?
I checked my trainer’s saddle again yesterday and she has an SE40 that’s just PA RT, no other mods. It (and pretty much every other saddle) bridges where the white outline is on this photo. The one in the photo doesn’t bridge, but obviously it’s an older model.
Highline sent me a few listings they think would work but it’s so hard to tell from a photo which one might be a good fit for both of us. One is an older 2014 G2 but I don’t know if the older G2 tree would fit more like this 2015 SE02.
https://www.highlinetack.com/product/17-5-cwd-se25-2c-2014-flex-treeforward-flaps/
They also suggested these:
https://www.finelinetack.com/product/17-5-stubben-phoenix-elite-wool-flocked-3/
https://www.highlinetack.com/product/17-5-amerigo-hc-pinerolo-2020-wool-flockedfull-calf-leather/
I bought two custom French saddles for my now-retired TB. One thing neither CWD nor Voltaire would tell me is, “We don’t make a saddle that would fit your horse.”
The balance was so bad for me trying to keep the saddles off my TB’s withers that I rode in pain for four years, pretty much.
I love the CWD I now have that fit my WB and fits the PRE I ride at the moment, but they are so different from my TB.
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This is why I’m so hesitant to go to the brand reps. The CWD regional manager who has been coming out lately is really rude and will do anything to get your credit card. They don’t really care if the saddle fits, they just want the sale.
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I don’t know enough about Stubbens though some are for sure more curvy. But that CWD 2Gs just has a standard panel on it and will probably bridge also. Older model with 805 might help that area, but you’d be using foam to make up for the wrong tree shape.
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So the 2Gs that Highline sent you won’t work.
It’s got flat panels and is just a ST. Maybe if you went the swayback pad option it could potentially, but I’d bet you’d need at least a 705 on a standard no matter and I still think it might not be enough.
Also be careful with the older 2Gs. They had issues with the carbon fiber/kevlar mix on the original trees, so 2013’s and some 2014s can be “too” flex and cause issues.
I don’t know a ton about Stubbens or Amerigos, unfortunately, other than I know people that like both and have went towards the Stubbens for a back more similar to your horses.
I know you said you kind of live in a fitters desert, are there any independent fitters around you?
Oh I missed the Amerigo HC link. I would try that one.
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