Dangerous, Hard to Catch Lesson Horses

[equinestr]

I don’t own a horse, so I use my stable’s lesson horses. A lot of the horses stay in pasture full time because boarders are the ones who get first come first serve for stalls (unless the lesson horses are dangerous). I’ve had a few run-ins with a couple of the lesson horses running away whenever I come to catch them. One lesson horse that I’m put on quite a bit will dip out after walking near you and throw her butt near you to make it appear like she’s going to kick out at you and then she runs off. Other times she’ll approach you with her ears pinned (like laid back pinned) and charge at you then turn her butt to you. I can’t exactly put her in a round pen because she’s not my horse and I don’t want to bring out grain every time I’m out there to catch her because the pasture is SO large and has over 20 horses in it.

How can I make myself the dominate one and make it easier to catch her? The two main areas the horses go to are on both ends of the pasture far away from the gate so if I get into a dangerous situation I’ll be trampled before I ever get to the gate.

[SuzieQNutter]

Maybe rethink where you are taking lessons. Over here it is not up to the student to bring horses in for lessons. Students do not have the necessary skills.

You are in a dangerous situation. It is not worth your life.

[ryansgirl]

I’d be looking for a new place to take lessons. That situation is extremely dangerous and you shouldn’t be going out there on your own. Where are the instructors or barn manager during this? It’s really not worth getting hurt. :no:

[luvmyhackney]

Find a new place to ride and lesson with. Not safe at all. The only time I used to let students get horses was when there was two in the pasture and they were super respectable. You don’t have the skills.

If you do continue to ride there I wouldn’t enter without a lunge whip.

[equinestr]

I can catch the horses just fine and I’m definitely not a beginner. I’m not going to take lessons anywhere else. I simply asked what I should do in the pasture with a hard to catch horse.

[cayuse]

Well, since lessons somewhere else is not an option, at least wear a helmet when your out trying to catch the horses. I knew a woman who was killed out in her pasture, husband came home and found her dead. As far as they could tell she had been kicked or run into by a horse as she was trying to catch one. I would not (and have refused) to go into a pasture in similar circumstances as you describe. It is just not worth it. If that horse is so difficult it should have separate turnout.

[trubandloki]

I think this is a good topic to bring up with your instructor.
They know the horses and know what techniques work with them.

[McGurk]

What does the barn staff say? Have you asked them how they catch her? Or how other students manage when they need to catch her? Even better question - is anyone on staff, including your instructor, aware how difficult/aggressive this horse can be while loose in the field? Can you have someone on staff observe the next time you go out so they can see the behavior?

PS - On of the best, sweetest, most useful beginner lesson ponies ever started charging at children when they went to catch her. I almost didn’t believe it when I was told, I was sure the children were exaggerating because she was a total sweetheart about everything else. So I hid and watched a child go into her paddock with a halter. :eek::eek::eek:. Charging with ears back, teeth bared and head snaking. Stopped and pricked her ears forward when I yelled at her.

I never sent a child into the paddock with her again. I just brought her up before lessons ever after.

ETA: Trubandloki and I posted at the same time. Great minds think alike.

Do consider that the horse may be a perfect angel with barn staff, as she associates them with feeding, and avoidant with students, whom she associates with work.

[ladymcts]

equinestr,

For us, it’s a little like you’re saying, “I am going to stand out in the middle of an intersection with car traffic, how can I do this safely.” We can tell you things like wearing reflective clothing, but to do so is also endorsing something we wouldn’t do ourselves.

I’ve been in bad pasture situations and got thrown into a barbed wire fence once because of a squabble between horses who meant me no harm at all, just that I was in the wrong spot at the wrong time. Thankfully that and other situations didn’t result in serious injuries. I have pasture boarded my horses in large herds, and would do that again with my own private horse(s) because I know them, trust them, and there’s a willingness for them to come to me. Chasing down lesson horses who would rather get out of work is not something I would consider safe or anywhere in my to-do list. Ever.

[Sueby]

@equinestr

I can catch the horses just fine and I’m definitely not a beginner. I’m not going to take lessons anywhere else. I simply asked what I should do in the pasture with a hard to catch horse.

I’m confused, if you can catch the horse(s) just fine, what are you asking then? I assumed you couldn’t catch the horses because of the pasture size and their attitudes and that’s what you wanted help with.

I wouldn’t even bother with trying to dominate the horse, not even sure what you mean by that, I would just walk away and get someone to help me that works at the barn. No sense in running yourself ragged after a horse that has your (an every other lesson student’s) number. They know what’s coming and that’s the issue :).

[betsyk]

We don’t allow lesson students in the pastures with loose horses unless they’re accompanied by staff. If volunteers need to go in the pastures or paddocks to catch horses, they go in pairs, one to manage the gate and fend off any horses that try to get in the way, and the other to lead the horse. We tell them that if they have ANY trouble, they are to come find staff immediately, and if the horses start running around, they get out of the pasture immediately and go find staff.

I mention this as an example of a policy the barn can institute to keep people safe. Loose horses that don’t want to be caught can be really dangerous.

When staff go out to catch a reluctant horse, we do bring treats - we have decided to reward the horses for coming to us, and to build in another reward once they get inside, which may be a flake of hay in their stall, some hand grazing, or just standing in the breeze with fly spray (or out of the wind in winter). If a horse is known to be hard to catch, we keep them in a small pen on days they have lessons. They’re rarely hard to catch in a 20x20 space when the person with the halter also has a carrot or a bucket of grain.

All this is to say: the solution to your problem lies in the system, not necessarily in your approach. Though we have had volunteers who seem to always have trouble getting horses in, and others who go near the gate and the horse they want magically appears and shoves its head into the halter. If it makes you feel any better, one of my own horses used to love to run diagonally across his pasture of several acres, several times, before he’d decide to let me catch him. I’d have to allow about 30 minutes before a lesson just to bring him in; I knew I’d get him eventually but I could never predict how long he’d want to play the game. I would pat a couple of the others, tie my shoe, look at the sky, just generally do anything other than move toward him or act frustrated, and then slowly start to pay attention. The key is, you can’t MAKE them let you catch them, they have to WANT to, so you need to get them to the place where THEY want to come in.

[trubandloki]

@McGurk

Do consider that the horse may be a perfect angel with barn staff, as she associates them with feeding, and avoidant with students, whom she associates with work.

I think this is a very good point.

Maybe the barn staff does not know this horse is being an issue.

[Gloria]

If you are interested in learning how to catch a hard to catch horse which already exhibit dominant behaviors toward you, in a group setting, no less, you need to find a good ground work instructor. Online forum is not an appropriate place.

It is not a five minutes thing, where you tell her, “gal, I am your boss now.” If you already have experience and knowledge, it is mostly easy. If not, it can turn into a dangerous situation in a split second. Have you seen how horses exhibit dominance over each other? It is not for the faint of heart. Most likely you won’t need to get there, but you may have to. As you are a student at a lesson barn, your safest bet is to get the staff to catch the horse for you, like others have suggested. Or at least, get the instructor at the barn to show you.

[CHT]

I would definitely ask if others have this issue. If this is an issue for everyone, then the barn is setting you up to be in an unsafe situation. if it is just you, then have someone go with you and watch what it could be that you do differently. Sometimes how you approach the horse can be interpreted as aggressive or dominating, and some horses react to that by being aggressive or avoiding. Could also be that the horse isn’t threatening you, but rather the horses around you. Could also be the timing of when you ride. Or the colour of your shirt. I had a horse (boarder) that would not let me catch it if I was wearing my kitty toque. (damn horse was the fashion police I guess)

Regardless, it doesn’t sound like a safe situation. If one of my horses started behaving like that, I would want to know and I would not judge the student for having difficulties, rather I would feel badly that I had unknowingly put them at risk!

[rockonxox]

Talk to barn staff/trainer and ask someone to help you catch or show you the right way to catch the horse. We have some horses that students go get. If I see anyone trying to catch a horse that looks to need help I will go out and do so (not staff, just a fellow rider who knows how much it stinks to try and catch a horse who’d rather play around). Some horses, especially the ponies, are little trouble makers. However, none here are going to pin their ears and kick out at you for no reason. They just like to play the “oh you came to chase me” game. Especially with those who aren’t confident about getting them who just flop the halter about and have no idea what to do.

Even the horse I now lease has sometimes “taken off” (aka he trots off with his head in the air - maybe canters a small stretch) and hides behind other horses. I will talk to him calmly and usually have a mint in my pocket so when he does come to me or is a gentleman about getting his halter put on (which I’m happy to say is 99% of the time now) he gets a reward. No, you shouldn’t always do the food thing as the horse will expect it… but if it helps in the beginning so be it. He has never exhibited the behavior that you are describing with your lesson horse though so if she is truly being aggressive then she needs more training by the staff/trainer, not by a student.

If you aren’t confident catching this horse though, like many are stating, you need to ask for help and have someone show you.

Just saw this response from OP:

@equinestr

I can catch the horses just fine and I’m definitely not a beginner. I’m not going to take lessons anywhere else. I simply asked what I should do in the pasture with a hard to catch horse.

What did the trainer say? Not your horse, it is theirs, talk to them about how they want you to work with this horse (if they want you to).

[Jumping31]

Haha I’m sorry what? A commercial lesson barn is allowing dangerous horses to be in their program? That’s unheard of. Between the possible legal issues and safety issues, no professional lesson barn would let any dangerous horse in their program. There are the occasional ear pinners but there never really is any lesson horse that kicks out or is aggressive, and most of all DOESN’T charge at people. Even if they do keep her if so much as one person gets hurt their whole operation could go down. If you’re insistent on staying, talk with staff/BO and see what you can learn to better catch her or get to know her quirks.

But seriously…I’d be looking for a new lesson barn.

[RPM]

How many thread starters are there where all we have to do is read the title and we can tell the OP is a Greenie before we bother to open the thread?

And then the arguments start …

OP, we are trying to helpful here. Why do you want to continue lessons at a barn with dangerous lesson horses? What are you learning at this place? Serious question.

I can’t tell between your OP and your subsequent post whether you are having trouble catching horses or not.

Wishing you the best for a wise decision!

[Hooty_Hoot]

Obviously horses don’t want to be caught- some lesson horses have a tough life with people pulling on their mouths, etc while astride. I agree with others - dangerous and not worth risk - and unlikely to change behavior as owners seem inept, IMO.

[gumtree]

This tread is a perfect example why I think we don’t get a lot of “new blood” posting on the forum. Let see how well we can intimidate, lol.

Everyone assumes the horses are “dangerous” because of the way the thread is titled, Fair enough. I’m assuming the OP may not be as experienced as he/she may think. IMO and experience having had a lot of people show up looking for a job who have said they have had years of experience working with horses. They may have been around horses for years, worked with well schooled horses, some not so well schooled. But it became very obvious to me in short order they did not have solid skills. Not the kind, level of skills I was looking for, need.

OP how many horses are in the field? What kind of gate, and which way does it swing. Both ways is ideal with a field and a lot of horses. With this basic information I can tell you how I go about things. It’s not for me to tell you to move your tack. I will just answer the question as best as possible from cyper space. The best way to answer the question would be to see the horse/s and go from there.

[mmeqcenter]

It’s not your job, as a lesson student, to teach a horse how to behave appropriately.
I agree with everyone who said this is unacceptable at a lesson barn and I would not continue taking lessons there. At minimum, I would not continue taking lessons on that horse.