Poling is not legal.
Devin Ryan is on the USEF suspension list so he is not allowed on USEF show grounds and any horses owned by him are suspended as well.
[QUOTE=Lucy17;8302160]
What I mean is Culpeper is a dump and an after thought compared to the other show up north.[/QUOTE]
Ah, my apologies, I have never been there
[QUOTE=handwalk;8303026]
Poling is not legal.[/QUOTE]
According to the rule I quoted, poling with bamboo is not considered cruel or abusive, and therefore not forbidden - at least under that rule.
GR839 Cruelty to and Abuse of a Horse
- The following acts are included under the words Cruelty and Abuse but are not limited thereto:
…
d. Manual poling with any object other than a bamboo pole.
So is poling forbidden under another USEF rule? Do you know which rule?
https://www.usef.org/documents/licensedofficials/education/jumperschoolingrulesguide.pdf
Page 24
And JP103.1
https://www.usef.org/documents/ruleBook/2015/18-JP.pdf
[QUOTE=equisusan;8303558]
https://www.usef.org/documents/licensedofficials/education/jumperschoolingrulesguide.pdf
Page 24
And JP103.1
https://www.usef.org/documents/ruleBook/2015/18-JP.pdf[/QUOTE]
What interesting links…thank you. Anybody whose bored on a muggy Sat. Might find that first one with all the schooling ring jump construction diagrams very interesting and useful building at home exercises. I didn’t know half that stuff.
I think, back in the old AHSA days, use of a bamboo pole might have been allowed in schooling…seem to remember seeing them circa 1975 or so. Maybe they just never got around to cleaning up the references to it when they went to no poling period.
[QUOTE=findeight;8303785]
What interesting links…thank you. Anybody whose bored on a muggy Sat. Might find that first one with all the schooling ring jump construction diagrams very interesting and useful building at home exercises. I didn’t know half that stuff.
I think, back in the old AHSA days, use of a bamboo pole might have been allowed in schooling…seem to remember seeing them circa 1975 or so. Maybe they just never got around to cleaning up the references to it when they went to no poling period.[/QUOTE]
Yes I think I remember people taking them to the jumper schooling areas. I think you could put them in cups but not manually rap them with it or use as an offset. Now at home: people did that and worse and probably still do.
This is why I keep reminding myself I do this for fun and I don’t care if I win and I love my horses.
[QUOTE=equisusan;8303826]
This is why I keep reminding myself I do this for fun and I don’t care if I win and I love my horses.[/QUOTE]
Absolutely, although I totally care if I win and I love my horses and wouldn’t do any of this crap to either of them! Being competitive is fine- being competitive and then trying to find ways of getting a leg up through inhumane practices sucks.
[QUOTE=foursocks;8303946]
Absolutely, although I totally care if I win and I love my horses and wouldn’t do any of this crap to either of them! Being competitive is fine- being competitive and then trying to find ways of getting a leg up through inhumane practices sucks.[/QUOTE]
Oh I like to win 
but over the years I’ve won classes where I wasn’t particularly good and I’ve got a low ribbon when I’ve had an amazing trip. It is after all a subjective, comparative class. Sometimes I’m the best of the worst. LOL
And sometimes I’ve laid down the best trip that horse and I can do and we are just out jumped. It’s all ok… I know when I’ve done well and very fortunately I don’t make my living dependent on my results.
[QUOTE=equisusan;8303826]
Yes I think I remember people taking them to the jumper schooling areas. I think you could put them in cups but not manually rap them with it or use as an offset. Now at home: people did that and worse and probably still do.
This is why I keep reminding myself I do this for fun and I don’t care if I win and I love my horses.[/QUOTE]
Poles had to be taped so they could not splinter and pierce the horse’s skin. People would tape them in their barn colors, so they would not get “borrowed” and not returned.
It was a different day back then. Poling was legal and everyone did it without feeling that it was wrong. Mores [mor-ez] change, and people accepted things which now are unacceptable.
Like wearing helmets. In my mother’s day, nothing was worn on your head. Except when fox hunting and then bowlers (derbys) were worn. But nothing to actually protect the head.
Now if a dressage rider does not wear an approved helmet, it results in 4 pages of outraged posts.
Of course, back then, a woman would never wear a dress which ended above the knees. And pants?!?!? Never. Well, if you were a loose woman (or Audrey Hepburn), then maybe.
Point being, we cannot judge the customs and conventions of yesteryear with today’s mindset.
[QUOTE=Lord Helpus;8304031]
Point being, we cannot judge the customs and conventions of yesteryear with today’s mindset.[/QUOTE]
Say it isn’t so! Next thing you’ll say is that the Founding Fathers couldn’t foresee everything about our way of life when deciding the rules we govern by. LOL
Poling is NOT legal for Jumpers (JP103.1) , or Eventing (EV111.2) but it is, in certain circumstances, legal for other disciplines.
For hunters, bamboo offsets are permitted, but not manual poling, see HU Appendix A.17
- At management’s discretion (and if local laws allow) bamboo offsets may be permitted in designated schooling areas only. Manual poling is not permitted.
See GR GR844 Poling
- Manual poling is permitted at a vertical fence only but a bamboo pole may be used as an off-set bar at either a vertical or spread fence.
Now, I am not sure what other discipline would find poling relevant, but it is not strictly true to say that “poling is illegal”.
The other distinction, is that (for Jumpers, Eventing, Hunters), poling with a bamboo pole is against the discipline rules, but it is not “cuel and abusive”. Poling with anything other than bamboo is both against the discipline rules AND against the cruelty and abuse rules.
Anyone know who is training Sima Morgello in today’s class?
[QUOTE=marginall;8304615]
Anyone know who is training Sima Morgello in today’s class?[/QUOTE]
Todd Minikus (according to pbiec.com)
[QUOTE=Secret Dove;8570353]
http://www.chronofhorse.com/article/usef-suspends-devin-ryan-after-hampton-classic-horse-welfare-concerns[/QUOTE]
Not long enough or harsh enough IMO.
[QUOTE=equisusan;8571279]
Not long enough or harsh enough IMO.[/QUOTE]
100% agree with you! He’ll still abuse the horses at his farm anway. They should be taken away from him, but of course he just gets a slap on the hand. Typical of USEF. :no:
[QUOTE=Secret Dove;8572262]
100% agree with you! He’ll still abuse the horses at his farm anway. They should be taken away from him, but of course he just gets a slap on the hand. Typical of USEF. :no:[/QUOTE]
USEF doesn’t have the power to take his horses away, you realize.
Wish we could see the transcripts of this case, though.
I cannot even find the postings on line any more. They went many months at the end of last year without publishing and now there is one listing for 2016 with no month designation. there is nothing about DR in the current published hearing results
does USEF send out press release before posting on line?
They updated the September 2015 rulings.
