Touche
[QUOTE=TKR;6487681]
Back to splitting hairs – pass the adult beverages and appetizers.
PennyG[/QUOTE]
:lol: :lol:
Wow. I just spent the last hour or so reading this thread and it has been rather amusing, to say the least.
BayHawk-I find it interesting that you seem to have a healthy disdain for eventers, would never sell any of your horses to eventers yet are arguing with eventers about the rules of a sport you obviously know nothing about!! How can you possibly know what type of horse is required for the sport if you don’t ride in that sport? XC is still the heart of eventing. I would guess eventers want older prospects because you really don’t know if your horse will have the bravery and heart for XC unless you’re able to try it. That’s pretty tough to do with an weanling to 2 year old.
If you knew anything about Vineyridge from this BB, you would know that she has tirelessly and selflessly spend hours educating Coth members about the TB lines in sporthorses. We are very lucky that she shares her time and knowledge here.
If you’re not a fan of TBs, that’s fine. I would suggest not visiting the eventing threads unless your goal is to start trainwrecks because most of us love the TBs and their blood is desired and successful in this sport.
[QUOTE=grayarabpony;6487749]
Plain as day. “The competition will be conducted according to a special Olympic format of a 4 star level of difficulty.”[/QUOTE]
wrong…read again.
[QUOTE=mkevent;6487759]
Wow. I just spent the last hour or so reading this thread and it has been rather amusing, to say the least.
BayHawk-I find it interesting that you seem to have a healthy disdain for eventers, would never sell any of your horses to eventers yet are arguing with eventers about the rules of a sport you obviously know nothing about!! How can you possibly know what type of horse is required for the sport if you don’t ride in that sport? XC is still the heart of eventing. I would guess eventers want older prospects because you really don’t know if your horse will have the bravery and heart for XC unless you’re able to try it. That’s pretty tough to do with an weanling to 2 year old.
If you knew anything about Vineyridge from this BB, you would know that she has tirelessly and selflessly spend hours educating Coth members about the TB lines in sporthorses. We are very lucky that she shares her time and knowledge here.
If you’re not a fan of TBs, that’s fine. I would suggest not visiting the eventing threads unless your goal is to start trainwrecks because most of us love the TBs and their blood is desired and successful in this sport.[/QUOTE]
If this is what you took from the discussion then so be it. Let me help clarify for you my legitimate position.
1)I don’t have a disdain for eventing or eventers. I happen to love the sport. My deceased wife was a long time eventer under the teaching of Bruce Davidson. I also happen to know quite a bit about the sport , hence the correction for those that stomped their feet and mis-informed folks about it being a 4* when in fact it was a 3*
-
I never said I wouldn’t sell to an eventer. I said I wouldn’t sell to them for the ridiculously low prices they are known to want to pay.
-
I know full well who Viney is and respect her for taking the time to educate folks about TB blood. What I don’t respect is the fact that she sometimes thinks she knows it all and when confronted with a mistake on her part , still refuses to admit her ignorance.
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I don’t believe (with good reason) that most TB’s are capable of successfully performing at the top of the sport in todays arenas. They are not bred nor conformed for it. I do believe the TB STALLION still holds a special place in the generational production of todays and tomorrows international Warmblood sporthorses.
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I have only disdain for the TB lovers who constantly try and claim the succees of others breeds based soley on the percentage of their blood.
Thats where I stand…
I find Bayhawk the lone voice of reason here. The US had a poor performance in London, the takeaway is either we need better horses or better riders, and perhaps BOTH!
The first sentence of the above is actually really funny.
I don’t even get being pissed over the US’ performance when you’re not paying for it.
As I said, if you can show me an official FEI document that says the course is a 3*, or if the FEI answers my query and says its a 3*, then I will happily agree that the course is a 3*.
But if it was, then something is very rotten in Denmark. The published rules and regulations for the OG say the competition is to be run at the 4* level. If the FEI has authorized anything different through some back door or other, then one needs to ask if eventing should be in the Olympic Games at all. In all other sports, Olympic competition is the pinnacle of achievement. Can you name one other sport that cheapens itself with a lesser test in competition for the Olympics?
It would be like lowering the hurdle height in the high hurdles so shorter runners would have less trouble.
I do notice that horse and rider qualifications seem to have been cheapened for the Games. Instead of requiring 1 CCI 3* and two other 3* competitions, they only required one CCI 3* and one CIC 3*.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;6487998]
As I said, if you can show me an official FEI document that says the course is a 3*, or if the FEI answers my query and says its a 3*, then I will happily agree that the course is a 3*.
But if it was, then something is very rotten in Denmark. The published rules and regulations for the OG say the competition is to be run at the 4* level. If the FEI has authorized anything different through some back door or other, then one needs to ask if eventing should be in the Olympic Games at all. In all other sports, Olympic competition is the pinnacle of achievement. Can you name one other sport that cheapens itself with a lesser test in competition for the Olympics?
It would be like lowering the hurdle height in the high hurdles so shorter runners would have less trouble.[/QUOTE]
No …hurdlers can practice at the normal height anywhere and anytime. Bad analogy.
“Emerging countries” don’t all have access to 4* courses to prepare on ,therefore , you would have very few countries signing on for the olympics and at which point you probably would NOT have Eventing in the Olympics.
You saw it in the interview with the course designer. The interview spoke to it and they listed the event as a CCIO3*.
There are only FIVE 4* courses in the world. How in the hell do you think all the countries in the world are going to have access to a 4* to train on Viney ? Listen and learn something instead of replaying this broken record.
Lot of TB talk and I like all that but…
What bothers me is people saying more blood and more Tb’s but there is no qualifying that?
Which Tb’s?
The breed as a whole has a HELL of a lot of horses that dont jump well or move well enough for dressage… So? (I say this as a TB owner and an off-breed lover)
Im all about the Tb’s, obviously, but I wouldn’t breed one for eventing unless the mare was able to show ability in collection, boldness, and LOTS of jump. And I mean actually taking the animal to venues and being competative at a decent level.
Whats funny to me is the breed is tossed around as a whole when most are not purpose bred enough to qualify any certain lines as sport so the horse itself has to give you a reason to change what purporse right? (mind you there are SOME out her purpose bred but I mean majority)
Personally, I want to see mares/stallions having an extensive record in one or all of the portions of eventing to just pimp that TB line:)
You forget that until 2006 or thereabouts (and I really can’t recall when Adelaide started) there were only 3 4* courses in the world. Now there are six. Each one runs one 4* competition per year. Nobody gets to prepare on 4* courses anywhere near home except for once a year. And the courses are different every year. If you want to ride a 4* course, no matter where you live, you go to it. The Lesser nations have just as much access to 4* courses as the riders from the established countries. They pretty much all train in Europe anyway. I know the Japanese do and the New Zealanders and this Australian team are based in Europe. So they have access to four 4* courses over one year, while the homebased Aussies and the US and Canada have access to only 1 each.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;6488113]
You forget that until 2006 or thereabouts (and I really can’t recall when Adelaide started) there were only 3 4* courses in the world. Now there are six. Each one runs one 4* competition per year. Nobody gets to prepare on 4* courses anywhere near home except for once a year. And the courses are different every year. If you want to ride a 4* course, no matter where you live, you go to it. The Lesser nations have just as much access to 4* courses as the riders from the established countries. They pretty much all train in Europe anyway. I know the Japanese do and the New Zealanders and this Australian team are based in Europe. So they have access to four 4* courses over one year, while the homebased Aussies and the US and Canada have access to only 1 each.[/QUOTE]
Well lucky for the rest of the world that you aren’t running the Olympics.
Nomi,
The sire of Sam was bred for racing and produced a Gold winner at the Olympics. He wasn’t purpose bred for sport. I think most TB stallions in sport are bred for racing.
And as far as ignorance is concerned, the RID is not a warmblood just because it’s in Europe. This little Nation is very protective of it’s unique horse. They are valued for other things than top of sport. Mainly hunting field and having a sense of humor that fits all riders. Nice all around riding types. Crossing with blood and you get a serious horse for things like eventing. They don’t scare easy. They are very brave. Sometimes those purpose bred warmbloods are none of that. Part of the reason Ireland is not a fan of the warmbloods mixing with their blood. It is why they’ve been good in eventing. They just go for you no matter what lies ahead. If you hunted here you’d want an Irish horse or a TB.
I know you care about none of this but some people do so just try and have respect for other breeds and why they came about. Farmers needed a horse to do all the grunt work all week, take the family to church, compete with the kids, and hunt on the weekend. That’s what the Irish horse was all about.
Terri
[QUOTE=Equilibrium;6488282]
Nomi,
The sire of Sam was bred for racing and produced a Gold winner at the Olympics. He wasn’t purpose bred for sport. I think most TB stallions in sport are bred for racing.
And as far as ignorance is concerned, the RID is not a warmblood just because it’s in Europe. This little Nation is very protective of it’s unique horse. They are valued for other things than top of sport. Mainly hunting field and having a sense of humor that fits all riders. Nice all around riding types. Crossing with blood and you get a serious horse for things like eventing. They don’t scare easy. They are very brave. Sometimes those purpose bred warmbloods are none of that. Part of the reason Ireland is not a fan of the warmbloods mixing with their blood. It is why they’ve been good in eventing. They just go for you no matter what lies ahead. If you hunted here you’d want an Irish horse or a TB.
I know you care about none of this but some people do so just try and have respect for other breeds and why they came about. Farmers needed a horse to do all the grunt work all week, take the family to church, compete with the kids, and hunt on the weekend. That’s what the Irish horse was all about.
Terri[/QUOTE]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This. Wish that COTH had a “like” button!
[QUOTE=zelensky;6488307]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This. Wish that COTH had a “like” button![/QUOTE]
Me too zelensky.
Lovely post Terri.
There have been some excellent posts on this thread,and every time I look for the ‘like’ button…
Ah, the irony of this statement.
[QUOTE=Equilibrium;6488282]
Nomi,
The sire of Sam was bred for racing and produced a Gold winner at the Olympics. He wasn’t purpose bred for sport. I think most TB stallions in sport are bred for racing.
And as far as ignorance is concerned, the RID is not a warmblood just because it’s in Europe. This little Nation is very protective of it’s unique horse. They are valued for other things than top of sport. Mainly hunting field and having a sense of humor that fits all riders. Nice all around riding types. Crossing with blood and you get a serious horse for things like eventing. They don’t scare easy. They are very brave. Sometimes those purpose bred warmbloods are none of that. Part of the reason Ireland is not a fan of the warmbloods mixing with their blood. It is why they’ve been good in eventing. They just go for you no matter what lies ahead. If you hunted here you’d want an Irish horse or a TB.
I know you care about none of this but some people do so just try and have respect for other breeds and why they came about. Farmers needed a horse to do all the grunt work all week, take the family to church, compete with the kids, and hunt on the weekend. That’s what the Irish horse was all about.
Terri[/QUOTE]
Great post Terri
I hope the Irish Draught breeders continue to preserve the traditional purebred Irish Draught type to use as a resource for breeding sport horses…and I still think blood on the bottom is the way to go:)
Fred, Bayhawk doesn 't get it. And never will.
[QUOTE=shea’smom;6488402]
Fred, Bayhawk doesn 't get it. And never will.[/QUOTE]
But you have to admire his persistance. Or not:eek:
[QUOTE=carolprudm;6488406]
But you have to admire his persistance. Or not:eek:[/QUOTE]
Much in the same way you would admire hte persistance of a 3 yr old with his fingers in his ears screaming “I’m not listening”…lol.
[QUOTE=carolprudm;6488406]
But you have to admire his persistance. Or not:eek:[/QUOTE]
Not.
Nomiomi, you have a lot to learn about eventing, as does bayhawk.
And about TBs. I get so sick of the mediocre ones being pointed at. If you did the same for warmbloods you wouldn’t think they’d be Olympic caliber horses.
