Honestly, as long as she picks up the poop, who’s going to know if a dog pees on a gravestone? The people under the stone aren’t going to know, they’re dead. Unless the dog pees on the stone right in front of someone nobody will know.
[QUOTE=Dewey;8407893]
…but I am not going to swear it never happened.
…
She said her friend is picking up any poop her dog makes, so IMO, she’s being responsible.[/QUOTE]
It doesn’t matter if she picks it up. What I said was it was mean and disrespectful to have a bereaved person come to the cemetery and see a dog taking a shit on the grave of their loved one. “I’ll clean it up” is not going to make them feel much better.
And a male dog is going to lift its leg on objects. Chances are excellent at least one of the objects is going to be a tombstone.
I said before the dead won’t know; it’s the living I’m trying to be decent to. And figuring if the dog does it the chances of it doing it right when that person’s family will be there are slim doesn’t matter. If they see a dog doing that on other graves they’ll figure their own probably got anointed at one time or another. It’s just a callous thing to do.
OK, we have a big difference of opinion here, and that is OK. I have said my piece, so I will move on to other threads.
Trust me there are plenty of deer, birds, raccoons, neighborhood cats, possums etc… peeing and pooping in most cemeteries. Why is dog pee any different? OP said friend is picking up poop.
Depending on how crowded the graves are there tends to be lots of open space around the edges and in areas where nobody is buried yet. I would think that them urinating/defecating on an actual gravesite is pretty low. It might be a higher chance with male dogs.
Then again I used to play in the local cemetery as a kid and my GSD was always with me. I never really though about her peeing or pooping there. She actually chased loose cows out of the cemetery and back in their field one time.
[QUOTE=SonnysMom;8409562]
Trust me there are plenty of deer, birds, raccoons, neighborhood cats, possums etc… peeing and pooping in most cemeteries. Why is dog pee any different? OP said friend is picking up poop.
Depending on how crowded the graves are there tends to be lots of open space around the edges and in areas where nobody is buried yet. I would think that them urinating/defecating on an actual gravesite is pretty low. It might be a higher chance with male dogs…[/QUOTE]
This is a perspective I had not thought of before, and it’s a good one, so thank you for that.
OP… you’d hate me… I used to condition our horses on the cemetery by-roads… granted the cemetery was from the 1800s, secluded, yet still perfectly maintained…
But I don’t think loose dogs belong in a cemetery.
[QUOTE=SuckerForHorses;8407367]
It’s not simply being concerned about damage (although that may be a concern, I don’t know), but the act of peeing on the stone itself that I find disrespectful.[/QUOTE]
Damage matters. Respect is relative. As long as you can read the stone. (For reference, same answer as ‘would you want someone digging up…’, no, I don’t care, I’ve never even seen three out of four grandparents’ graves, at least I don’t think I have unless that one time one uncle died they buried his ashes near his parents, I didn’t look around. I find cemeteries interesting but as a general rule it’s like going through skeletal remains, I don’t get superstitious about it.)
Respect may be relative, but the idea of showing a particular sort of respect to the dead is fundamental in most human societies and an ancient idea. 400+ years before the birth of Christ (or thereabouts), Sophocles didn’t have to tell his audience why Antigone was willing to die to bury her brother.
wrt to the OP’s basic question, I’m not sure. If the dogs are just running offleash while the owner walks nearby, maybe. If the dogs are zooming around like it’s a dog park, or if the owner is taking them to the cemetary as their primary outing, ie, that’s where they get to relieve themselves, I think it’s wrong.
I used to take my dog for runs on groomed athletic fields which were securely fenced. I made sure to walk her beforehand, to give her time to pee and poop, and then used the field to let her run. We were there for 15 minutes or so, then would move on. I tried to balance the fact I was using the facility inappropriately by trying to do not harm, at least, and not bother anyone. It does sound like the OP’s coworker is just doing what’s convenient for her without regard to anyone else.
Dog and I walk through our small cemetery every day. I can’t help her peeing. I am training her to poop in the woods behind the cemetery, but when we have a fail at that, I pick it up. The only time I feel we are being disrespectful is when someone is in the cemetery visiting. Those buried there I’m sure don’t care, but I would hate to offend a relative/friend who is grieving.
Personally, I would be pleased to have dogs romping on my grave, but I know many people would be offended. I think it would be OK to walk a dog through a cemetary, on a leash and sticking to the paths, where people are supposed to walk. Dog pee can kill grass and no one wants to see a brown spot near their loved ones grave and the cemetary workers work hard to keep things nice, they don’t need more work to do repairing damage. My BC mix has a “Go Potty” command, so if I were to walk her in a cemetary, I’d ask her to pee first. She doesn’t mark territory, so once she’s peed, she’s good for a while.
Wildlife is different, they don’t know anything about what the cemetary means to people, people walking domestic dogs do know and it would seem disrespectful to many…not the dog of course, but the person.
Running loose? Not so much. Dog pee can kill grass and no one wants to see a big brown spot by their loved ones grace. My dog is a digger too.
I used to walk my GSD’s unleashed in cemetaries all the time. You must be Catholic and guilty. I’m sorry it bothers you.
[QUOTE=danceronice;8413389]
Damage matters. Respect is relative. As long as you can read the stone. (For reference, same answer as ‘would you want someone digging up…’, no, I don’t care, I’ve never even seen three out of four grandparents’ graves, at least I don’t think I have unless that one time one uncle died they buried his ashes near his parents, I didn’t look around. I find cemeteries interesting but as a general rule it’s like going through skeletal remains, I don’t get superstitious about it.)[/QUOTE]
I didn’t mean to imply that damage to stones doesn’t matter. It does. I’m just saying that to me, the disrespect issue isn’t JUST the damage to stones.
[QUOTE=Ladylexie;8413878]
I used to walk my GSD’s unleashed in cemetaries all the time. You must be Catholic and guilty. I’m sorry it bothers you.[/QUOTE]
If you’re talking to me… :lol:
If I had to put a label on myself, I’d say atheist, but most certainly not Catholic. And I don’t even know if I would say atheist. I’m just…not a religious person at all. I’d call myself spiritual, maybe.
[QUOTE=Ladylexie;8413878]
I used to walk my GSD’s unleashed in cemetaries all the time. You must be Catholic and guilty. I’m sorry it bothers you.[/QUOTE]
Hey, I’M Catholic, not particularly guilty and if I am ever under a headstone (as opposed to being cremated), your dog is welcome to pee on my headstone, I could care less. But I can certainly see why it would upset others and be disrespectful of their loved ones especially if they are laid to rest in a cemetery that posts no dogs or leashed dogs only, unless you are just blatantly disrespectful by nature (presumably not Catholic, I guess)?
See, I too can paint broad strokes with a tiny brush!
I am not catholic, always feel guilty, and anxious, and…well that is probably a different thread.
But just looking back at OP…Dog owner allows dogs off leash in a cemetery…no evidence presented that the cemetery is posted no dogs or dogs must be on leash. Dog owner picks up poop.
Opinions vary on ok or not ok in scenario presented. Most probably agree not ok in any worst case scenarios (property posted no dogs, funeral in process and pack of out of control dogs allowed to pee on headstone as grieving family looks on).
[QUOTE=SonnysMom;8409562]
Trust me there are plenty of deer, birds, raccoons, neighborhood cats, possums etc… peeing and pooping in most cemeteries. Why is dog pee any different? [/QUOTE]
[raises hand] Because male dogs mark and cemeteries are full of things - tombstones - to mark on. The objection I have, because I have seen it, is paying a visit to the cemetery and finding people there before me with a large dog running loose who peed on tombstone after tombstone. It’s disgusting, it’s gross, and it’s disrespectful. The deer and the raccoons are not doing that.
And as we all know, when one dog marks every other dog that comes after is going to mark at the same place.
I know I would be devastated if I visited my daughter’s grave after some dog had left a big wet urine mark on it. So not just disrespectful but callous.
Loose dogs do not belong in a cemetery. Period.
People may come to the gravesite of their loved ones for quiet communion with memory, to grieve, to remember, whatever. Loose dogs bounding around can be disturbing to those who are there.
While not exactly on topic, I am not a fan of loose dogs in public areas anywhere. People often do not have the control of their dogs they think they have. I have dogs, and they are leashed in public areas. A typical experience I have with people and their unleashed dogs is being met while cycling ( and not with my own dogs along) with a slobbering Cujo type barring a bike path while an owner wanders up some time later saying, “Oh, he won’t hurt you.” No? Who is to know? I tend to take barking bristling aggressive behaving dogs at their word.
Wherever loose dogs belong, it is certainly not in a cemetery.
[QUOTE=Paks;8420699]
I know I would be devastated if I visited my daughter’s grave after some dog had left a big wet urine mark on it. So not just disrespectful but callous.[/QUOTE]
It will dry so you probably won’t be able to tell. Are you talking on the ground or the actual marker? Think about it for a minute. My dad is buried in a very rural cemetery and the person who mows the grass lets his dog run around while he is cutting the grass and I thought it was nice. It never occurred to me to be all insulted??? Weird…
[QUOTE=Ladylexie;8420745]
It will dry so you probably won’t be able to tell. Are you talking on the ground or the actual marker? Think about it for a minute. My dad is buried in a very rural cemetery and the person who mows the grass lets his dog run around while he is cutting the grass and I thought it was nice. It never occurred to me to be all insulted??? Weird…[/QUOTE] Read my post if it’s wet it’s not dry. Urine in a shady area doesn’t dry in a flash. If I visit 10 minutes after the dog I’ll see it and because of the pattern know what it is. And I was talking about on the gravestone.
