Doing business with JILL BURNELL? BEWARE.

[QUOTE=ldaziens;6507813]
IMO, it is really important to spell out Jill Burnell & Gray Fox Farm – and make sure that mares are being sought by her husbnd, Alex Burnell.

There is a nice poster, JB; and others have pointed out that there are reputable farms w/ similar names (grey vs. gray). Anyway, I just think it is important factually and visually to spell out the names for future potential victims.[/QUOTE]

Thank you for posting this before I could. Please stop referring to Jill as JB. I’m often one to abbreviate everything that I can, but as we have a very regular and respected poster who uses “JB” as her screen name and breeds occasionally, this can possibly lead to confusion for those who aren’t quite as in the loop.

KMsuds, I believe you and your group then posted all sorts of nice things on her facebook. Well I am glad she finally cleaned the stalls! Yes they had flysheets on, but when it rained (and it did surprisingly) they stayed on. They were never checked and many got ripped, hanging off the horse until they fell off on thier own. You can blanket all you want, but you need to do daily checks. The horses may look good, but the elements and overcrowding are the problem. You can’t tell me that over 30 horses on 2.5 acres of drylot isn’t overcrowding. Dont get me wrong, the babies are friendly and very nice looking, but it is the horsekeeping that is lacking. I always make sure mine have a shelter and a daily flysheet/blanket check. If you are not capable of doing this yourself, then hire some help. And the reason her neighbor has grass and she has mud is because of OVERCROWDING!!!

[QUOTE=Canterbury Court;6507524]

Anyone know what’s happened to Romantic Star? Nice horse and a good producer.[/QUOTE]

This! I have been wondering the same thing since there were no 2013 breedings for him, now I see there is one…

And FYI, this link has made it to FB. Not by me, but it is there now.

[QUOTE=SuperSTB;6507857]
Common in central and southern cali- pipe corrals, limited to no shelter, open ‘mare motels’, pasture is limited because watering is expensive and land is a premium. The further away from cities obviously the larger the ‘pastures’ but almost none are irrigated.

A nice pipe corral is at minimum 24x48. The average I would say is 24x24. Many are kept in 12x12 in the backyards. A ‘large’ residential lot would be 1 acre. I had just over 1 acre and 6-8 horses depending on the rescue situation. Many communities have 1/2 acre lots- deduct house, yard, and toy space and you don’t have much more than a couple stall space to jam in a few horses. Some people can manage this successfully but it won’t work if you are lazy.

Daily exercise is a must when dealing with such small horse keeping space. I used my riding arena as turn-out which I rotated day/night shifts. I also either lunged, walked, or rode horses on a near daily basis. We had bridle paths around the first house I lived in. Just like you would walk your dogs around, we would walk the horses :slight_smile:

Now keep in mind that the weather and temps vary greatly. Coast to desert to mountains, you are looking at way different conditions. I certainly wouldn’t live in Big Bear or Sierras without a barn/fully enclosed cover. Likewise I would prefer shade cover in the high desert from sun where temps reach triple digits. I had an open mare motel at the first place which I installed a misting system. When it was 100+, the misters were on and the horses stayed mostly under shade cover where it would be 10-15 degrees cooler. Heat stress causing colic/laminitis was a BIG concern by most vets, coming in second only to sand colic![/QUOTE]

Jill isn’t in central or southern CA. She’s in northern CA. And I can’t comment for breeders in So- or Central-CA, but in Nor-Cal, there are a lot of breeders and I can’t think of any legitimate breeders who keep their horses in tiny pipe corral lots. Actually, I know a few Central Ca breeders, and they all have lots of land - huge pastures, lots of room or the horses to roam.

It is true, we don’t have water - it isn’t a matter of expense, it is a matter of NO WATER, so part of the year, our pastures are dry (I count on green pastures from Feb through May or June). But we do have land - I know a lot of breeders out here, and we all have multi-acre pastures, generally fenced in either no-climb or electric tape. A few are lucky enough to have irrigation. Our foals grow up with space to roam - of the breeders I know, they are all situated on anywhere between 20 and 100+ acres. In California. Just on my road, there are 3 of us, and two of us are on 90 and 100 acres.

Small “ranchettes” (1 to 5 acres) meet your description, but those are not breeders, they are people who keep a handful of riding horses at home. Most of us have shelters in our pastures and foaling barns as well. Just want to clarify that what you are seeing is not the norm for California.

I think there is enough proof of wrong doings in the form of judgments and warrants and now these pictures from family members that we don’t need to speculate or discuss the condition or care of the horses. The above is reason enough to steer clear even if the horses each had 100 immaculate acres of grass and a stall bedded to the hocks with fresh bedding. Do not do business with this Gray Fox Farm because they are not a reputable business and you are likely to get ripped off as countless others before you have. There was a foal born there two days ago, the mare looked fine. Would I want her to stay there if she was mine? Hell no! But because of the above, not because the mare looked bad.

What a sad and bizarre situation. Such mixed accounts have been provided that it’s hard to know what’s really going on for those of us who have had no direct dealings with Gray Fox, but clearly something is not right with JB or her concept of animal husbandry.

If JB is truly a sociopath (or psychopath, which is the more current, politically correct nomenclature as it implies biological rather than environmental origins for the disorder), sadly there is no treatment and this pattern of behaviour will continue until external influences intervene.

[QUOTE=eagle74;6507566]

http://s1168.photobucket.com/albums/r488/65satellite/#!cpZZ1QQtppZZ28[/QUOTE]

I believe most of the land pictured in these pics is not Jill’s but a neighbors who i believe she leased land from.

Ever consider the source of the original post? The sister-in-law obviously has issues with how her in-laws have helped Jill out financially and makes no bones about it. So if conditions were so bad for the in-laws, why does the SIL wait until now to “rescue” the in-laws? They live in the same town, certainly they’ve been there before and seen the “horrible” conditions. Funny how the timing is so close to Jill purchasing 30+ acres and moving her facility with possible financial help from her parents thus pissing off the SIL who is upset about not getting help herself? Unfortunately in Calif it’s all to common for people to walk away from their homes due to the decline in property values, so Jill certainly isn’t the first. Google Tom Sullivan the Fox News financial guru who makes $5 mil a year as he did the same thing in my neighborhood of Granite Bay.

It’s unfortunate that most of you in your pretentious little circle want to make accusations with only a “claim” that these photo’s are from Jill’s house. I’ve been to the facility, I posted pictures, I will visit again in the next week or so to the new farm and take more pictures. My advice to everyone involved in the discussion is to STFU if you haven’t personnally been to her house!

Yes she has a warrant from 6 years ago, something she should definitely clear! Again, PM me if you would like me to call you, I am not Jill!

I am in Northern California as well, a few notes:

EVERY breeder I know has grass PASTURES for their young horses. No dirt lot little pens. It is not a way to raise a foal. I have kept my horse in grass pastures from Half Moon Bay to Morgan Hill, and they are even easier to find in the north bay… We DO have pasture in CA, not everyone keeps their (especially young!) horses in a 12 x 24 pen.

Every responsible horse owner I know provides SHELTER for their horses. Yes, CA does not have huge extremes, but Petaluma has many days in the upper 90’s, you need to provide some shade. And in the winter, it gets WET and windy. Again, horses need shelter, and even more, they need a place with good drainage, that isn’t going to end up a mud hole that most “dry lots” will.

Sure – there are minimal standards of horse care – and then there is good horse care. They are not the same. The facility which Jill has been using for breeding does not meet the “good” criteria. Just love how she is feeding grain on that sandy looking soil (something to be aware of here in CA!). If your horse was at Jills – check for sand, hate to have one get sand colic.

http://s1168.photobucket.com/albums/r488/65satellite/?action=view&current=781cb62b.jpg

My mother in law is a hoarder. Yes, it is a disease, its terrible for every one affected – but I am NOT going to give Jill a pass for Lying, Cheating and general dishonesty. This lady needs to be run out of the horse business until she gets help. Everyone needs to stop enabling her!!

I have no dog in this fight and have never dealt with Jill nor her farm.

However, I did get curious about the photos posted by our newest member Eagle 74. They are the only ones ever uploaded by that new user on Photobucket and contain a date stamp of 2003.

[QUOTE=eagle74;6508073]
? Unfortunately in Calif it’s all to common for people to walk away from their homes due to the decline in property values, so Jill certainly isn’t the first. [/QUOTE]

Jill has been in a constant state of default on this property throughout the years. She just finally got foreclosed on. The following have liens against her which she has not paid:

Feed store has a judgment
Attorney has a judgment
Veterinarian has a judgment
Trainer has a judgment

Jill is not a normal, choose to walk away foreclosure. She is up to her eyeballs in judgments and burnt bridges.

WHY IS SHE acquiring more horses when she cannot pay off her feed store!?!?!?!?
Stiffing the feed store, vet, and other small business hurts us all.

[QUOTE=Prime Time Rider;6507728]
After viewing the photos you placed on photobucket, how can you state that “there is no evidence of overcrowding”? There isn’t a scrap of grass or shade anywhere, the babies and dams are confined to small dirt pens. How is this not overcrowding? How is having no shelter from the elements (not even a freaking run in shed) acceptable care?

I would never want one of my mares at Jill’s “farm”. Period.[/QUOTE]

The condition of the house and the fact her parents live here is simply heinous, and I’m glad the family stepped in. With regards to the horses, I think you’re being a pretty unreasonable. I suspect you wouldn’t keep any horse at most farms here on the west coast if you think that all pastures have to have grass. Very few horses live on pasture out here this time of year (or even most of the year to be honest. It costs a bloody fortune to attempt to irrigate any kind of acreage). They are supplemented with hay. This is a big difference in the way horses are raised between the coasts. Looking at the photos posted there, the horses look pretty healthy to me, shiny, not underweight. There are some in some paddocks and some in others, hard to say that they’re overcrowded from these shots anyway.

Not defending her or the fact she has got to stop breeding horses so she can manage her house and pay off the people that are owed money. Not to mention I suspect the hoarding/care issues will eventually trickle down to the horses :frowning: But currently, I doubt there is ANY cause for animal control or anything to come in and seize horses as some have suggested, in fact it may be unfair (maybe she will be able to sell some or something to get her house back in order? etc)…sucks all the way around…

Ha! Good catch!

[QUOTE=eagle74;6508073]
Ever consider the source of the original post? The sister-in-law obviously has issues with how her in-laws have helped Jill out financially and makes no bones about it. So if conditions were so bad for the in-laws, why does the SIL wait until now to “rescue” the in-laws? They live in the same town, certainly they’ve been there before and seen the “horrible” conditions. Funny how the timing is so close to Jill purchasing 30+ acres and moving her facility with possible financial help from her parents thus pissing off the SIL who is upset about not getting help herself? Unfortunately in Calif it’s all to common for people to walk away from their homes due to the decline in property values, so Jill certainly isn’t the first. Google Tom Sullivan the Fox News financial guru who makes $5 mil a year as he did the same thing in my neighborhood of Granite Bay.

It’s unfortunate that most of you in your pretentious little circle want to make accusations with only a “claim” that these photo’s are from Jill’s house. I’ve been to the facility, I posted pictures, I will visit again in the next week or so to the new farm and take more pictures. My advice to everyone involved in the discussion is to STFU if you haven’t personnally been to her house!

Yes she has a warrant from 6 years ago, something she should definitely clear! Again, PM me if you would like me to call you, I am not Jill![/QUOTE]

Let’s say we ignore the pictures of the house and all of the “accusations” involved with that.
The fact still remains that Jill Burnell has outstanding warrants.
The fact still remains that we have court documents that Jill owes people money.
The fact still remains that Jill has a foreclosed property and yet still is finding money to purchase more mares.
The fact remains that certain registries will not do business with her due to money owed (this is easily verified by calling those registries and inquiring on registration options for her stallions foals).
Even if we ignore the photos (which is hard to do, considering the party that posted those photos has willingly identified themselves, publicly, with names and phone numbers. More than the Jill supporters have done.) the other facts are easy to document and speak for themselves.
I’m tired of people that I know and respect being ripped off by this person. And I fully expect to be attacked for this post, as the last time I posted something here Jill took the time to track me down on facebook and publicly call one of my horses skinny.

The pictures you posted eagle; were not spectacular pics. Overcrowding and NO shelter for babies- which we know have a hard time regulating their bodily temps. Also, ZERO grass to be found.

http://mckaylaisnotimpressed.tumblr.com/

Mckayla and I are not impressed.

[QUOTE=eagle74;6508073]
Ever consider the source of the original post? The sister-in-law obviously has issues with how her in-laws have helped Jill out financially and makes no bones about it. So if conditions were so bad for the in-laws, why does the SIL wait until now to “rescue” the in-laws? They live in the same town, certainly they’ve been there before and seen the “horrible” conditions. Funny how the timing is so close to Jill purchasing 30+ acres and moving her facility with possible financial help from her parents thus pissing off the SIL who is upset about not getting help herself? Unfortunately in Calif it’s all to common for people to walk away from their homes due to the decline in property values, so Jill certainly isn’t the first. Google Tom Sullivan the Fox News financial guru who makes $5 mil a year as he did the same thing in my neighborhood of Granite Bay.

It’s unfortunate that most of you in your pretentious little circle want to make accusations with only a “claim” that these photo’s are from Jill’s house. I’ve been to the facility, I posted pictures, I will visit again in the next week or so to the new farm and take more pictures. My advice to everyone involved in the discussion is to STFU if you haven’t personnally been to her house!

Yes she has a warrant from 6 years ago, something she should definitely clear! Again, PM me if you would like me to call you, I am not Jill![/QUOTE]

[edit] :mad: get real! The only thing that is sad is that her husband let it get this far! But then again alot of the clutter is his bicycle stuff strewn all over. So much saddness for the parents. Unbelievable! And it is not just a “claim”. Sad sad sad.

Just a reminder to c&p everything ‘not-Jill’ is posting. We all know that alters, house guests, and just random ‘not-me’ posters like to rewrite or erase history.

I have no dog in this fight, but I don’t actually believe this to be true.

I only use GOV or AHS for foals, and I know that ROmantic Star (and maybe one of the others?) is approved for GOV breeding because I looked at him.

And GOV DOES require DNA of foals.

dilligaff2 and Simkie, note the horses/foals in the pics are this years foals,taken shortly before a lot left to MO