Doing business with JILL BURNELL? BEWARE.

At our OHBS/GOV inspection this past weekend, a hunter breeder mentioned that she was thinking of dabbling in the hunter breeding classes. When she talked to her trainer about it, he told her to breed to “that Redwine stallion” so she would get a “black, blingy foal”. She had heard of the GFF situation, but when she tried to tell her trainer about it, he wasn’t interested - said he didn’t care about all that stuff, all he cared about was having a winning horse for the feed and lead classes (yes, that was his description of the hunter breeding classes).

It is going to be tough to counter that kind of mind-set amongst the hunter breeding handlers and trainers.

Hopefully the owners, who are paying the actual bills, will be smarter than they are.

[QUOTE=DownYonder;6552846]
At our OHBS/GOV inspection this past weekend, a hunter breeder mentioned that she was thinking of dabbling in the hunter breeding classes. When she talked to her trainer about it, he told her to breed to “that Redwine stallion” so she would get a “black, blingy foal”. She had heard of the GFF situation, but when she tried to tell her trainer about it, he wasn’t interested - said he didn’t care about all that stuff, all he cared about was having a winning horse for the feed and lead classes (yes, that was his description of the hunter breeding classes).

It is going to be tough to counter that kind of mind-set amongst the hunter breeding handlers and trainers.[/QUOTE]

Those are the kind of people you don’t do business with if all they care about is “breed to xyz so you get a feed and lead baby”

[QUOTE=Lynnwood;6552850]
Those are the kind of people you don’t do business with if all they care about is “breed to xyz so you get a feed and lead baby”[/QUOTE]

Well, to be fair, this particular trainer is primarily a performance person who hasn’t done much with the hunter breeding classes in years past. But he has been exposed more and more to this division in recent years, and apparently become more intrigued by it. So if a regular client wants him to show in these classes, he naturally wants to have something on the end of the line that will win. He has seen enough of these classes in the past year or so to realize that the Redwine foals are doing well in them, plus he is savvy enough to look at USEF rankings - in fact, mentioned the rankings to his client.

[QUOTE=DownYonder;6552866]
Well, to be fair, this particular trainer is primarily a performance person who hasn’t done much with the hunter breeding classes in years past. But he has been exposed more and more to this division in recent years, and apparently become more intrigued by it. So if a regular client wants him to show in these classes, he naturally wants to have something on the end of the line that will win. He has seen enough of these classes in the past year or so to realize that the Redwine foals are doing well in them, plus he is savvy enough to look at USEF rankings - in fact, mentioned the rankings to his client.[/QUOTE]

Yet still was made aware of the situation concerning her unethical / illegal business practices and encouraged his client to use her stallion because winning is more important the the potential risks.

Well, you can’t fix stupid.

I think I’m keeping my Redwine filly for breeding. She’s a beauty and the only one currently very interested in the jumping chute (she’s two). My other idea is to start her, show her some, and do what I’ve always been very against as a breeder: lose her pedigree, change her name, and sell her based upon her own merits. She deserves better than a “burn 'n 'ell” reputation.

[QUOTE=Lynnwood;6552874]
Yet still was made aware of the situation concerning her unethical / illegal business practices and encouraged his client to use her stallion because winning is more important the the potential risks.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I agree. It caused more than a few raised eyebrows amongst the folks that heard the conversation. Let’s just say that particular hunter trainer’s reputation took a big nose-dive that day. Client has been forewarned - as stated, she was already aware of the issues - and she is going in a different direction.

[QUOTE=dianehalpin;6552875]
Well, you can’t fix stupid.

I think I’m keeping my Redwine filly for breeding. She’s a beauty and the only one currently very interested in the jumping chute (she’s two). My other idea is to start her, show her some, and do what I’ve always been very against as a breeder: lose her pedigree, change her name, and sell her based upon her own merits. She deserves better than a “burn 'n 'ell” reputation.[/QUOTE]

So sad that it comes to this, isn’t it?

Your last sentence says it all, though.

[QUOTE=DownYonder;6552846]
She had heard of the GFF situation, but when she tried to tell her trainer about it, he wasn’t interested - said he didn’t care about all that stuff, all he cared about was having a winning horse for the feed and lead classes (yes, that was his description of the hunter breeding classes).

It is going to be tough to counter that kind of mind-set amongst the hunter breeding handlers and trainers.[/QUOTE]

Hopefully, breeders of better moral fiber than this trainer will bitch slap him/her and make it known that there “are” more important things than winning. It’s that attitude that I think really is corrupting the industry :(. Glad to hear the breeder in question is looking elsewhere.

[QUOTE=DownYonder;6552941]
Yes, I agree. It caused more than a few raised eyebrows amongst the folks that heard the conversation. Let’s just say that particular hunter trainer’s reputation took a big nose-dive that day. Client has been forewarned - as stated, she was already aware of the issues - and she is going in a different direction.[/QUOTE]

Best possible scenario then. People learned of Jill and are choosing to stay away AND people were given a glimpse of another trainers lack of morality and can make choices accordingly

[QUOTE=dianehalpin;6552875]
Well, you can’t fix stupid.

I think I’m keeping my Redwine filly for breeding. She’s a beauty and the only one currently very interested in the jumping chute (she’s two). My other idea is to start her, show her some, and do what I’ve always been very against as a breeder: lose her pedigree, change her name, and sell her based upon her own merits. She deserves better than a “burn 'n 'ell” reputation.[/QUOTE]

There is another scenario would be that would best for the stallion and welfare of all the horses owned by GFF and all the offspring entangled in this mess. A court ordered bankruptcy or foreclosure forcing sale of assets (horses). That would remove the horses from the business and hopefully bring a new breeder-owner with a sterling business reputation. Once the stallions, broodmares and foals are owned by others - this whole nightmare will be a thing of the past. And the offspring will not have the taint they now have in some circles.

I’d be really interested to hear what Jill Burnell is up to now, and more importantly, where are the stallions? For a very long time (years?) she had homepage ads on warmbloods-for-sale for her stallions, but recently they have been removed. I can’t find anywhere (at least not the usual places) where she is currently advertising her stallions. No activity on her personal Facebook page, her farm Facebook page or Redwine’s page. Just hoping those boys are okay.

Chalk me up as one of the people who wouldn’t buy offspring from any of her stallion unless I knew for sure that DNA/parentage verification had been done on the horse I was interested in. Wouldn’t buy direct from Jill, regardless, but you can bet I wouldn’t buy any horse produced from that mess unless I knew for sure it was who it was supposed to be!

Well, mine has verified parentage via DNA testing, at least. Dam is by Paparazzo and I suspect that Pilot/Pablo/Paparazzo put the “jump” in my filly.

You know, I’ve always wondered about this…I know virtually nothing about the hunter world, but I did always wonder about Redwine as a jumper sire…traditionally the R-line is not known for it’s jumping ability…:no:

They are big “triers” though, so maybe that does it.

[QUOTE=dianehalpin;6552875]
Well, you can’t fix stupid.

I think I’m keeping my Redwine filly for breeding. She’s a beauty and the only one currently very interested in the jumping chute (she’s two). My other idea is to start her, show her some, and do what I’ve always been very against as a breeder: lose her pedigree, change her name, and sell her based upon her own merits. She deserves better than a “burn 'n 'ell” reputation.[/QUOTE]

I’d buy a nice Redwine filly, as long as not directly from Jill Burnell. Who the breeder was doesn’t impact my purchase decision whatsoever. What I care about is the horse in front of me and if it’s a nice mare with the kind of pedigree I’m looking for and I think she will work in my breeding program, then I buy - strictly based on the mare.

[QUOTE=Hillside H Ranch;6553110]
For a very long time (years?) she had homepage ads on warmbloods-for-sale for her stallions, but recently they have been removed. I can’t find anywhere (at least not the usual places) where she is currently advertising her stallions. No activity on her personal Facebook page, her farm Facebook page or Redwine’s page. Just hoping those boys are okay.[/QUOTE]

The ads are still there.

http://www.warmbloods-for-sale.com/HorseDetail.asp?HorseID=20576&UserID=1793

[QUOTE=COTHalter44;6553683]
The ads are still there.

http://www.warmbloods-for-sale.com/HorseDetail.asp?HorseID=20576&UserID=1793[/QUOTE]

I should have been more clear about that site. The regular ads are still there, but the homepage ads that she’s had for a very long time are no longer running there.

I do hope potential buyers of in utero foals or youngsters understand that it’s not just the health and condition of the foal or youngster when you buy them it’s the nutrition the MARE received during the pregnancy. This affects not only what the outside of the youngster looks like but definitely affects the inside of that youngster for the rest of their life.

[QUOTE=Hillside H Ranch;6553709]
I should have been more clear about that site. The regular ads are still there, but the homepage ads that she’s had for a very long time are no longer running there.[/QUOTE]

Gotcha. I had no idea as I don’t check that site regularly.

If she was smart, she’d sell her stallions now for a good amount of money, and get out. Stallions rep would be saved, and she wouldn’t be walking the walk of shame any more.

It’s too late now to stem this tide of condemnation, that by now obviously has spread like wildfire in the h/j community.

But I am sure she will keep marching on. Pretty hard to downplay something like this, though.