Dress Code for showing - probably dumb question

[Daisyesq]

[QUOTE=Beentheredonethat;8626355]
Yes, I know that’s what the rule says. What I’m trying to say is around here, many wear a polo with a fold over collar, neck open and its fine. The judge mentioned yesterday it was “illegal” and she doesn’t care. I’ve repeatedly asked TD’s when I wear a polo WITH a fold over color and the neck open if it’s OK, and they say yes.

Ah. Found it. Here’s our own TM and photos of the young riders wearing polos with fold down collars and the neck open. https://terrimiller.wordpress.com/tag/najyrc/[/QUOTE]

The photos in your link are misleading and are confusing the whole thread, because OP’s question was what kind of shirt to wear in competition. A jacket is required in competition. Under the jacket the shirt must have either a separate stock tie or choke collar, OR the new rule states that a shirt with an “integrated” stand up collar is fine, too.

The Terri Miller blog explains that in the U.S. sometimes it gets so hot that our show management waives the jacket rule. So she took some photos of the riders without their jackets (where clearly they also changed shirts because white on white does not look as good as dark color polo top). When you show without a jacket, you can wear a polo shirt with an open collar. But you don’t have to.

[2tempe]

[QUOTE=SendenHorse;8625998]
Moutain horse has a nice navy one that isn’t a lot of money.[/QUOTE]

I’ve seen a couple in navy, but I don’t think anything would like right under shadbelly except white. Well, lets say I don’t think a dark shirt will look right under dark coat. I do also have very pale yellow that might be ok.

UGH I’ve never been a fashionista, so anything beyond black and white is out of my ability to evaluate!

[honeylips]

The photos from Teri Miller were an exceptional circumstance. It was a CDI (NAYRC) and run under FEI rules (which can be different than USEF rules). It was blisteringly hot with several kids passing out and being taken away by EMTs. The FEI TD made a decision, at that show, to BAN jackets on that day due to 100+ temps. Furthermore she instructed the teams to wear their breeches and team polo shirts for the competition.

[MysticOakRanch]

So, does anyone get the vibe that our dress rules are a little TOO MUCH? Why can’t we just have a rule that requires a short or long sleeve shirt with collar, jacket or vest, light colored breeches, and tall boots or half chaps? And a safety helmet, of course! Would make life much easier…

[SendenHorse]

[QUOTE=MysticOakRanch;8626836]
So, does anyone get the vibe that our dress rules are a little TOO MUCH? Why can’t we just have a rule that requires a short or long sleeve shirt with collar, jacket or vest, light colored breeches, and tall boots or half chaps? And a safety helmet, of course! Would make life much easier…[/QUOTE]

yeah, my eventing friends have a lot easier time with some aspects.

I’m starting to tire of some of these rules.

I’ll never show in western dressage 100% but the fact some shows allow you to ride in jeans does make it very appealing.

[theresak]

[QUOTE=Beentheredonethat;8626355]
Yes, I know that’s what the rule says. What I’m trying to say is around here, many wear a polo with a fold over collar, neck open and its fine. The judge mentioned yesterday it was “illegal” and she doesn’t care. I’ve repeatedly asked TD’s when I wear a polo WITH a fold over color and the neck open if it’s OK, and they say yes.

Ah. Found it. Here’s our own TM and photos of the young riders wearing polos with fold down collars and the neck open. https://terrimiller.wordpress.com/tag/najyrc/[/QUOTE]

The polo shirts for that NAJYRC was a special case for that championships because it was so hot. I believe it occurred 2 years ago, and they may have made it acceptable again last year. The particular shirts in the link would technically not be acceptable to be worn without a coat because they are not of a single color, wearing a polo shirt of a single color is fine when coats are waived.

But my preference would be to make coats optional for all shows except championships/nationals and make any conservative polo or dress shirt the standard.

[Beentheredonethat]

Yes, I get it. The POINT was I thought the OP meant JUST wearing a shirt since there was no reference to jackets.

I don’t know about everywhere else, but it’s not a big special circumstance to wave coats here. Pretty much if it’s warm at all or anyone asks, they do. Most shows I go to wave coats, and it’s not that warm here. I’d say about half of the people at shows here ride without coats, probably more in the summer. It’s very common.

I think we’re moving, at least nationally, to having coats optional all of the time. Fine by me, and I think most if not alal judges.

[Silverbridge]

[QUOTE=theresak;8626987]
The polo shirts for that NAJYRC was a special case for that championships because it was so hot… The particular shirts in the link would technically not be acceptable to be worn without a coat because they are not of a single color, wearing a polo shirt of a single color is fine when coats are waived.[/QUOTE]

Yikes first it was stated that polos are technically a violation because they have fold down collars. Now it’s that polos are allowed but must be a solid color. This is not a rule either. I think there’s been a conflation between coats being required to be solid, and applying that to shirts.

The rules about attire do seem even more complex when we tack on details about collars and colors and ties, based on assumptions, regions, and traditions-- instead of what’s actually on the USEF page.

Solid color AND multi color polo shirts are not in violation of any rule. People everywhere wear them, and we/they aren’t in some unspoken grey zone of legality when doing so.

[2tempe]

Wow,this has been interesting. All I really wanted was understanding of what an integrated stand up collar is. Got that. Also was wondering if stock ties would go by the wayside if not required or if people would still use them just because.

None of this had to do with jackets,coats being waived, lol. Being in Florida I got that figured out several years ago…

Interesting the comment that we may be moving away from coats all together at some point.

[Silverbridge]

@2tempe;8627557

Also was wondering if stock ties would go by the wayside if not required or if people would still use them just because.

Stock ties are not required. They are one of several neckwear options allowed.

[SendenHorse]

@2tempe;8627557

Also was wondering if stock ties would go by the wayside if not required or if people would still use them just because.

who would choose to wear the stock tie, given the choice? they are sort of awkward, aren’t they?

I’m all for the standup collar. I love my MH shirt- wore it to work under a sweater all winter and got a lot of complements!

[Silverbridge]

[QUOTE=SendenHorse;8627565]
who would choose to wear the stock tie, given the choice? they are sort of awkward, aren’t they?[/QUOTE]

Sigh. People ARE given a choice. Obviously many people choose stock ties, based on tradition and association. They aren’t required, and I don’t know if they ever were.

If they were required it was many, many years ago.

[SendenHorse]

[QUOTE=Silverbridge;8627570]
Sigh. People ARE given a choice. Obviously many people choose stock ties, based on tradition and association. They aren’t required, and I don’t know if they ever were.

If they were required it was many, many years ago.[/QUOTE]

I think they were required in the 90s.

There are some really pretty ones out now, granted!

[theresak]

[QUOTE=Silverbridge;8627414]
Solid color AND multi color polo shirts are not in violation of any rule. People everywhere wear them, and we/they aren’t in some unspoken grey zone of legality when doing so.[/QUOTE]

I’ve asked a TD about specific shirts when coats are waived. The show shirts with the color blocks on the side panels are not technically allowed.

8. In locations with high average heat and humidity on the date of a competition, management can publish in their prize list that jackets will be waived for the duration of the competition. Alternatively, management can announce prior to or during a competition that competitors can show without jackets when extreme heat and/or humidity is forecast. This waiver applies to all classes including FEI classes at National Competitions. However, competitors must wear protective headgear and a shirt with sleeves and collar, without neckwear, and without decoration except as described under .15 below. T-shirts are not permitted.

The without decoration actually applies to both the shirts and the stock ties - decorations allowed are only logos.

ETA - I think depending on your area, the TD, and the judge there is a lot of flexibility on the colors allowed for your shirts if coats are waived. However, if you aren’t totally sure, a solid color shirt is legal without dispute.

[MysticOakRanch]

Well, if wearing a jacket, a choker or stock tie is required - unless wearing a shirt with an integrated stand up collar (that is new). There is an exception for Level 1 shows (small one ring shows), but for anyone showing in Level 2 or larger shows, neckwear is required when wearing a jacket - unless wearing one of those “integrated collars”.

The confusion on solid polos - if you wear a VEST, it must be solid. And if wearing a polo, there is a limit on the size of “logo” you can wear.

And it just goes to show - it is too darn confusing!

[Silverbridge]

Nobody, nowhere, considers color blocking decoration. Scads of navy and white and pink and white and grey and white and black and grey and dark blue and light blue show shirts are being made and sold to dressage riders.

Are you thinking these manufacturers and retailers, and everyone buying and using them are in cahoots, in some sort of ploy that people who want to flout the rules are all “in” on? Or to make money for designers? That it all really depends on the TD’s taste as to whether the multi color shirts are accepted?

I don’t think that is the case.

They’re all made and sold and worn because they’re allowed. That’s for the shirts. There’s nothing about solid ties or solid stock ties anywhere. If there is, please link to that.

[QUOTE=MysticOakRanch;8627669]
Well, if wearing a jacket, a choker or stock tie is required -[/QUOTE]

Better write this guy and tell him he’s technically in violation. No stock tie:

https://www.google.com/search?q=steffen+peters+legolas&biw=1293&bih=786&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjqxp_2pvMAhUGxGMKHYFlBhEQ_AUIBygC#imgrc=PIINZWS_wjyWZM%3A

Or this guy:

https://www.google.com/search?q=jan+ebeling+dressage&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi7qq3i2pvMAhVTzmMKHTY6Cz4Q_AUIBygB&biw=1293&bih=786#imgrc=uISoi1tqSqgAzM%3A

(The rule says stock tie, OR TIE, or choker, or an integrated stand up collar. A TIE is what’s required. A stock tie is not, and I cannot find where it ever has been.)

[AZ_TD]

Here is a short history of the stock tie. It was worn in hunting so it could be used as a bandage for an injured horse or sling for an injured rider:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stock_tie

[Silverbridge]

[QUOTE=AZ TD;8627762]
Here is a short history of the stock tie. It was worn in hunting so it could be used as a bandage for an injured horse or sling for an injured rider.[/QUOTE]

And here, I always thought the inspiration was the British legal system!

https://www.google.com/search?q=british+lawyer&biw=1293&bih=786&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjd36_T5pvMAhVGwGMKHR-7AVIQ_AUIBigB#imgrc=Rmi4g1G75dtLiM%3A

[MysticOakRanch]

Yes, a regular tie is also allowed - my point is that several people were implying no neckware is required - it is required with a jacket unless you have an “integrated” collar. And remember - those pictures are irrelevant, they are showing under FEI rules, not USEF rules. Because we don’t have enough rules to worry about…

[QUOTE=Silverbridge;8627723]
Nobody, nowhere, considers color blocking decoration. Scads of navy and white and pink and white and grey and white and black and grey and dark blue and light blue show shirts are being made and sold to dressage riders.

Are you thinking these manufacturers and retailers, and everyone buying and using them are in cahoots, in some sort of ploy that people who want to flout the rules are all “in” on? Or to make money for designers? That it all really depends on the TD’s taste as to whether the multi color shirts are accepted?

I don’t think that is the case.

They’re all made and sold and worn because they’re allowed. That’s for the shirts. There’s nothing about solid ties or solid stock ties anywhere. If there is, please link to that.

Better write this guy and tell him he’s technically in violation. No stock tie:

https://www.google.com/search?q=steffen+peters+legolas&biw=1293&bih=786&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjqxp_2pvMAhUGxGMKHYFlBhEQ_AUIBygC#imgrc=PIINZWS_wjyWZM%3A

Or this guy:

https://www.google.com/search?q=jan+ebeling+dressage&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi7qq3i2pvMAhVTzmMKHTY6Cz4Q_AUIBygB&biw=1293&bih=786#imgrc=uISoi1tqSqgAzM%3A

(The rule says stock tie, OR TIE, or choker, or an integrated stand up collar. A TIE is what’s required. A stock tie is not, and I cannot find where it ever has been.)[/QUOTE]

[FEIwannabe]

Slightly tangent, but can a woman wear a tie instead of a stock tie if she wanted?