It would be helpful to see up close photos of his feet too. I’m sure others will comment on what they see and thoughts on his movement in the video. I know many feel the Equisec hair analysis is of value. Have you considered doing that?
Did you say you ruled out EPM and Lyme?
And what’s your history with him. How long have you had him and what have you been able to do with him?
By titer, a couple weeks ago yes. Nothing of note.
No, as up until recently I was under the impression it was not possible in full TBs - this one is tattooed and everything. Can that be done without going through the vet, or do I need them to come by if only to rule out PSSM1?
I can do that. FWIW - his feet are great quality, though we have him in 1 and 2 degree wedges up front (done by X-ray) and bare behind. One hind foot has a flare that just won’t correct and we think is an issue higher up (he always stands with it turned out).
I’ve had him almost a decade, he’s not been doing anything in years however due to pervasive back pain and moving around (plus some awful farrier work and his various injuries and lack of time on my end). At one point he was jumping around 2’9" competitively, but somewhere around age 9 we started having issues. He has KS.
Honestly this is my thinking, moreso than soreness. Well, he’s probably sore, too.
Anyways, back on topic:
Is there any harm in DIYing the GA of the MFM pellet just to see? I think I can finagle his diet to mirror the nutrient profile for a fraction of the cost - whether he will eat it is TBD.
The high fat PSSM1 diet is far easier for me to do, but seeing as that’s unlikely I’m leaning this way. I will run it past my vet of course and I’m also compiling a video report for them of my “There’s No Way This Is ‘Just’ Ulcers Can We Please Dig Deeper” presentation - in case anyone thought I was ignoring the other weirdness in him that doesn’t point towards a muscle issue.
My mare was diagnosed 6 months ago via muscle biopsy with PSSM2/MFM. The biopsy was a last ditch effort after working for over a year to figure out what was wrong with her. I posted more details here in this thread
We are currently back working at our previous level 3rd-4th level and while some days aren’t great on the whole, she’s a completely different horse.
Here’s her current management:
Buckeye gro 'n win
KER MFM pellets (crazy expensive but you can replicate w/ individual ingredients)
KER EO-3 oil
KER CoQ10
emcelle liquid vitamin e
spirulina
Jiaogulan
assure guard
Mag-restore magnesium
Santa Cruz B-12 pellets
and hay of course in a slow feeder because she is an air fern!
I’m happy to fill in more on the whole journey…oh and the PSSM2 forum on facebook is great!
My gut feeling after spending way way too many hours researching PSSM and having a horse who DNA tested at 36% European Heavy Horse and moves like the expression you hear about Warmbloods - Dumbloods. Now we know they’re not TRYING to be unresponsive…they just feel like glue is attached everywhere. Or worse. My PSSM horse - mostly pretty slow moving most of the time, stops and acts stuck, reluctant to move - which is a defining criteria for PSSM.
Your guy looks pretty willing and has energy - he just has “other” things going on. That’s my take.
My gut is it’s not PSSM. Kissing spine and foot pain - that’s where I’d put my money.
I think you can get some of the ingredients via Bulk Supplements. That’s where I buy ALCAR. But even starting with another complete protein like whey would be a start towards supplementing the aminos.
KER is a good company to deal with, though, if you want to give that product a try to see if your horse will respond. Because I had fed a little bit of the MFM pellet when I realized my horse couldn’t tolerate it, I couldn’t return it. But I did give it away to another COTH-er to try, and KER gave me store credit for the amount I spent (which I used to buy their HA supplement for a bit).
His spinal pain is significant, however, and that can cause a sort of neuromuscular windup that persists. It’s also why you have trouble correcting his hoof angles. That he has responded to the Gabapentin suggests that a true muscle disease may not be the bulk of his problem. And you have actual diagnosis for at least some of his pain. Did you ever image his neck?
It’s up next. Vet didn’t want to - I think I need to convince her that despite having no need for him to be in any work, I want to figure this out. That’s why I’m getting video. That, or I haul him to VT. There are some things that could be SI damage, but neck issues are high on my list.
I really think this is something else besides PSSM now, but FWIW I finally de-bell booted and de-mucked his feet since I think it was @PaddockWood that asked - and I’m not sure the shoeing is helping. I’m thinking he may get to go back to barefoot if only to save my wallet. Maybe we go to flat pads first, I’ll ask the farrier.
Don’t eat me or my farrier alive please 
- this horse has historically struggled to correct his angles. I’m aware that these pics are not to standard for giving any shoeing advice, I just snapped them when I had a couple seconds.
How long since the last trim, and how many trims has he done on this horse?
Well bless your heart because you clearly are trying to do the right thing. Between the bull nose and underrun heels I’d bet he’s pretty uncomfortable. Could we see the underside too? Really curious.
4 weeks out since the last reset? And he’s done him… I think 4 times. 3 shoeings and one or two barefoot trims.
lol southern me took this SUPER snarky for a second but I’m pretty sure you didn’t mean it that way 
Yeah to be fair, it’s been a fight to fix those for years and with multiple farriers across several states. But yeah I can see about undersides - the pads block almost everything up front. He HAS lost all his good frog up front, though the hinds have widened a lot.
No one answered this so just chiming in; yes, you can test for PSSM1 with UC Davis Animal Genetics lab directly, with just mane/tail hairs pulled with root bulbs attached.
https://vgl.ucdavis.edu/test/pssm1
I have a PSSM1 Morgan mare with minimal symptoms but a sire line with documented P1. American Morgan Horse Association has recently done a small analysis of on-file DNA and concluded P1 is not an issue in Morgans-and yet we do have lines where it is very much prevalent and an issue. Since the association will not make this standard procedure for registration, it’s on owners to be proactive to test and be willing to share the results publicly.
All that to say…even in a low-incidence breed, sending in hairs is inexpensive ($45) and at least would give you peace of mind you’ve ruled one more thing out. I don’t have experience testing in TBs so maybe it truly is a waste of money, I’ll defer to breed experts on that, but wanted to share the testing info.
Good luck with him regardless of the source of his challenges!
I’m so sorry if it comes across that way. My genuine intention was real. We want the best and it’s so frustrating trying to figure out what’s wrong.
And I would add it really is the problem with words and text. You just can’t hear vocal tone or look someone in the eye. It’s why so much goes wrong on the forums. But know I genuinely am here to be thoughtful and help. 
No I knew you didn’t mean it that way! Just made me pause for a second 
Did you say you had xrays of the feet? That looks like a LOT of foot up front.
And I think some of what’s making him look weird in the trotting videos is he clearly prefers the end with the gate. As he goes to the far side he collapses in the inside shoulder to hasten his return to the gate, and then on the way out he’s moving more normally.
It’s hard to say if I see something or not when his shoulders are wiggle worming all over the place. 
By submitting your email, you agree to our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy. You may also receive promotional emails from The Chronicle of the Horse. You can opt out at any time.
For Customers
Company
Terms of Use
