Equine ATTORNEYS! Seller refusing to release horse to shipper! UPDATE: Ransom refused

WWYD? We have receipt of payment and completed bill of sale. Shipper hit bad winter weather which caused a substantial delay in pick up, but less than 24 hours ago, that was understood and ok. Now with horse scheduled to be picked up in the morning, the trailer called to confirm and was told the sale is being voided and not to call back. I have also since been told the same thing.

Seller’s local Sheriff (we are out of state) is willing to assist, but said no guarantee they will release the horse or that it’s even still there. We’re all getting the feeling that a higher offer has been accepted after the fact… All I know is that we’re going to have a heartsick child if we can’t straighten this out.

Is there anyone in SC with knowledge of the laws regarding withholding horses/property who can chime in while I wait for attorney’s office to open in the AM? Where we are, the bill of sale would be sufficient to seize the horse with police assistance, but apparently not so in the seller’s location. ANY HELP APPRECIATED.

Who told you the sale was being voided? You’ve talked to the seller directly? Was there any reason given for not allowing the shipper to get the horse?

Did they cashed your check? Have they reimbursed you already? Will they reimburse you for the cost of hiring a shipper?

If it was me, I would be calling back until I get an answer.

Is there anyway you could show up at the seller’s barn?

Seller told us she is voiding the sale, citing the delays with the trailer. And yes, I have been in regular contact with her to keep her updated on the trailer’s status. She was paid with cash deposited directly to her account, which we have the receipt of.

They are requesting bank info to return the money, and it’s that sudden availability of money that makes us suspect the pony may actually already be gone to a “higher bidder”. No way I could make it 3 states away by morning, though even if I could, I get the feeling it would not be a welcome reception.

I would also be looking up a shark of an attorney.

Ask the seller to explain the problem. Then, I would tell the seller that if the horse is not released to your shipper, she should expect to hear from your attorney and the sheriff.

Get your money back and move on. Yep, it’s totally unfair and the seller is an ass. However, I think a clean break and a life lesson to the child is probably all you can hope for at this point.

Attorneys are costly, this won’t end in a matter of hours even if you do sue. I seem to recall that for some sales contracts, you have three days to back out. So they may be able to wiggle around a lawsuit, anyway.

I feel bad for you and your child.

wow, what sleezebags. So sorry for you and your daughter.
I guess the actions I would take would depend heavily on horse value and budget for lawyers.

No advice, but keep us posted. I would really like to see the good people win on this one.

[QUOTE=Altered39;8533683]
Seller told us she is voiding the sale, citing the delays with the trailer. And yes, I have been in regular contact with her to keep her updated on the trailer’s status. [/QUOTE]

This doesn’t make sense. The horse was yours as soon as she had the money in her hands. Who cares if you don’t get the horse right away? At least, you could have paid board for the extra days your horse stayed there.

Weird.

Maybe they didn’t like the trailer?

, and it’s that sudden availability of money that makes us suspect the pony may actually already be gone to a “higher bidder”.

That doesn’t make more sense. You gave her the money, she doesn’t have “sudden availability of money”… she wants to give you your money back.

I would really try to get more answers but in the end, I would take my money back and leave it at that… (maybe out that person…)

I’m really sorry for you and your kid.

Jingling for your family !

I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, but if they did sell the horse to someone else then I would think you definitely have grounds for at least a lawsuit and possibly a criminal case. You paid for the horse and have a signed bill of sale. If they sold the horse out from under you they were actually selling YOUR property and I believe that would be conversion.

If you have a signed valid bill of sale then the seller (FORMER owner) sold YOUR property and that is illegal. As mentioned earlier I would be hiring an attorney first thing in am and filing suit towards this person. But I’m sure it won’t be cheap. Is the pony worth the time and money to do this? If not then maybe it would be best to give the money back but I would must certainly out the seller in a heartbeat!

Unbelievable

Assuming it is a standard Bill of Sale basically saying say the seller is in receipt of payment in full and transfers 100% interest/ownership in X horse (with a description of the horse preferably) the horse is yours. No Ifs Ands or Buts. I don’t care what state it is located.

The fact that the local Sheriff is willing to get involved speaks volumes. It the horse is not there and or they won’t release it I would bet they will be looking at Theft of Property charges.

You might want to see if there is a way to get a written letter to the shipper that authorizes them as your “agent” to take possession of the horse. Perhaps fax it to the Sheriff’s office?

The only recourse they may have is charge you for the additional board and expenses they incurred due to the delay in picking up. But they can’t be greedy, falls under ‘usual and customary’ standard for the industry and or area. But not something to “make a federal case out of” if they are greedy. Pay it and take the horse. I include pick up date on my Bill of Sale and Purchase and Sale Agreement. After X date a rate of X will be charged until the horse is moved. Must be paid in X. All liability transfers to the Purchaser, buyer upon singing of the Bill of Sale and transfer of title.

I had a jerk do this to me a few years ago with a TB filly. I was following her half brother on the racetrack. He looked to be an “up and comer”. I knew he was going to be entered in a major Graded Stakes race in the near future.

The filly was still on the racetrack but wasn’t much. I called the owner and got his wife explained the nature of my call, she said hold on, I could hear her talking to her husband in the background and him saying “you deal with it”. I made an offer of twice what she was worth at the time. She calls me back after talking with her husband and the except my offer. She gave me the account details to wire payment and the fax number of their trainer, who is their authorized agent to send the Purchase Agreement and Bill of Sale. Wire the money that day, faxed and received the signed documents. Picked up the horse 2 days later. The owner would send send her Jockey Club registration papers by mail.

About a week later her half brother won a major Grade 1 race. Her value increased 10 fold, literately. The next thing I know I get a call from the husband who I have never talked to saying his wife sold me the wrong horse!

My Bill of Sale and Agreements are VERY detailed. "I said buddy BS the horse is mine. The only reason we are having this conversation is because the half brother is a major stakes winner now. Send me the JC registration papers or I’ll see you in court. Kentucky court not Ohio (where he lived). My Bill of Sale stated that Kentucky was the legal venue in case of a dispute.

The guy flipped out and said he was not going to give me the papers. He even went around calling farms and agents in KY trying to sell the filly. I knew because another agent offered her to me! He said said he was on his way to Ohio to look at her. I said you better turn around because she is X farm right here our back yard (Kentucky). You can look at her there if you want and make me an offer.

I had to take the guy to court to get her papers. Open and shut case took about 15 minutes for the judge to look over the paper work. The court directed the Jockey Club to issue new papers to me.

I am not a lawyer but have done a LOT of horse trading over the last 30+ years. The above is only one of a number of BS deals I have been part of. I’ve paid a lot of money for my 'horse law degree".

But in fairness I and others are only working off of one ‘side’ and what has been written.

If I were you I would ask the Sheriff if he knows of local attorney or do a search for one in the area. Based on what has been written and not reviewing the Bill of Sale a widget is a widget. In other words you shouldn’t need an attorney that specializes in Equine law to settle this.

Good luck let us know how it works out.

What does your contract say? When does title pass? If it did when payment was made then you own the horse. If they dispose of your property they are guilty of theft. If the amount is significant it’s felony theft.

Local authorities may or may not consider this a “civil matter.” Call the sheriff after you see what you contract says.

G.

Bill of sale is very simple, but basically states that the seller conveys the title upon the receipt of the funds.

Now we are blaming the fact that she’s had to schedule the farrier and paid her board late because she assumed the horse would be gone by now. If that’s the case, then I should be entitled to quite a bit of back-pay from some of my buyers! I had to sit on the last horse I sold for over a month while the buyers worked out a date they could travel down to pick him up, and I ate it as a professional courtesy #1, but also as the general cost of doing business. At least our delay was beyond our control (weather).

Biggest question that’s bugging me right now is how to file something in another state. I can tell this is going to be a sleepless night.

Where in SC?

So it just keeps getting better. Now seller is claiming the note she wrote at the bottom of the bill of sale (AFTER it was signed by my client and returned) citing the original intended ship date was actually a deadline to pick up the horse, and by failing to do so, client voided the sale herself.

What a shrudey.

Yanno, if I had the money to do so, I’d haul her @$$ to court just to teach her a lesson and make myself feel better, $$ be damned.

If you don’t have the money nor inclination to do so, write it off, call it good, look for another horse. The child will be upset but life is life, he/she won’t melt over it. Feel sorry for the child but it is what it is, except for the money part.

If legal and not going to bite you in the bum, I’d out seller to anyone who would listen.

Not that I’m doubting you, but I’m going on what is written above. :slight_smile:

[QUOTE=Altered39;8533903]
Bill of sale is very simple, but basically states that the seller conveys the title upon the receipt of the funds.[/QUOTE]

So, since she received the funds. The horse was yours.

Now we are blaming the fact that she’s had to schedule the farrier and paid her board late because she assumed the horse would be gone by now.

It was your horse at that time. You are then fully responsible for him, at least for the board.

If there was no way to wait for the farrier to come maybe…
She actually had no business calling the farrier without telling you first sinc it was your horse.

If that’s the case, then I should be entitled to quite a bit of back-pay from some of my buyers! I had to sit on the last horse I sold for over a month while the buyers worked out a date they could travel down to pick him up, and I ate it as a professional courtesy #1, but also as the general cost of doing business. At least our delay was beyond our control (weather).

But that is your problem. Not hers.
It was your horse at the time. She should not have to pay for your board.

Biggest question that’s bugging me right now is how to file something in another state. I can tell this is going to be a sleepless night.

Personnaly, I would not fight it too hard. Either pay whatever she wants (board and farrier) or get your money back.

[QUOTE=Altered39;8533960]
So it just keeps getting better. Now seller is claiming the note she wrote at the bottom of the bill of sale (AFTER it was signed by my client and returned) citing the original intended ship date was actually a deadline to pick up the horse, and by failing to do so, client voided the sale herself.

What a shrudey.[/QUOTE]

One would hope your clients have the copy that they signed to prove there was no such clause.