Yes! Please … we have April and May
There are about 8 weeks for some serious consideration of the Rules Changes and those interested are invited to Area 51. Just send us an email if you’re serious.
We have to prove that we are not just talk and gossip but serious about improving this sport for the benefit of the horses, ponies and are “Dedicated to the Welfare of the NEXT GENERATION”.
I was just wondering what the skating assoication has as far as rules…the one that dealt with Tanya??? Anyone plugged into other sports?
We may be able to “lift” some ideas from other federations who have sucessfully banned athletes from their membership. Skating, baseball and track and field who else???
Anybody else have ideas???
I just found this article which specifically states:
"the USFSA hearing panel said in its announcement that reasonable grounds exist to believe Harding, “while a member of the USFSA, committed an act, made a statement, or engaged in conduct detrimental to the welfare of figure skating and/or failed to exemplify the highest standards of fairness, ethical behavior and good sportsmanship in her relations with others.”
According to the USOC constitution, established by the Amateur Sports Act of 1978, which is U.S. law, the administrative board “shall have final authority with respect to all matters regarding the United States official delegation at the site of the Games including, but not limited to, policy, protocol, discipline and similar matters.”
Washingtonpost.com: Group Begins Disciplinary Action Against Harding http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sports/longterm/olympics1998/history/timeline/articles/time_020694.htm
I think the ruling pertaining to the USOC is VERY interesting!!!
That’s an Excellent precedent
That shows that an NGB can and why. Off hand I’d say the terms are in the Rule Book as it stands but the new Proposals will start a lot of dialog and amplify and interpret them if nothing else.
Send copies of what you find over to Area 51.:yes:
Try a “Lifetime Ban” search
A simple search of my service and many of the headline grabbing Lifetime Bans will appear.
Pete Rose
Ben Johnson
Tonya Harding
Shane Hmiel
Genevieve Jeanson
Richard Strong
Eric Poehlman
Tim Montgomery
Michelle Collins
Anthony Lin
Joseph Zupsic
Martha Stewart
They are lawyers, judges, race car drivers, cyclists, international athletes, national sport figures, TV personalities and stockbrokers…all banned for life.
Another word…ZERO TOLERANCE.
Shame
So why doesn’t the horse industry hold itself up to higher standards?
Now that is a good question
Perhaps! They are living up to the old days when horse dealers were considered scoundrels and worth hanging. You know many of those laws are still on the books and horse stealing in New Jersey is still a Capital Offense worth the death penalty.
Perhaps civilization has not cured the crooked horseman. And just perhaps in this new day and age they are being welcomed back. 
And, perhaps we are here for the purpose of cleaning these maggots out of this sport for the children who have yet to grow up and to keep those children and their children safe.
New thots generated today…
Tonya Harding was removed from skating for violating the code of ethics for the NGB.
Her ex hubby and body guard were interviewed.
Tonya may have not been charged with a crime…certainly not a felony…
if she did a similar thing in the USEF…would we have a code of ethics to enforce???
Tonya Harding was an outsider not a club member!
Yes! There are rules that would probably be enforced since she didn’t fit the mold. The problem is the current rules are so loose they can be used when wanted and avoided when necessary for those people who belong to the club. :yes:
We’ve all seen pages of enforced penalties utilized against those who are not politically correct. Yet, others are ignored. Pwynnnorman on another thread spoke of communication. It has been five years at least since we asked for the IT people to put up a searcg engine for all violators of the rules so we could check and see how many times someone was penalized for a non-negotiable payment or a violation of the drug rules.
I think on another thread some referred to a conviction for negligence in care of a horse and yet that same person was selected as “Horseman of the Year” that very year.
There is a reason why the law requires that definitions of terms and conditions need to be specific and measurable. The flaw is we have have not demanded that criteria be properly described and equally enforced. :yes:
Does the USEF have a CODE of ETHICS?
Actually Snowbird… Tonya was a member of the USFSA- the NGB of skating. The USFSA has the same relationship to USOC as does the USEF ( except we don’t make the horses wear skates).
In repsonse to the Kerrigan attack, the USFSA hearing panel met and made the ruling that “while(Harding) a member of the USFSA, committed an act, made a statement, or engaged in conduct detrimental to the welfare of figure skating and/or failed to exemplify the highest standards of fairness, ethical behavior and good sportsmanship in her relations with others.”
This triggered the USOC hearing which quickly ruled and she lost the right to compete in the Winter Olympics of 1994. The attack on Nancy Kerrigan was January 6. The hearing was held on Feb 4th and the Olympic competition in Lilihammer Norway was held Feb 23 and 25th. That was fast action!
According to the USFSA panel …At the heart of the matter is the issue of following the corresponding codes of conduct and ethics as a member of the USFSA and U.S. Olympic team.
Col. Ken Schweitzer, a panel member and director of athletics at the U.S. Air Force Academy, said the decision came down to right or wrong.
“In the game of sport and the game of life, I think we try continually to do what’s right,” Schweitzer said. "We tried to do that. We tried to do the right things for the right reasons. As we looked at the evidence in this case and compared it … not everything was right.
It would be a similar scenario if we had a code of ethics…for our competitors and trainers. SO I ask do we???
FYI
The USEF The National Governing Body(NGB) for the Equestrian Sport by virtue of their application dated April 1,2003 agreed to align with the USOC aka The U.S. Olympic Committee. “The U.S. Olympic Committee is a federally chartered non-profit corporation accountable to the American people and Congress.”
We do!
It is written into the rules as violations to be not in the best interests of the sport or the Federation. The difference is the willingness to implement because of who they are and their acceptance by those who have the right to have an opinion. We are ruled by fear and trepidation and not by what is the right thing. A law suit from a felon is more serious than the opinion of the membership it seems.
Rehabilitation
What I am reading is that nobody wants to give any room for any rehabilitation. Whatever the outcome from the Courts, as far as I am concerned, the USEF is going to have to decide whether or not these men are a “threat” to the integrity of the ENTIRE association. They both have restrictions on their probation, and I really don’t see the harm in allowing them to move on with their lives. When is enough, Enough. JMO
By the way, has either one of them been sited, lately?
JMHO
JMHO, probation restrictions will not stop these guys… it just means when they get caught they will be in trouble. I do think what they have done has already threatened the integrity of the entire federation.
I’m all for rehabilitation, just in another sport that does not have anything to do with animals that have 4 legs!!
Giddy up!
The Offense- Conspiracy to commit fraud and swindle of livestock in interstate commerce.
I’m not sure there is a self-help group to meet with them!
Josh and Keg pled guilty to one of the more than 70 Federal charges avoiding a full blown Federal Court Trial… As I understand it…these were charges with only three of their victims.
RNB you have a list of those charges?
I’m all for them moving on…
surely they have some new (non horse) skills from their incarceration in Federal Prison.
BTW…Who is trolling today??
J&K HSA
What, noone has started Horse Swindlers Annonymous yet??? 
12 or Six step?
Would that be a short cut six step program instead of the usual 12 step?
Where would they meet since J & K are not allowed around horses?
My bad, Keg is allowed to groom the one horse his Momma has.
You know when someone declares bankruptcy…it takes a long time for them to be considered credit worthy. In this case…it goes far beyond dollars and credit…it is a case of moral and ethical bankruptcy.
Remember there are more victims that have not taken them to task for their actions. There are still kids out there that suffered for years due to the actions of these boys…in ways that felons would not have the capacity to understand.
Enough IS enough
It is not the “integrity” of the association in question but the fact that these two individuals lack any. No one wants them to MOVE on with their lives more than I however with the track record they have set for the past 10+ years I am skeptical as to if that is possible.
Had this just been only one or two instances then you would have a valid point, but this was not the case. The federal court documents list only 4 restitution victims but the vastness of their ill doings is over whelming. None of which is hearsay since numerous other victims have had their statements and letters entered into the court records, all of which can be obtained through the clerks office in Richmond. By pleading guilty to the most severe charge they avoided a trial with 70+ additional charges. Again, this was only for 4 of the victims.
You ask, when is enough, enough? I think that question was answered a few years ago when a group honest, hardworking, caring parents, trainers and other dedicated horse people decided to ban together and do something to stop such criminal activity in the horse industry. I may be the spokesman for the group but make no mistake we are huge in number. I have never hid behind a cloak of secrecy or a screen name. Quite the opposite as I have become very vocal on this topic. I challenge you to show me when any remorse was shown for any of the kids, persons or horses left devastated by their actions.
Debbie Hanson
Even though you may never hear it from Josh Cardine and Keg Berlin, I am very very sorry for each and everyone of you that have had to battle these guys…
I could not imagine what you all went through…
It is a tragedy as well for the fine horses that may have been abused…
or neglected and never had a chance to find out how good they might have been. The children who lost their ponies and had nightmares dreaming about them suffered as well.
The real message though is from the Court that ruled they should never be allowed to participate again where other new inexperienced people can get hurt and their lorses lost. What are we going to do so that this “Never Happens Again”.
These victims bit the bullet and won their case; set legal precedents so what are we going to do besides applaud. 
Never take the status quo as the last answer
'That’s the way we’ve always done it…" Does that sound like our industry?
I think we need to visit the 21st century…I’d like to see reforms that bring about clear standards for passing the ownership of a horse. Mirco chipping with scanners at shows,sales and auctions to positively ID the horse, age, division and owner…would be a big step to cleaning up the deceit.
While we’re at it… registering agents such as commissioned sales people. Take the secrecy out of the transfer…everyone on the same page…buyer/seller/agent. That would have eliminated MOST of the shady dealings of our boys (and others) …just one way to keep the industry clean.
I would support a standard ID of every horse born or brought into the US. Transfers would have the same kind of exchange as a title of a car…notarized and all!!! Just MHO.
Oh and collect taxes on the income!! ( Pulling on my flame retardant suit )
I’ve got my flame suit on as well and I vote for the microchipping!!!
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