wish i was closer.i would love to go down and loadup said beastie:)
i am an agent and buy and sell a lot of horses in florida and the surrounding states. this is the most crap i have ever heard of. these people are reselling this horse for a huge profit down here right now. the market is starting to pickup with all the show people coming into town. if i was you/your friend i would say money today by wire transfer(takes 15 minutes, i know, do it all the time!)or horse is on a van by the end of today. no if and or buts about it. they have had the horse for plenty of time, there have been shows in that area since they got the horse, why have they not already taken him to one of those? there are shows every weekend down here now and have been since nov. these people are going to steal this horse right out from under your friends nose, she needs to stand up for herself and do something. and i mean now! i understand she needs the money, but she is never going to see any if she does not do something quickly!
the only itty bitty bit of good news…
hydrocodone works GREAT! :winkgrin:
as far as the rest of it, though… :sigh:
I’m not even sure I can continue to read this thread because it makes me so frustrated.
Maybe the “buyers” are going to flip the horse, but I think another poster’s analysis is probably closer to the mark: They’re going to take him to the horse show, then arrange a “vetting” which the horse will conveniently “fail” and then these wretched people will start wringing their hands and saying things like, “Oh, we really like him, but we can’t pay $x for him when he has this horrible physical problem that we didn’t know about. So, we’d be willing to pay $x-something slightly smaller than x, or else we’ll ship him home. So Sorry [not].”
And then they’ll keep him for a second horse show anyway before they put him on the trailer without asking permission. The horse will show up at home footsore (at best) or downright lame or worse.
Gak.
Wow. I don’t think I’ve ever heard of such a mess! :eek:
I’ve been asked several times to let horses (that I represent for sale) go on trial and have always said a polite but firm ‘no’. Buyers are welcome to come and ride the horse multiple times, bring their trainer, etc. but letting them off the property is just so risky - potential injury, bad training, non-payment, liability…it’s just not worth it. I may have lost some sales that way, but after reading this thread, I realize that my gut was right when it told me to stand firm.
I truely hope things work out - but it’s time to get tough with these people. They have had more than enough time. I can’t believe that no one down there (trainer, etc) is standing up for the seller. Does kind of make you think that there may be something else going on… my opinion, don’t even offer a lease - demand a full commitment/payment for the horse (at the price agreed on when he left her farm - she potentially wouldn’t have even let him leave for a lower price) or he is going home - at their expense - immediately. This horse was not for lease, he was for sale. What is there to lose? The sale not going through? If these people aren’t in love w/ him by now, it won’t happen anyway - and in the meantime, she’s risking him becoming less saleable by the day due to bad training, care, etc. She still owns this guy, so the control over this situation is still hers, don’t let her forget that. Good luck!!!
Ok, I am not far from Wellington, PLEASE can I go check on the horse??? Pretty please??? <Mwuuuuhahahahahahaaa> Just tell me where he is supposed to be and I’m there! PM me if you need to…
I just called her and said “You’re NOT going to like this, but sit down, shut up and listen to me.”
I then relayed every horror story or potential for horror story you guys have sent this way and told her that I have had MANY offers to have someone go check on the horse and we could send someone as an “agent” for her to make sure the horse was where it was supposed to be and whatnot.
Anyway, I guess shes supposed to talk to them this evening and I told her she needs to absolutely lay the smack down on them and insist on at least partial payment NOW. She said she’d call me later and let me know how its going and decide whether to send a COTHer out there. (Which, by the way, is so incredibly generous of all of you to offer- I know how busy I am in a day, I can’t imagine someone graciously giving up their time to go check on some random, less-than-intelligent-person’s horse in FL.)
I also told her to call her trainer up in IL and read her the riot act about her daughter and see if she has anything to say about the run around that shes getting.
Hopefully an update to come after that.
OH, and apparently the original, settled upon cost (x) was $1000 more than what I thought- so the "we’ll give you “thismuch” right now was acutally FIFTEEN HUNDRED DOLLARS less than the agreed upon price.
WHY OH WHY ISN’T THIS HORSE ON THE TRAILER RIGHT NOW?!
Do you think that she would have even agreed to send him down there for the price that they are offering now?
This is my choice…since this is a so called “Pro” (and I use the term in the loosest possible way) I would give you 50-1 the horse is being tried by others and may not even be on the property. They are flipping it and trying to get it done as cheaply as possible.
Think about it-they cannot afford the purchase but want to go pay for a show. Hmmm…wonder what the REAL price they are getting for the horse is and how much they are going to pocket?
Friend needs to knock the rocks out of her head, just say NO to the show and stop letting these con artists and liars jerk her around.
WE TOLD HER THIS WOULD HAPPEN.
It’s going to get worse too…the next step is “OH WAIT FOR THE TAX REFUND”.
[QUOTE=WarmbloodColor;2914676]
Do you think that she would have even agreed to send him down there for the price that they are offering now?[/QUOTE]
No. And, she is, in fact, quite insulted by the counter offer.
And she doesn’t even know if the horse has been vetted yet…
Trust me this is exactly what they are doing!! Sadly, I know from first hand experience and ditto to everything findeight said!!!
Also, since this horse has crossed state lines, the Dept of Justice considers this type of deal ‘illegal’…and yep, know about this first hand too!!! Same exact thing happened to me!!
Did I miss something? Whatever happened to the check these people sent her? Did she not deposit or cash it, ever?
This girl needs to grow a spine, either get her horse back or cash wired to her account. Yesterday. I would take up those kind offers from Florida COTHers who have offered to check up on the horse.
This is why I would NEVER let a horse out of my sight on trial. EVER.
Yep, she needs to stand firm by the agreement (and price) that was made when he left her hands (she did have a contract, correct?). She doesn’t have to do anything that these people have suggested after that… That was the arrangement or he wouldn’t have left, period. They don’t like it, too bad - the horse is going home. These people need to be expected to behave like adults and either honor what they agreed to or lose their toy.
[QUOTE=WarmbloodColor;2914707]
Yep, she needs to stand firm by the agreement (and price) that was made when he left her hands (she did have a contract, correct?). She doesn’t have to do anything that these people have suggested after that… That was the arrangement or he wouldn’t have left, period. They don’t like it, too bad - the horse is going home. These people need to be expected to behave like adults and either honor what they agreed to or lose their toy.[/QUOTE]
You know, I sure think she had a contract, she told me she did, and theres no way our trainer at school (totally unrelated) would have let her send the horse without one… but really, how much does a contract drawn up by a 22 year old hold up? Even if signed and notarized by both parties?
She’s of legal age, doesn’t matter if she’s 18 or 58. I’ve been following this thread and I am just in shock that she is taking it up the tailpipe like she is. They’ve changed his name, feed, supplements, had him for the full trial period and with NO money given, lowballing her on price and now they want to take him to another show?? Excuse me but F*** NO. I agree with the others who say she needs to have a lil chat with them tonight and tell them either the money gets wired tomorrow (and SHE sets the price, not them), or the horse is on a trailer TOMORROW. … or she calls the authorities for theft. These folks are jerking her around and only God knows what is happening to her horse. He may be injured and they don’t want her to know. I’d be paranoid as all get out. But then I would have never, ever sent a horse down for a trial period so far away. I hope the horse is okay, and I’d definitely take up the offers from one of the COTH’rs down there to go check up on the horse. I’d be heartily suspicious that the horse is being flipped too. She needs to put her foot in their proverbial backsides and either get the money or her horse back.
Friend is in a position to be held liable if horse gets hurt or hurts somebody at that upcoming show. There is NO WAY it should go there without a specific release of liability signed by whever is going to be signing that entry form as responsible party-and Lord knows who that may actually be as I doubt that horse is where it is supposed to be.
Time to put an end to this con game. Or continue being just another mark and getting screwed.
It won’t stop unless friend steps in and stops it. She has been lied to from the get go and is beyond help if she thinks that’s going to change.
Problem is, we know who suffers most in these shady dealings-the HORSE that is not where it is supposed to be and the naive owner who never sees horse again and never gets paid for it but can get a bill for damages or vet work.
Has to stop.
at this point I doubt if she’ll ever see her horse or her money. The horse - with who knows what name - will have a so-sorry bout of colic in a few weeks, die a tragic death… and another plain bay, adequate horse with a unremarkable name will show up in a stall somewhere.
She wanted to get rid of her horse … she has. (Sorry, I’m not feeling very sympathetic to her at this point. She wanted money and isn’t even getting that. Poor horse…)
She has a check in hand. If I’m not mistaken, that is a form of contract. They agreed to buy the horse at the price on the check. Has she tried to cash the check? You can’t send someone a check knowing it’s not good or knowing you are going to put a stop payment.
She is being jerked around. I mean really! They sent her a check and are now negotiating? Deposit the check. When it comes back ISF, she can then sue them for the money. Unless, of course, she wants the horse back. But that check stamped ISF would hold up in court. She could also get her fees for the bounced check.
I don’t think she’s actually ever received a check… even tho’ she suggested to epona that she had. Didn’t she later backtrack on that claim?
ETA … post #373 from epona
(She did tell me she had a check in her hand… I guess she lied or they were going to wire it or whatever…)
Eponacowgirl, back when your friend was making negotiations, this exchange took place:
[QUOTE=eponacowgirl;2814961]
First the buyer called (on Friday evening) and said they’d taken out insurance and shipper would be coming to pick up horse on Monday, they’d like to keep him until January 15 so daughter could show him and see how they do. And, oh, we DID agree on a price that is 3000 less than your asking price, right?
She called back and said “No, I’m asking X, and there is NO WAY I can have this horse ready to ship on MONDAY. And NO, you cannot keep the horse for a month and half, ride it, show it, see how it places and then decide.”
Trainer calls “What do you mean you want X for the horse, you told me X-$3000 and you owe me a commission, BTW.” Friend tells trainer “No, price I gave you was what I had to have when YOU were selling the horse and anything you added on was yours. Thank you, deal is off.”
Buyer calls back “Please, please, PLEASE let us try to work something out.” Friend tells buyer that she’ll take X-$1500, good middle of ground, is what she wanted for the horse originally. Buyer says “We’ll pay that if you pay for half of shipping.” Friend laughs and says “No way, deal is off.” Friend contacts classmate who’s parents are professional haulers and gets quoted shipping that is nearly half. Friend calls buyer and says “I found a shipper who is nearly half, here’s the number, do what you’d like with it.”
Evidently, they always wanted the horse until January 15, and they got it. It would be interesting to know why that date is important.
Also, in the above interchange, it looks like “buyer” called with very low price offer (friend refused), then “trainer” called to aggressively push friend on very low price, then “buyer” called, begging nicely for a less extreme low price, which buyer then accepted. That looks rather like an organized plan.
Are “the buyers” paying (or did they pay with the check they sent) the low price that they originally said they would pay? I’m lost with the $(x-y) designations.
It would be ironic if this same horse has been sold and resold more than once by this mother-daughter training team, since you say mother found horse for friend.
Are they really mother and daughter?
This being the Internet, we can’t verify that anyone or anything is who or what they say they are. It may be that nothing in this story is as it sounds… but it sure is fun to read!
If anyone from COTH gets involved IRL, though, they should be careful and keep their common sense about them… anyone getting involved in real life will not be acting in secret, their arrival on the scene will almost certainly be expected, since it is being discussed here.
If anything, I think this thread should stick around with the title of “How NOT to sell your horse.”
This is stupid. I’ll go pick him up myself.
