George Morris on the SS list

[mvp]

Who is Duncan? How did you guys go from Duncan to DM without naming a last name?

I can think of one pro in California with those initials.

[Midge]

@mvp

Who is Duncan? How did you guys go from Duncan to DM without naming a last name?

I can think of one pro in California with those initials.

@TheMoo

Well Duncan Macintosh believes they should use restorative justice instead and banning kiddie diddlers is barbaric and archaic.

[anon6923113]

@rah - That’s really kind of you and I appreciate it.

I’ve been through some challenges, but have also been blessed to have had some really wonderful people in my life that have helped very much. And I’m a voracious reader and have been fortunate to have had years of therapy. It has helped me greatly.

[ASB_Stars]

So, Talking about George, what is George going to do with the rest of his life? Who can he hang out with? Who’s horses can he ride? I realize that he’s in his 80s but just out of curiosity what will George his life be like now?

[mvp]

@Midge

Thank you! I missed that. And I appreciate the correction of the mistake I had made in my mind. This is not the Duncan I was thinking of.

[skydy]

Duncan Forsyth Mc Intosh? From California? If so, he is a current active pro member of USEF who’s Safe Sport training expires in February.

[Jenerationx]

@Virginia Horse Mom I can’t like your post enough. I mean, not liking what you went through because those of us that have had similar experiences know the anguish, but you said everything I wanted to say in a well written post.

When someone is abused and then their feelings and experiences are marginalized, it has very complicated consequences.

[anon6923113]

@skydy

Duncan Forsyth Mc Intosh? From California? If so, he is a current active pro member of USEF who’s Safe Sport training expires in February.

Yup.

It’s discouraging though to see someone go through this training, check all the required boxes in order to maintain their membership and continue coaching kids… and then freely and publicly post this sort of stuff on an industry article on Social Media.

Of course many sports are going through a “transition” period at present… but I am truly baffled by some of the stuff people who make a living as “professionals” who coach others… including other people’s kids… go on Facebook and put in writing.

If nothing else, you would think they would realize this is not good for business. Unreal.

[Jenerationx]

@LexInVA

I won’t speak for Duncan’s wife, but one of the (sad and disturbing) phenomenon that we see with some abuse victims is that they (consciously or unconsciously) seek out partners - either long-term or short-term - who are similar or identical in many ways to their abuser, using that person to act as a placeholder (or replacement) for their abuser. I’ve seen it firsthand, with a few women I’ve met over the years who were abused or exploited, either as children or adults and openly admitted to being abused or exploited. Perhaps that is what happened with her.

That is my fear, that the abused has found someone very like minded to their abuser and the cycle will continue.

[Jenerationx]

@Virginia Horse Mom

It’s discouraging though to see someone go through this training, check all the required boxes in order to maintain their membership and continue coaching kids… and then freely and publicly post this sort of stuff on an industry article on Social Media.

Of course many sports are going through a “transition” period at present… but I am truly baffled by some of the stuff people who make a living as “professionals” who coach others… including other people’s kids… go on Facebook and put in writing.

If nothing else, you would think they would realize this is not good for business. Unreal.

I wish that were an actionable offense at this point. It makes the entire sport look like a heinous child predator ring between the bans and a lot of the community publicly supporting the pedos.

[anon6923113]

@Jenerationx

I wish that were an actionable offense at this point. It makes the entire sport look like a heinous child predator ring between the bans and a lot of the community publicly supporting the pedos.

I hear you. I’ve decided to share some specific public comments from a few individuals on these threads, because in many ways, sunlight is the best disinfectant.

And folks who choose to publicly support the anti Safe Sport clique of professionals… frankly clients and ammy riders, etc… hopefully some of the statements highlighted on these threads will cause you to take a good look around, and consider taking your money to a different pro. Someone who… you know… acts professionally. And doesn’t openly seek “equity” for coaches who molest minors.

[YankeeDuchess]

@Virginia Horse Mom

I hear you. I’ve decided to share some specific public comments from a few individuals on these threads, because in many ways, sunlight is the best disinfectant.

And folks who choose to publicly support the anti Safe Sport clique of professionals… frankly clients and ammy riders, etc… hopefully some of the statements highlighted on these threads will cause you to take a good look around, and consider taking your money to a different pro. Someone who… you know… acts professionally. And doesn’t openly seek “equity” for coaches who molest minors.

“Sunlight is the best disinfectant” is one of my favorite aphorisms.

 Another favorite is “Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement.”

[YankeeDuchess]

One of the least objectionable suggestions for reform by DC is that SS and/or USEF post a statement that “Being listed on the ‘interim suspension’ list while the investigation is underway does not imply a finding of guilt.”

Well, duh, an interim suspension while the investigation proceeds by definition does not mean that a finding of guilt has occurred yet. But no harm in making it redundantly clear.

While we’re trying to be extra clear, perhaps also post that interim suspensions are only imposed in the 2% of cases in which SS has reason to think there is danger of ongoing harm.

Perhaps the most objectionable “suggestion” is the complete “exchange” of information. Huh? What is being exchanged? SS is supposed to unilaterally strip confidentiality from witnesses and reporters so the respondent and icky supporters can intimidate and shame them?

I think the A for E in S is only clamoring for a full dump of all information because they know they won’t get it. They do not want the sordid details of their heroes’ crimes out in public. In the RG case, a lot of people seemed to actually believe the myth of “one girl, 17.5 years old when he was 20” and kept demanding details until 4 or 5 victims came forward publicly, which they should not have had to do. Once they got (some of) the details they had been demanding, some of the anti SS people actually shut up for a while.

[Sswor]

@Virginia Horse Mom

@LexInVA
I will state with respect to my own personal experience… being molested as a child, and then having my own parents pressure me to essentially recant my accusation against another family member, go to counseling and then confirm to my parents and the counselor that I was “fine” and had no need to talk about anything ever again because it probably was just a minor misunderstanding… and completely bury the experience and carry on with life as a minor living in a household while still in close contact with the person who did actually molest me… it did SERIOUS damage to my self esteem.

When a child gets the message that bad things, and deeply inappropriate sexual things that cross fundamental boundaries can happen in relationships with family or trusted adults, and they need to try and handle it and keep quiet in order for people (like their parents, siblings, coaches, and close friends) to continue accepting them and maintain a loving, caring and close connection…

It’s a dangerous lesson that gets carried forward into adulthood.

You are absolutely right. This is true of physical abuse as well. If your father beats you and your mother doesn’t protect you, worse, scolds you and tells you afterward to apologize to him for making him angry at you, you learn that men who love you hurt you sometimes when you are bad. And you vow to try so hard to stop being bad but you keep being bad without realizing it because it keeps happening so you start to think you are just naturally a bad person and deserve the beatings. This sets you up to accept abuse from partner/spouse as a normal part of being loved. Worse, you seek it out because the familiar pattern is comforting.

[Horsegirl_s_Mom]

@YankeeDuchess

Perhaps the most objectionable “suggestion” is the complete “exchange” of information. Huh? What is being exchanged? SS is supposed to unilaterally strip confidentiality from witnesses and reporters so the respondent and icky supporters can intimidate and shame them?

I’m a little surprised to see you apparently arguing that it should be possible to sanction an individual without telling them the evidence against them. Your past posts have been so thoughtful and evinced such an educated understanding of fairness and Rawlsian analysis… I feel sure my eyes now deceive me.

Please, please reassure me that I have misunderstood your post. Please tell me you are not endorsing a situation where SafeSport bans someone for life and tells them, “2 people came forward and said you did something really terrible approximately 3 years ago! But we’re not going to tell you who they are or what you are alleged to have done!”

I guess I can at least take solace in knowing that no JAMS arbitrator would ever find this appropriate.

[YankeeDuchess]

@Horsegirl's Mom

I’m a little surprised to see you apparently arguing that it should be possible to sanction an individual without telling them the evidence against them. Your past posts have been so thoughtful and evinced such an educated understanding of fairness and Rawlsian analysis… I feel sure my eyes now deceive me.

Please, please reassure me that I have misunderstood your post. Please tell me you are not endorsing a situation where SafeSport bans someone for life and tells them, “2 people came forward and said you did something really terrible approximately 3 years ago! But we’re not going to tell you who they are or what you are alleged to have done!”

I guess I can at least take solace in knowing that no JAMS arbitrator would ever find this appropriate.

     I was assuming that the “complete exchange of information” demanded by DC referred to making all the details of the investigation public. 

     Obviously the respondent needs all the information.

[Horsegirl_s_Mom]

@YankeeDuchess

I was assuming that the “complete exchange of information” demanded by DC referred to making all the details of the investigation public.

Obviously the respondent needs all the information.

Ah, well that’s a relief. I read “exchange of information” to mean that the parties (Safesport and respondent) exchange the information/evidence each of them will be relying on, akin to civil discovery.

The public and reporters would not have anything to “exchange,” so I don’t think whoever you were quoting was referring to them. But of course it would be nice if they were more precise in their communications.

[roseymare]

@Horsegirl's Mom

Ah, well that’s a relief. I read “exchange of information” to mean that the parties (Safesport and respondent) exchange the information/evidence each of them will be relying on, akin to civil discovery.

The public and reporters would not have anything to “exchange,” so I don’t think whoever you were quoting was referring to them. But of course it would be nice if they were more precise in their communications.

I don’t know-many people on social media were clamoring that they needed to know the accusers and their stories. So it isn’t a stretch to wonder if that is what the letter of the Equity group is asking for.

[ladyj79]

@roseymare

I don’t know-many people on social media were clamoring that they needed to know the accusers and their stories. So it isn’t a stretch to wonder if that is what the letter of the Equity group is asking for.

I believe that is what they are asking for. Because they’re ghouls.

[Horsegirl_s_Mom]

@ladyj79

I believe that is what they are asking for. Because they’re ghouls.

Do you have evidence for that? Or are you just choosing to assume the worst of this Diane Carney person?