Goldendoodle Breeder Recommendations

[Cascades]

[QUOTE=fordtraktor;8538930]
I don’t get paying high prices for mutts either.

I do have to giggle at the disdain at the concern for their “structural problems” as if they have any real job other than being a dog. Nine of my mutt dogs have had good conformation. Who gives a crap? My current dog has a ridicules snuggle tooth, crooked legs, was grossly obese when I adopted him. Whatever, he had a good temperament. He is a dog, not a show jumper. His job is to toddle along at my heels and sleep.[/QUOTE]

Some people do more with their dogs. For example, I take my dog running and hiking and backpacking. If my dog were not physically capable of doing those things due to unsoundness, that would be a problem for me and my dog.

Also, there is something to be said for not knowingly bringing life into the world that will experience chronic pain due to structural dysfunction.

[Sswor]

I assume the doodle popularity (labra/golden/cocka/malti/etc) people like everything about poodles except what they look like. I know the service dog people look to add the golden or Lab for substance to the poodle’s lower allergy/lower shedding coat. Service dogs need to have some strength and sturdiness to their frames and Poodles are a bit delicate for brace work.

I like my cross because it adds a ‘homing beacon’ to a small, spotted, high drive terrier. That’s why I prefer it to either purebred and it’s perfect for my needs.

[Sswor]

[QUOTE=Cascades;8538963]
Some people do more with their dogs. For example, I take my dog running and hiking and backpacking. If my dog were not physically capable of doing those things due to unsoundness, that would be a problem for me and my dog. [/QUOTE]

Agreed. There are different kinds of dogs for different kinds of people. Purebred or not doesn’t make a difference unless you want to compete in the breed ring. Purebred does not equate to soundness.

@Cascades;8538963

Also, there is something to be said for not knowingly bringing life into the world that will experience chronic pain due to structural dysfunction.

Sort of like all those purebreds with overheating problems due to their shortened and upturned faces? Bulldogs who can’t give birth naturally? GSD frog dogs?

[fordtraktor]

Sure, cascades, I get not supporting poor breeders, of course, but none of that has anything to do with mutt dogs got from the pound. Purebred are another matter whatever their issues. I don’t, however, have anything to do with supporting anyone bringing any dogs into the world, good or bad.

My dogs have not come from their breeders at all so I haven’t given any breeder any support.

I am sure you could find plenty of dogs at the pound capable of going hiking. “Hybrid vigor” is a thing. If you want a dog to do that, you could find either a purebred or a pound dog to do it. I don’t really care. Whatever you want. But there is nothing really wrong with having a small dog with crooked legs if you have no desire to hike with it, just because it isn’t breed standard. That’s all I mean. I don’t want to hike with mine so I don’t care about its legs. I have kids–I care about its temperament.

ETA: of course, issues that are going to cause serious health concerns, that is different. And you shouldn’t ask a lot out of a dog with conformation concerns, just like a horse. They won’t hold up. But if everyone went to the pound looking for only conformationally correct dogs, well, there would be a whole lot more unadoptable dogs for unnecessary reasons. If you have a purpose for wanting one that can go miles and miles of course you should consider the dog’s ability to do so.

I totally agree that breeders of anything ought to care about health and soundness.

[Cascades]

[QUOTE=Sswor;8538978]
Agreed. There are different kinds of dogs for different kinds of people. Purebred or not doesn’t make a difference unless you want to compete in the breed ring. Purebred does not equate to soundness.

Sort of like all those purebreds with overheating problems due to their shortened and upturned faces? Bulldogs who can’t give birth naturally? GSD frog dogs?[/QUOTE]

I was responding specifically to another poster’s assertion that concerns about soundness in dogs are absurd.

I don’t really have a position on purebred v. mutt. I agree with you that there are plenty of genetic abuses being perpetrated by purebred breeders.

Regardless of what you breed, health and structural soundness should be priority #1, imo.

But I don’t breed dogs, so take that for what it’s worth.

[S1969]

[QUOTE=Sswor;8538976]
Service dogs need to have some strength and sturdiness to their frames and Poodles are a bit delicate for brace work.[/QUOTE]

Poodles are delicate? I assume you don’t mean standard poodles. That is not a word I would ever use to describe them.

The point of the problem for many of us here is that “poodledoodles” and other dopey crossbreds are a marketing tool for the worst kind of breeders to sell to the worst kind of owners.

The concept of crossbreeding isn’t inherently bad; or the idea of the creation of a new breed. But it doesn’t seem that most of the doodle breeds are being shaped into an “improved” version of anything. They are a crapshoot at best, and bizarrely, people are willing to pay MORE for them than well-bred purebred dogs in many cases.

As was mentioned earlier - I haven’t seen any of the described, “potential” qualities of a golden or labradoodle that were any improvement over either a golden, a lab, or the poodle itself. A poodle x lab cross might give you a lab with a poodle-y coat, or not, or a poodle body with a lab’s coat, or something in between. If shedding is the main issue…the crossbreed seems like a strange choice.

[fordtraktor]

Cascades, thought about what you are saying and realized we actually agree more than you think. I totally agree that breeders ought to care about producing animals that are healthy and sound as a top priority.

That has nothing to do with whether an individual family’s needs require a pet of whatever level of soundness and all the breeder fails have to end up somewhere or dead. It is good there are dogs for people like you and homes for the fails with people like me. It would be best if there were far fewer fails.

[RubyTuesday]

[QUOTE=S1969;8534124]
I bet they are out there, but don’t advertise. In theory there is nothing wrong with the creation of a new breed – all breeds were created/developed out of other, existing breeds. But there has to be some standard, and breeding toward that standard…and a way of evaluating the offspring to know if you’re getting what you want. You have to eliminate the ones with the incorrect coat, temperament, health, etc. from the breeding pool, which most of the “Doodlebreeder” and Guardian model breeders don’t seem to do.

And it takes generations.

If she likes the curly coat, maybe she can find a nice curly coated retriever breeder instead. Good luck![/QUOTE]

^^THIS. There are MANY retriever breeds!

[Sswor]

@S1969;8539146

Poodles are delicate? I assume you don’t mean standard poodles. That is not a word I would ever use to describe them.

Yes, I do. shrug That’s what the service dog people say. Standard poodles are too delicate for brace work. They need a dog with more substance then that so the outcross to Lab or Golden is ideal. It’s their expertise, not mine.

[Cascades]

[QUOTE=fordtraktor;8539171]
Cascades, thought about what you are saying and realized we actually agree more than you think. I totally agree that breeders ought to care about producing animals that are healthy and sound as a top priority.

That has nothing to do with whether an individual family’s needs require a pet of whatever level of soundness and all the breeder fails have to end up somewhere or dead. It is good there are dogs for people like you and homes for the fails with people like me. It would be best if there were far fewer fails.[/QUOTE]

Definitely agree 100%.

[S1969]

[QUOTE=Sswor;8539251]
Yes, I do. shrug That’s what the service dog people say. Standard poodles are too delicate for brace work. They need a dog with more substance then that so the outcross to Lab or Golden is ideal. It’s their expertise, not mine.[/QUOTE]

I would think the bigger reason for not using them would be their grooming requirements, not their build. It might be a hardship for a disabled or blind person to attend to the grooming needs a poodle might require, but I think they are more than substantial enough for the job.

http://www.clevelandseniors.com/images/pets/pow/leader-dog-nicholas-3.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/10/Guide_dogs_H0183_Villakoira-opas_C.JPG

A standard poodle is a big dog; and were originally bred to hunt.

There could be other temperament reasons for not being ideally suited to service/guide dogs, but I can’t really believe that they are “too delicate.”

[Sswor]

It’s up to the service dog people, not me, but I think it’s the mass and substance, rather then size. A dog needs to be able to help stabilize a human with stability problems, or difficulty rising from the floor in case of a fall. Height isn’t as important as substance. Like a bulldog would be more sturdy on all 4’s then a Greyhound. I’m not the expert, just repeating what I have been told by people who presumably know their vocation.

[Horsegal984]

This discussion about service dogs is a bit off topic, since the majority of service dogs never do bracing work, and for a lot of them that do even a doodle is too small. For heavy mobility like bracing the dog needs to be at least 40% of the handlers height and 50% of their weight. A 160lb person needs an 80lb dog, MINIMUM. In general Doodles aren’t 80lb dogs. Danes, GSDs, Mastiffs, etc or oversized labs are most bracing dogs.
For light mobility, the SPoo S1969 posted is more than capable of handling that, no reason not to just use a SPoo that you know will be hypoallergenic instead of having a bunc of mutts that aren’t at all what you expected them to be. I mean, if the guy who originated the “breed” couldn’t get consistency with a structured breeding program why on earth does anything think Suzy BYB is going to make it happen?

[RHdobes563]

If your friend is adamant about getting a “doodle” but is more flexible on age, have her check petfinder.com. Have her search under “Poodle” rather than “Golden Retriever.” There are a large number of them needing homes.

[sophie]

I see a lot of “doodles” around here as well. All kinds, all sizes. Some of them are nice enough dogs, others, not so much. I don’t know why they are so popular and why people shun the Std poodle, which is a great dog, smart, easy to train, athletic, non-shedding…why ruin a good thing by cross-breeding it?! Not to mention, some of those doodle pups are MORE expensive than Std poodle pups.

[tucktaway]

I haven’t read this whole thread, so my apologies if this has already been posted. I just saw this bit yesterday and thought it was relevant to the discussion.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2564373/The-hidden-suffering-dogs-bred-cute-Adorable-looks-Cuddly-names-like-Labradoodle-But-trend-cross-breed-dogs-raises-disturbing-questions.html

[GraceLikeRain]

@fordtraktor;8538930

I do have to giggle at the disdain at the concern for their “structural problems” as if they have any real job other than being a dog. None of my mutt dogs has had good conformation. Who gives a crap? My current dog has a ridiculous snaggle tooth, crooked legs, was grossly obese when I adopted him. Whatever, he had a good temperament. He is a dog, not a show jumper. His job is to toddle along at my heels and sleep.

I’m the original poster and specifically brought up structure. My friend and her husband are a young, active couple. They want a dog capable of running, hiking, swimming, etc. long-term. Just like horses, there are always conformational messes that stay sound long-term but they are the exception. A sound dog is more likely to keep up with their active lifestyle while having a lower likelihood of sustaining a soft tissue injury or being a victim of a structural issue like HD.

My personal dog is not perfect but he is a former conformation dog and is nicely built. He keeps up with dogs many times his size and covers ground really efficiently. I am confident that his structure will contribute to his long-term soundness and health.

I want my friend to have a similar experience and I don’t think someone who breeds for color, coat, or cuteness is going to be a good fit.

Thank you for all of the helpful comments over the past 5 pages. Things have been quiet with my friend so I am hopeful that she is processing and doing some reading about the other breeds suggested.

[vxf111]

A PWD might be a great fit for your friend!

[Sannois]

[QUOTE=Alagirl;8538600]
Oh, fffffff…

The pounds are full of ‘who cares’

There might actually be a ‘doodle’ :dead: somewhere, waiting to be found, but looking at death row, because somebody produces mutts by the gross…

Now, I don’t mind purpose bred crosses.

But the purpose of the ‘doodle’ is to make the breeder money, cashing in on a myth, and ignorance of biological laws.

They were meant to become a hypoallergenic service dog, and I applaud the effort.
But it takes more than breedxbreed…[/QUOTE]
Yes Yes And Yes again!!!

[Sannois]

[QUOTE=vxf111;8539852]
A PWD might be a great fit for your friend![/QUOTE]
They are really nice dogs, at least the few I have met!!