Goldendoodle Breeder Recommendations

[S1969]

[QUOTE=Horsegal984;8542062]
What I would like to see is more education and emphasis put into why health testing is important and helping John Q Public understand the value in doing it.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. Every puppy is also a potential sire or dam (whether intentional or not, or a good idea or not) unless a breeder keeps every puppy. So health testing is not just about producing A healthy puppy; but part of the process of producing generations of healthy dogs.

You can’t control breeding; people will still breed whether they should or not. If more buyers understood how to pick a quality breeder from a bad one, it would be a step in the right direction.

[TBROCKS]

[QUOTE=Horsegal984;8542062]
So, you don’t see the need in testing for HYPP? Because we shouldn’t be breeding period?

I agree, there should be far less litters available than there are, but thanks to people like Sswor who have to have their new puppy RIGHT THIS VERY MINUTE greeders and millers will continue to mass produce puppies. However, those are the same people who will never health test because it cuts into their profit, and quite frankly they don’t care if your dog is healthy. The sooner it dies the sooner you buy another.

What I would like to see is more education and emphasis put into why health testing is important and helping John Q Public understand the value in doing it.[/QUOTE]

So that puppy that’s already been born, that Sswor needed “RIGHT THIS VERY MINUTE”, what do you propose happen to it? Drop it off at a kill shelter? Sswor is not the problem here, fairly certain Sswor didn’t request that the person breed their animal. It’s no more the fault of the people taking on the puppies than it would be the person adopting or buying a horse. The animals need homes, regardless. The problem is 100% the breeders.

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=TBROCKS;8542075]
So that puppy that’s already been born, that Sswor needed “RIGHT THIS VERY MINUTE”, what do you propose happen to it? Drop it off at a kill shelter? Sswor is not the problem here, fairly certain Sswor didn’t request that the person breed their animal. It’s no more the fault of the people taking on the puppies than it would be the person adopting or buying a horse. The animals need homes, regardless. The problem is 100% the breeders.[/QUOTE]

But if there wasn’t a market, they wouldn’t breed. It’s chicken and egg.

[S1969]

[QUOTE=TBROCKS;8542075]
The problem is 100% the breeders.[/QUOTE]

No, it’s not 100%. vfx111 is right - there is a market and they are breeding to target that market.

If buyers demanded a better bred puppy; breeders would respond by either dropping out of the market or improving their breeding stock.

Obviously by the time a puppy is born, a breeder can’t “undo” the breeding; but they can (and will) choose to not breed again if they aren’t able to sell them all.

[TBROCKS]

[QUOTE=vxf111;8542094]
But if there wasn’t a market, they wouldn’t breed. It’s chicken and egg.[/QUOTE]

It really is. One perpetrates the other. But ultimately the one with the control over the situation is the one breeding the animal. They can’t have buyers for what was never born.

[IdahoRider]

@S1969;8542102

Obviously by the time a puppy is born, a breeder can’t “undo” the breeding; but they can (and will) choose to not breed again if they aren’t able to sell them all.

Exactly this. And I would say that a sucky breeder doesn’t even care about selling all the puppies they produce. They care about selling enough to make a profit. It is not unknown for sucky breeders to surrender unsold pups to shelters once the cuteness factor is gone and when they have a younger litter ready to sell.
Sheilah

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=TBROCKS;8542122]
It really is. One perpetrates the other. But ultimately the one with the control over the situation is the one breeding the animal. They can’t have buyers for what was never born.[/QUOTE]

But you can’t realistically expect the side with the bigger profit motive to be the one to stop. History has shown how unrealistic that is. You can’t educate a puppy mill out of existance. You can educate buyers. At least some of them, sometimes.

[TBROCKS]

[QUOTE=vxf111;8542129]
But you can’t realistically expect the side with the bigger profit motive to be the one to stop. History has shown how unrealistic that is. You can’t educate a puppy mill out of existance. You can educate buyers. At least some of them, sometimes.[/QUOTE]

Of course not. Stricter regulation is needed, but that’s not going to happen, because “personal freedom”.

[S1969]

[QUOTE=TBROCKS;8542142]
Of course not. Stricter regulation is needed, but that’s not going to happen, because “personal freedom”.[/QUOTE]

It’s not even about personal freedom; it’s totally not realistic. There are millions of unaltered dogs in this country. How would we go about preventing someone from breeding a backyard litter?

I would support regulations on breeders of large numbers; I think that should be the case already. But how would it be possible to keep an Amish farmer from breeding two litters of crappy puppies a year? It’s impossible, even if people wanted to try.

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=TBROCKS;8542142]
Of course not. Stricter regulation is needed, but that’s not going to happen, because “personal freedom”.[/QUOTE]

I don’t even think regulation is needed (although it would help, especially where the mills are located). Education can go a long way. Answering threads like this and discussing the issue. If you can change one mind… that makes a difference.

[Marshfield]

@Countrywood;8541981

Unless dogs are sickly, imo (just imo) health testing is less important than that more breeding of any kind simply contributes more to the pet over population. .

This ignores all of the recessive diseases which can easily be bred around. DM is the canine equivalent of Lou Gehrig’s disease. Dogs who will be ultimately affected are well past breeding age at onset. Carriers never show signs. Breeding two carriers can lead to a litter with many puppies who will suffer progressive paralysis. Other breeds have multiple eye issues with genetic testing (which is part of where I came up with my estimate for health testing for my client’s Cattle dog)

There is also NO dog overpopulation where I live. The dogs in our shelters travel from hundreds of miles away. Good luck if you want something other than a hound mix or pit mix. Small dogs–other than chihuhuas shipped from elsewhere are incredibly rare. The ER I work at serves as a quarantine facility for dogs shipped from TN and elsewhere up to NH. 90% are either pit mix or hound mix. This is not what a lot of people want for their family member.

[Countrywood]

There’s NO dog over population where you live…Where are all the dogs in your shelters coming from? Areas where there IS an over pet population. It’;s a nation wide problem.

I did not say health testing was less important, imo it;s not as important as over breeding, period. The two are intertwined because bad breeders who over breed are likely the ones not testing for health or breeding inferior animals.

I bet most of the pit mixes and hound mixes you speak of have NOTHING wrong with their health, and could be sturdier than a lot of pure breeds. Many would probably make good family members if of good empowerment. But they are not cute enough to find homes easily, that is the problem.

[S1969]

[QUOTE=Countrywood;8542848]
There’s NO dog over population where you live…Where are all the dogs in your shelters coming from? Areas where there IS an over pet population. It’;s a nation wide problem. [/QUOTE]

And yet…somehow the Northeast (and other areas) have been able to solve this problem better than the Southern areas. So…it’s not unsolvable, right? It apparently isn’t a priority or there is a different culture in that area - which probably could be changed. Education would help.

[MistyBlue]

[QUOTE=Countrywood;8542848]

I bet most of the pit mixes and hound mixes you speak of have NOTHING wrong with their health, and could be sturdier than a lot of pure breeds. Many would probably make good family members if of good empowerment. But they are not cute enough to find homes easily, that is the problem.[/QUOTE]

In certain areas, many people prefer to have dogs that don’t require coats to be outside in winter.
And certain breeds have certain instincts that aren’t conducive to all living arrangements…having a hound as a casual pet owner without decent fenced in yard could mean spending half of your time trying to find your dog that went off following it’s nose. Hounds are often very determined sniffers. I love hounds, wouldn’t own one though. Doesn’t fit in with my lifestyle.

[Bicoastal]

[QUOTE=Sswor;8541564]
What if you had a crossbreed that was titled in agility, and had basic tests done to certify health, and perhaps the dog earned CGC or some such certificate. Would a dog like this receive the community’s blessing to breed for the purpose of producing good agility dogs and/or pets?[/QUOTE]

Are you thinking about breeding your dog?

There are purpose-bred mixes in some sports, such as flyball with Border Whippets, Border Staffies, Border Jack, Jack Whippet, etc.

[Perfect10]

[QUOTE=S1969;8542851]
And yet…somehow the Northeast (and other areas) have been able to solve this problem better than the Southern areas. So…it’s not unsolvable, right? It apparently isn’t a priority or there is a different culture in that area - which probably could be changed. Education would help.[/QUOTE]

Puppies and kittens freeze to death in the North. Not necessarily so in the South. That goes a long way towards reducing the pet population of the North.

[Sswor]

[QUOTE=Bicoastal;8543196]
Are you thinking about breeding your dog?

There are purpose-bred mixes in some sports, such as flyball with Border Whippets, Border Staffies, Border Jack, Jack Whippet, etc.[/QUOTE]

Only passively. It’s difficult to find my mix of choice. I got ridiculously lucky finding one of the summer. And honestly I don’t know which is worse–keep trying my luck with the Amish-bred farm dogs, when I can find them (though the Amish farmers don’t seem to care of it’s Jack/heeler, Jack/Aussie, or Rat/Heeler, Rat/Jack/Aussie/Heeler, or any of the above, I do care) or planning ahead to breed my own when I’m retired. My current dog will take me to mid-50’s, but what then after that? I don’t know. Contrary to popular belief I DO care about pet overpopulation. So which is worse? Beat the bushes to buy a farmer’s pup once every 10 years or so, or look into seriously titling an intact dog, locating a worthy counterpart, and breeding a litter? I really don’t know.

[invinoveritas]

[QUOTE=Perfect10;8543333]
Puppies and kittens freeze to death in the North. Not necessarily so in the South. That goes a long way towards reducing the pet population of the North.[/QUOTE]

I’ve always thought that this was the reason that the South had so many strays while the New England States did not. Plus the smaller and less populated New England State have less breeders (people) as well.

[S1969]

[QUOTE=Perfect10;8543333]
Puppies and kittens freeze to death in the North. Not necessarily so in the South. That goes a long way towards reducing the pet population of the North.[/QUOTE]

I’m sure that is one reason. I don’t believe it’s the main reason; I think there has been a much higher acceptance of spay/neuter than in other areas. To be honest, the only people I know with unaltered dogs are my friends in dog shows or hunting. Only now are people even starting to question the early spay/neuter (meaning as early as 15 weeks or so.)

I think the spay/neuter rates are the bigger reason for low #s in shelters…because people could take unexpected litters to the shelters and pups would be adopted. At this point, there are a lot of groups that are bringing puppies up from southern states for adoption because there are so few here and there is still a demand.

[vxf111]

I’m up north and we absolutely have a pet overpopulation problem here. Yes, lots of “pit bulls” but also plenty of other dog types (and cats). Including trendy-doodles one they get big and not so cute.