Grain free diet for a tb?

[Horsechick200]

I have recently gotten a 2 year old tb. He was track trained, but never raced. He came to me very skinny, but picked up weight with just grass and hoffmans minerals quickly.

Howver, it’s now winter here and is 30 below. Hay wasn’t cutting it, so I tried adding grain back in September when the grazing went poor. This worked well for a bit, but then he stopped eating it altogether. I had the vet out, she pulled blood and gave me omeprazole. (Blood came back fine).

The omeprazole fixed the issue in about a week at the 20cc dose. He got this dose for 2 weeks and then I tapered it down to 5cc before he came off. He was then fine for about a month and then stopped eating again. Vet was contacted and she gave me omeprazole again. This worked well again.

Now, about a month and a bit later, he’s stopped eating again. He will take one sniff of the grain and paw at it until it’s spread all throughout the shavings in the stall. I contacted my vet, she came out and did an exam. She gave me omeprazole once again and said he may need to stay on a low dose for maintenance. She also said this is very common with tb’s.

I love my vet, she’s great, but I’m not comfortable putting a 2 yr old on omeprazole for life. Especially as this only started when I added grain to his diet. ( even right now he won’t eat grain, but will munch on alfalfa cubes and eat free choice hay just fine).

Is there a grain free diet that would be tasty and provide enough fat to keep weight on a tb in winter? He’s not an extremely hard keeper, but does need more feed than horses I’ve had in the past.

He was also a major cribber when I first got him. He doesn’t crib as much anymore, but will chew and lick wood.

[IPEsq]

How long is he on omeprazole when you are using it? 2 weeks is probably not enough time to heal an ulcer if that’s his problem. What grain are you feeding?

There are plenty of forage-based fortified feeds that are kinder to an ulcer prone horse than a grain (oats, corn, etc.) based feed. A lot of the forage-based feeds will be senior feeds or billed as low starch, but you should look at the ingredients. Which one we’d recommend would depend on what brands are available in your area. You can also add some alfalfa–either hay or pellets or cubes. You may want to add some kind of fat to whatever you feed to up the calories with less volume. There are a bunch of forms, from oils to horse-specific fat supplements, to fortified fat supplements…what I tend to pick is mostly based on what my horse will eat, because he’s picky about it, but a good rule of thumb is to try to have more omega 3s and lower omega 6s.

[Horsechick200]

Thanks for the reply. He currently gets:
1.5lbs buckeye safe n easy performance
.5lbs buckeye ultimate finish 25
3qts alfalfa cubes soaked
1 scoop equine choice pre/probiotic
2 pumps flax seed oil
and now 20cc omeprazole again.

However, I’ve stopped giving him the grain the past few days as he wasn’t eating it anyway. He’s turned out 24/7 and gets good quality 2nd cut Timothy hay 24/7.

https://www.buckeyenutrition.com/pro…rformance.aspx

https://www.buckeyenutrition.com/pro…finish-25.aspx

forgot to add he was on omeprazole for 2 weeks at the full dose the first time. Then weaned off for 2 more weeks. The second time he was on the full dose for 30 days, then weaned off for another 30 days.

[BoyleHeightsKid]

Hmmm… I thought for sure you were going to tell us he was getting sweetfeed. Have you tried eliminating one thing at time to see what’s causing his upset?

Triple Crown Senior is a very nice feed and you can soak it. Or you can try beet pulp. Do you have access to Triple Crown?

[Horsechick200]

I tried to get triple crown before going to buckeye as I fed it years ago and loved it, but I can no longer get it in Canada :(. I haven’t tried eliminating anything as I had no issues prior to adding grain. That’s another reason why I’m looking into a “no grain” diet.

[OdieJump]

I would recommend beet bulp instead of afalfa for your horse and see if he’ll eat that. I personally feed my horses strategy which my thoroughbred likes if you could try that

[DMK]

is the food soaked? (sounds like it w/the alfalfa cubes)? It also sounds like you have a lot of supps and “stuff” in there which may not be appealing to a picky eater.

Some horses are just not fans of wet food. Or oil. Or Ultimate Finish/rice bran pellets.

If you haven’t tried it yet I would just try the safe and easy, no supps, oil, powder, water, nothing but the food out of the bag) or better yet, try a a good senior feed (which despite the name is a great feed for all ages).

[Simkie]

Given that you’ve treated potential ulcers a couple times now, it may be time to scope the horse and REALLY take a looksee at what you have going in the stomach. Two weeks treatment with omeprazole is often not nearly long enough to resolve ulcers, and there may be other things at play. Rather than blindly throw things at the wall to see what sticks, why not spend the few hundred $$ to actually see what’s wrong?

[Horsechick200]

Why would you recommend beet pulp over alfalfa? Just curious. I built his diet up slowly, and he’s been eating all the “stuff” for almost 2 months now. My vet recommended the probiotic and flax. I’ve also tried soaking the food and leaving in dry. Does it make a difference either.

I want to ask my vet about a scope. Nearest horsepitial is 3 hours however. I’ll probably spend more on trailering than the scope! Haha

[China_Doll]

What about treating for hind gut ulcers? Sunflower seeds or rice bran is a good source of fat.

[JB]

@Horsechick200

Thanks for the reply. He currently gets:
1.5lbs buckeye safe n easy performance
.5lbs buckeye ultimate finish 25
3qts alfalfa cubes soaked
1 scoop equine choice pre/probiotic
2 pumps flax seed oil

Why such a mix? 1.5lb of any regular fortified grain is really short-changing the nutritional aspect. For a 2yo TB, i would be using a ration balancer at probably 2lb, maybe 3 depending on his current and expected final size. AFAIK all ration balancers are grain-free, but don’t hold me to that. All the quality ones are though, so you can pick whichever is easiest to get. Personally, I like Triple Crown, Progressive, Tribute, and the new ProElite Diet Balancer with Southern States. But Nutrena, Purina, Seminole, Poulin, LMF, I think Blue Bonnet, McCauley’s, and pretty much every name brand has a balancer these days.

and now 20cc omeprazole again.

As what product?

forgot to add he was on omeprazole for 2 weeks at the full dose the first time. Then weaned off for 2 more weeks. The second time he was on the full dose for 30 days, then weaned off for another 30 days.

it might be time to use something like ranitidine, sucralfate, and/or Equishure, to cover any possible hind gut issues.

[Taza]

It is very common for horses to experience hyperacidity when you try to wean them off of medications like omeprazole. If you haven’t done so, try adding a supplement like SmartGI Ultra as you decrease the amount of omeprazole. There are several ulcer threads in this forum discussing omeprazole, Nexium, corn oil and other ulcer treatments. They are well worth reading through. My OTTBs eat balancer pellets, supplemented as needed with beet pulp, alfalfa pellets and corn oil. The last three are all good for horses with ulcer tendencies, as well as putting on weight. They also get free choice alfalfa mix hay whenever they are in the stall.

[Horsechick200]

@JB

Why such a mix?

because that’s what he decided he wanted to eat at the time haha. I wanted to put him on grow and win, but he seems so sensitive my vet said to wait until the right time to make a feed switch. That time hasn’t come yet :(. He was on Hoffman’s minerals for awhile, but the feed store stopped carrying it. I can order it in if it would be beneficial.

As what product?
Just compounded omeprazole from the vet. It contains 100mg omeprazole/ml and L-glutamine at 37.5mg/ml.

it might be time to use something like ranitidine, sucralfate, and/or Equishure, to cover any possible hind gut issues.

[ohsopersuasive]

@Horsechick200

I tried to get triple crown before going to buckeye as I fed it years ago and loved it, but I can no longer get it in Canada :(. I haven’t tried eliminating anything as I had no issues prior to adding grain. That’s another reason why I’m looking into a “no grain” diet.

where in Canada are you located? In the West; Alberta/BC I have had good success with Lifeline Equical

[Palm_Beach]

• Promotes a healthy metabolism with 13% NSC (sugar and starch) and no corn or molasses.
• Fortified with GRO 'N WIN[B]™[/B] for balanced nutrition.
• Enhances fiber digestion with added prebiotics and beet pulp.
• Improves behavior for a calmer, more focused horse.
• Supports immune function, joint health and a shiney coat from added omega-3 and -6 fatty acids.

Wheat Middlings, Soybean Hulls, Heat Processed Soybeans, Soybean Oil, Calcium Carbonate, Dehydrated Alfalfa Meal, Calcium Phosphate, Dried Beet Pulp, [I]Saccharomyces cerevisiae[/I] Yeast Culture, Salt, Magnesium Oxide, Vitamin E Supplement, Zinc Sulfate, Vitamin A Supplement, Copper Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Choline Chloride, Zinc Proteinate, Selenium Yeast, Copper Proteinate, Manganese Proteinate, Iron Proteinate, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate, Ethylenediamine Dihydriodide.

@Horsechick200 - have you read the label on the bag of feed you are feeding? You are already feeding grain-free, unless you want to call soybeans a grain. It already has alfalfa in it. It has oil in it. It has a balancer in it. It has prebiotics in it. I’d remove everything BUT this feed and continue to treat the ulcers as it seems to help him. I understand that he is not eating up, but you will want to get him up to 5-7 lbs per day if this is the way you go. If you think he likes a hot mash, you can add hot water to it.

[mmeqcenter]

I personally have always preferred Alfalfa, I find beet pulp worthless for 90% of horses.
Alfalfa is also really good for the prevention of ulcers, as the calcium buffers stomach acid.
I would not remove his alfalfa.

I agree with Palm Beach’s assessment 100%. Before I read their post, I was going to recommend a grain with no corn and no molasses, as these aggravate ulcers - but you’re already feeding one! I’d continue with this grain (but keep the alfalfa too) and do a bit longer of a stint with Omeprazole, with a slow wean-off instead of pulling right off. You can add Aloe vera juice also to help prevent recurrences. I also had success with G.U.T. supplement.

[Posting_Trot]

Actually, I think beet pulp can be very useful for many horses. There’s a great video of a vet discussing the pros and cons of beet pulp on the Smartpak site:
https://www.smartpakequine.com/content/video/Beet-Pulp-as-a-Hay-Alternative
It’s worth checking out if you have concerns or questions about using beet pulp.
The vet does say that it often works well with TBs to get weight on without adding a lot of grain.
I’ve also always fed (wet) beet pulp as a way to get some additional water into horses, and it also allows the powdered supplements to stick better.

[tazycat]

TC senior is good till it’s not, but lately it’s been brick like so i’m switching feeds. Have 8 bags of TC senior and literally have to pound the snot out of it, to break it up. 8 bags of brick feed,plus my horses aren’t thriving on it any more. OP i’d keep your horse on your current feed,add alfalfa. Cold weather and TCS really doesn’t work its big pita…

Beet pulp a lot of horses don’t like,ever taste the stuff it’s gross.

[Horsechick200]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I am aware that the safe and easy is grain free. However, he will not eat that alone ( can’t blame him, it looks pretty bland!). Never has, that’s why he gets the ultimate finish with it. Unfournetly, the UF does contain grain.

According to his old owner at the track, he’s always done best on textured feeds. I can’t find one that is grain free, but I spoke with nutritionist from buckeye and she reccomened the safe and easy textured and the ultimate finish 100. Along with alfalfa cubes. I’m not sure I’ll go this route as it has a higher NSC value and is less fat, but I guess it comes down to what he will eat as well. Thanks for your help everyone!

https://www.buckeyenutrition.com/pro…exturized.aspx

https://www.buckeyenutrition.com/pro…inish-100.aspx

[quietann]

There was a TB at my old barn who had similar issues and needed to be on a grain free diet. He got a lot of soaked alfalfa pellets, beet pulp etc. plus a combined feed similar to what you are using. He got four meals a day because he would only eat so much at one time. He did fine on it, and mixing his feed into the alfalfa pellets was useful.