Just wondering…I’ve never had a gray broodmare…but if a gray mare (with only one gray parent = non- homozygous for gray) is bred to a homozygous black stallion…will the foal eventually turn to gray or stay black/dark??
If the mare is Gg you will have a 50% chance of a grey foal. Grey is not a color, it is a color modifier that results in a lack of pigmentation. So if the stallion is homozygous black, you will have a black based foal, but that won’t affect the G gene and if the mare is Gg, you have a 50% chance of grey, whatever the base color of the foal.
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Thank you. It would be a waste to produce a flashy black/white foal that faded to white!! I love my “color”!!
My retired horse is a grey/white pinto. He has always been totally white when I have owned him. I had him at one barn for months and was hosing him in the wash stall after a ride. Another boarder walked by and asked me when I got a new horse since she could now see that he was a pinto. Didn’t realize it was the same horse. I have always wondered if Finnegan was black and white or brown and white before he turned grey. Funny thing is where his skin is black he is starting to get that flea bite look.
I bet Finnegan would have been flashy if he had stayed a visible pinto.
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I lived with a 100%, pink skinned, white (not gray) TB show/hunt horse for 22 years…maintanence sucks!! My next “best” horse was…IS solid black NO white…not as flashy, but a heck of a lot easier to keep clean!!
So you had a cremello TB then?
A friend had one like that. His show name was “Invisible Ink” (and his barn name was Squid!)
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There are Thoroughbreds that appear totally white. They do have a base color, just not easy to find sometimes. Definitely different than creamellos.
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White TBs that aren’t gray, with pink skin, are one of a few different (Dominant) Whites, not double dilutes.
And yes, avoid gray if you’re looking to produce “color”, whether that’s a dilute or spots or chrome.
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I had heard of the white TBs before, but thought they were pretty rare so assumed the OP didn’t have one (and was maybe trying to describe a cremello).
They’re actually not terribly rare these days. There’s a whole line of white TBs racing in Japan, and several of them also race in the US. A few times a year there’s a new white foal in the news.
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ps…Both of these horses were born with this coloring…nothing changed with time!
Potentially Tobi spots with W22-looking solid areas, potentially Tobi with just mild roan looking solid areas (which can already happen), potentially wildly “roaned” solid areas.
As you can see, Painting Freedom already looks kinda-sorta Tobian-like, with some solid white splotches, some roany splotches, some solid dark splotches. But others in the line have a lot more evenly distributed white without bold white patches, or much less scattered white with few to no white patches
This pdf has a graphic of several W22 horses
https://boris.unibe.ch/99588/8/Manuscript_Durig_R2_track_changes.pdf
@crosscreeksh are those foals tested to have W5?
Roaning on dark patches is a common Tobi trait, so not necessarily indicative of any W influence.
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No. I haven’t had them tested. We were going to keep the 2 year old as a future stallion prospect (he is outstanding and HUGE, looks and moves like a pure TB (he is 9/16 TB)…already over 16.1 and with a lab puppy disposition … but changed our minds. We’re getting to old to think about adding another stallion when the one we have is so awesome, gentle, sane and an incredible sire! He’ll make a great show horse for someone else! I did get his APHA papers…but he doesn’t move like an APHA hunter!!
Thanks - so we have no idea if they have W5 on top of their Tobiano.
I may have the two year old colt tested. The fillies are all aiming toward show homes. We are delaying the gelding for now. He really is quite nice. Question …if you have two parents that are tobiano…but each has DW 5 in their pedigree…what are the chances of the DW showing up?? Thanks.
You have been breeding for Pinto color for many years , yes? Pasture breeding TB and TB crosses? I remember you posting that you were no longer breeding. I may be confusing you with someone else?
Any time each parent has a given gene, there is a 75% chance the foal will have at least 1 copy.
The whole breakdown is
25% chance no copy
25% chance 2 copies
50% chance 1 copy
So adding the 50 and 25 gives you 75% chance at least 1 copy
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We have been breeding DW#5 Thoroughbreds for 25 years…still have some of the DW Puchi’s Rambo, mares and one show/pleasure gelding. Before the DW #5 TB…we used to breed racing Thoroughbreds…Husband was a trainer for 50+ years. We have never “not been” breeding…just cut back and skipped a year while we were relocating. And we don’t “pasture breed” as such. We tease the mares by hand to the stallion, breed when the mare is ready…then if the two are compatible the mare stays with the stallion until she is out of heat and then returned to the mare pasture. We do not and never did “pasture breed” by definition. The stallion is never put in the mare pasture. We have one TB mare who does live with the stallion full time. She has only produced one fantastic foal due to her advanced age, but they make a lovely “content” pair. We are currently breeding an outstanding, Champion Producing, APHA stallion to Thoroughbred and Irish Sport Horse mares.
