HELP NARROW DOWN A STALLION FOR MY STATES PREMIUM OLD MARE!

I recently aquired a wonderful mare. I’m searching for the best fresh semen stallion that matches a large blk 17.1 hand Str premium imported maiden Oldenburg mare. She scored well at her mare performance test. Her lines are Donnerhall, Pik Bube, Glorieox and Feinbrand.

http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/leonesse3

Her weaknesses are long loin, and straighter croup (a quicker rear would be nice). She went to 4th level dressage. Sire must be cooled semen approved GOV, Oldenburg Verband. I’m looking at Rosenthal, Rubignon, Sinatra Song, Sagnol, Devon Heir, Wild Dance(amazing babies), Diamond Stud, …(I like rousseau but $$) but not sure about them or other sires I’m missing. Out of this line up who are the sires who’s foals sell best and are most desired? Color and size does not matter. Looking for the RIGHT stallion for this impressive mare! You can find video if you search out Leonesse Oldenburg mare. Please send opinions(or short list) she comes in next week!!! Thanks!

Soprano. Fabulous movement, great pedigree , beautiful babies and the Contender part gives a great croup

THANK YOU!!! I will look at him closer!!

jen

Soprano also has some of the best semen my vet had ever seen!

A Don Cardinale SPS ? I am jealous :slight_smile: Offspring of that stallion is rare.

I would like to add Wolkentanz II. The Weltmeyer influence for the quicker hindleg.

Saw a video…very nice mare! FWIW she doesn’t look weak in the loin to me but yes, could be quicker behind (and have a bit more “sit”). If you are worried about the loin connection I would avoid W line in general.

Is frozen semen an option?

Lovely mare (I watched a video)!! I would be riding her if it were me:)

I too really like Soprano’s blood lines. I don’t know much about what he throws himself however, but agree Contender is a fabulous line.

I think Liberty Gold is a highly underutilized stallion and brings a good combination of the W and L lines together. He has produced a super high percentage of Elite mares, highly rideable, good conformation and gaits. Had he stayed in Germany I think we would have seen an abundance of good offspring of his.

I have bred one Rousseau and he has matured into a lovely riding horse. With my mare he added height, length of leg with a lot of bone and more suspension to the trot. He has a great temperament and willingness to work under saddle (he is now 4). His owner is a successful FEI AA rider who feels he will take her well up the levels. I think he is one of the most proven stallions we have here in NA so if he fits your mare conformationally you can’t go wrong with him.

The same above mare has also been bred to Wolkentanz II and produced a nice gelding with three solid gaits (maybe not as much suspension as the Rousseau) and very nicely put together. His owner states he is sensitive but sensible and will start his under saddle career next year. I think conformationally the WII gelding is nicer conformed than the Rousseau, but the Rousseau has a flashier trot. Along with Rousseau he too is a highly proven stallion in NA.

I now have a Buddenbrock filly out of the above mare. She is only 3 weeks old but the “prettiest” foal I have ever had (despite some vascular issue due to trauma of a rear leg that i am hoping to surgically repair. Thankfully it does not cause her any discomfort or lameness). She is very tall and leggy, beautiful head and neck, great loin. All this for sure being brought through the Trak blood. Of course I cannot say anything about ride ability, although she is a very confident and super friendly filly. He does not have the name recognition of the above stallions outside the Trak world but has proven that he can produce upper level dressage and eventing horses though his offspring in Europe.

Other dressage stallions in NA that I keep on my short list (of various registries) are Benidetto, Royal Prince, UB40, Viva Voltaire, Bugatti Hilltop, Schwartzenegger, Sir Sinclair.

Not this year!! But I have my heart set on Furst Romancer, maybe next year after she conceives and foals out successfully!!

I agree a bit more sit would help her with the changes too!

Thanks!!

If you want to talk about Soprano. I’d be happy to talk to you and send you some video of my young guy.

Erica

and, yes, his semen is great and his owner one of the best stallion owners ever!

Many of the Rousseau’s I have seen from the German mares were very heavy…too much so for me. I do very much like his offspring from the Dutch mare base in general. If this mare were mine I would be so tempted to go to Londonderry as he seems to always produce very “quick” horses with strong toplines and good sensitivity, plus he won’t make them heavier or shorter in the front leg. Though if you are set on not going the frozen route then obviously this wouldn’t work.

What about Pikko Del Cerro…saw him with Lisa Wilcox in the saddle a few months ago in Florida and really liked him. Very talented and beautiful stallion. I am assuming you are breeding for the FEI ring? Benidetto also looked good, a smaller, compact and sporty stallion with clear ability for the upper levels.

Isn’t this the mare you posted about on the Dressage forum? I think I suggested Soprano as one to look at. He may not downsize her - he is at least 17h himself - but he should help refine her a bit, and you could very likely get a wowser foal.

And again - there aren’t hardly any stallions in NA whose foals are in huge demand with foal buyers (well, maybe certain hunter stallions that I would not recommend), so a “quick sale” should probably be at the bottom of your list of criteria.

Re: Furst Romancier - he produces BIG, and you would very likely get a very good sized foal, with a lot of bone and substance. He also often throws a bit of a thicker throatlatch, so that is another thing to think about, esp. if your mare isn’t “elegant” in that area. AND he often throws a “straighter” type of front leg action - not a lot of knee. (These were the comments of a German inspector, when specifically asked about Furst Romancier.)

And again - there aren’t hardly any stallions in NA whose foals are in huge demand with foal buyers (well, maybe certain hunter stallions that I would not recommend), so a “quick sale” should probably be at the bottom of your list of criteria.

Agreed. I would say no matter who you bred her to the mare would be the most appealing part of the equation for someone looking at one of her foals…I think that is what will sell the foal. But remember, color and size (and pretty!) does matter when breeding for foal sales (generally speaking). People just aren’t into plain chestnut, period. If it is chestnut it needs to have lots of chrome. Not my idea of how one goes about breeding a sport horse but that is another topic and one that has been covered frequently here.


Re: Furst Romancier - he produces BIG, and you would very likely get a very good sized foal, with a lot of bone and substance. He also often throws a bit of a thicker throatlatch, so that is another thing to think about, esp. if your mare isn’t “elegant” in that area. AND he often throws a “straighter” type of front leg action - not a lot of knee. (These were the comments of a German inspector, when specifically asked about Furst Romancier.)

Yeah, a lovely but MASSIVE stallion. I don’t see him giving a quicker hind leg either…

I’m a big fan of looking ahead into the next generation. Since I use frozen almost exclusively, I would select ‘F’ line stallions like Fidertanz.
For a fresh NA based stallion on a mare with Donnerhall /Pik Bube I would use Routinier to get Rohdiamont on the cross with the idea that there is perhaps more than a 50% chance of getting a filly that you may want to keep and breed.
Well, more like an 80% chance of a filly if you use my vet:) I really like the breeding possibilities of this cross.
if you get a colt, the Donnerhall/Rubinstein is a respected proven cross.
I think the stallion Voice comes to mind on this cross…a DeNiro son I would still like to breed with my Rodiamont granddaughter, or my Rubinstein granddaughter.

I had a Fidertanz gelding that I imported. Best temperment ever.

I have a black Fidertanz colt, excellent temperament and very trainable. I’d highly recommend him:lol:

From the video, she looks not unusual of an offspring with her pedigree. You already have Donnerhall, so I would suggest considering horses without Donnerhall for the purposes of more genetic diversity, although I realize some would argue that Donnerhall x 2 isn’t so bad. With adding another Donnerhall line, I would concur with the suggestions of Sir Gregory. DxR lines have proven to be a good combination year after year. I would agree with the Soprano and Rousseau recommendation. Soprano has produced some very beautiful and type-y offspring and would probably cross nicely with your mare. Time and time again, Rousseau progeny have proven themselves in the competition ring. The price is higher, but it is a live foal guarantee and you can get cooled in the US. You can easily reach this price buying frozen semen by the dose, which you would have to do for Fuerst Romancier. If you are opening up to the idea of frozen, Johnson has done very nicely with mares such as yours, the price is reasonable and you get an LFG contract. While I would personally go with stallions that have both proven themselves and had successful offspring if I was only breeding one mare and this is her first foal, there are some nice young stallions in NA including Hemmingway, Qredit, and some of the Rolling Stone Farm stallions. If you open your request for recommendations or your search to the idea of Frozen semen and/or European stallions, you will greatly increase the options people can suggest.

I have a narrowed down list that I have worked towards over the last weeks thanks to everyone’s input!! I decided on staying away from frozen this time to help ensure I get a baby in 2014. This list is in no order. I am planning on selling the first foal out of Leo and trying for a filly next. ( my luck the first one will be a filly) Tell me your fav pick!! :slight_smile:

STALLION
Fred Astair
diamond stud
Rubignon
WILD DANCE
SAGNOL
Freestyle
sir Gregory
WOLKENTANZ II
Romancero H*
Regazzoni
Winterprinz
FALSTERBO

I believe Fred Astair and Falsterbo are both no longer with us.

Take a look at Schroeder (Sandro Hit x Escudo I) throwing super characters and ridability. Super topline and good hind leg. We are excited this year he has a new rider and will be going to FL to compete for the winter, so you’ll hear ever more about him. Easy to breed too with jet fuel for semen.

Kathy