Honey the ASB 2.0

[Alterration]

I’ve got 3 kids. Raised them all to successful adulthood. It’s brutal and hard. They had falls, and one of them recently got t-boned by a semi. I get care and concern. Still have concerns now that they are all grown adults.

I also have taught riding lessons on and off over the last 35 years. Parents come in a variety of types, from those who are hovering and overbearing to those who push their kids too hard. Helicopter parents are really hard to work with in riding lessons.

No, of course I didn’t mean to be insulting - I was explaining my misunderstanding. Maybe explaining isn’t worth it. But for whatever stupid reason, I like people to know I was misinterpreting what they said.

[Maria]

Just cause I can and by the way it’s meant to be funny

OH, and I did not make this up, so don’t blame me if there are spelling errors.

[smoofox]

@endlessclimb

Want a calm horse that isn’t fidgety on the ties and generally needy/touchy/scatterbrained? Don’t get a saddlebred or Arab.

Ummm no. It is the individual horse and not the breed - as countless people have pointed out in this thread. Two of the best therapeutic riding horses I have ever worked with were ex-show Arabians - and they were not senior citizens. The dressage/boarding/lesson place next door has 4 ASBs in their lesson horse string. All of them are bright, happy and curious - but never needy/touchy/scatterbrained and never fussy in the crossties or at the mounting block etc. They are also solid on the endless trails around here.

We own 3 vizslas that we hunt and trial extensively. We accept and love them for exactly those personality traits that have been bred in for generations that you are actively trying to train out. What a shame.

No one is trying to train a vizsla not to be a vizsla. Having some solid behaviors/manners etc. that are appropriate for that individual dog is respecting the breed as well as that individual. That is not “training out” breed characteristics.

[Maria]

And here is another one.

[endlessclimb]

Training a dog who is bred to engage with humans, whose #1 known trait is being the most velcro and soft of the pointing breeds (as well as having more energy than a Weim or GSP), to sit on a mat and not engage - to me, is not fair to the animal. Someone struggling with a Vizsla because it’s acting… like a Vizsla… yeah, you should have bought a different breed.

And of course it’s not every animal. I stated that multiple times.

[Maria]

And of course this old tried and true favorite.

[Sdel]

@Alterration

The initial portrayal was that of an anxious mother, whose daughter rode a horse that her trainer found suitable but that you did not, and that your daughter fell off. The rest of the details were filled in after my comment.

That was not the initial portrayal, that isn’t even what was being talked about. You just didn’t read my post and settled into being insulting to try to make your point.

It was definitely stated that my daughter/horse got injured because she tried to execute a skill (which wasn’t even technically the wrong thing to do) and did it wrong because the situation was beyond her control and skill level to manage….due to no fault of her own.

I specifically made this point because while you were technically right in describing how to handle a pop up, your advice in no way took into consideration the skill level and capabilities of the person you were advising and the possibility existed for it to go horribly wrong.

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

Hahaha. Thank you.

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

I find it so strange that someone who doesn’t know me in real life, who hasn’t spent a single second in my home with my family or dog, who has apparently read a handful of posts on these forums where I expressed that I was really glad to have found an awesome trainer to work with my family and young dog,… continues to confidently declare that I am struggling with my dog and shouldn’t have bought him.

Anyway… about V’s and place… a fun photo at a friend’s house after multiple owners who all work with the same trainer got their dogs together for a fun social day.

Look at that. All the dogs can hang out politely and sit for a picture for a few minutes. They also played a ton as a group that day. And got time with their owners… but were confident enough to be separated from their owners as well, and just run around like crazy loons enjoying themselves.

Oh the horror. None of the people who own these poor dogs should have bought them. They are clearly all very damaged and have had their very essence crushed because they received basic obedience training, and can now interact politely with other canines, sit calmly for short durations when asked, and have successful socialization experiences and playtime with other dogs.

[endlessclimb]

Hey man, you do you. You admitted this is the hardest pup you’ve ever had, and that’s because you’re trying to cram a square peg into a round hole. You bought a Vizsla, and are actively trying to un-Vizsla it.

If you’re game to keep harping on the dog for his generations of carefully bred instincts, of course he will eventually submit to it. Choke chain, sharp corrections, and all.

Also, what happened to the dog on the far right? Is that a wry nose or some other deformation?

[Maria]

They are CLEARLY abused dogs.

Which one is yours? I need to call PETA.

[AdultEmmy]

It’s just wild to me. I didn’t think I’d end up in this position because I spent about 9 months or so looking for a horse. I must have tried 30 in that time. One I loved, but coth told me to pass bc he had bone spurs. I shared the X-rays and everything. And he was an ottb, believe it or not! I LOVED him, so that was devastating. Honestly I felt so safe on him.

I also put an offer and ppe on another horse who I came to find had fused joints everywhere and kissing spine. Another pass. Ottb mare.

So it just sucks to be at this crossroads again. My last horse, Margo, made it clear it was time for a new home. I just hope to have clarity one way or another with honey.

[endlessclimb]

Can you lease-to-buy something, in the event you’re in this scenario again?

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

@Maria

They are CLEARLY abused dogs.

Which one is yours? I need to call PETA.

He’s the handsome boy on the left.

[Maria]

Thank you. I am dialing PETA now.

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

Well, hopefully the next month or two helps you develop a good relationship with a good trainer, and you will have more support as you decide what to do next.

And no experience is wasted. I bet you have learned a ton from Honey, and certainly she has benefited from her time with you.

[Alterration]

I read your post.

You said your daughter was injured by executing a maneuver/skill that she wasn’t prepared for.

You did not say in that post the extent nor severity of the injuries and very few riders of any discipline I know of with the exception of reined cow horses use the word maneuver/skill leading me to believe that you really did not know what you were talking about. An injury to a child can be a bruised tailbone or broken ribs, neither of which you fully expanded on until after the comment.

I’ve already expressed my sorrow at your situation, and I’m sorry my experience with helicopter parents and inexperienced riders colored my perception of your post. I’ve certainly been subject to some choice insults here, I get it.

[Sdel]

@AdultEmmy

I didn’t think I’d end up in this position because I spent about 9 months or so looking for a horse. I must have tried 30 in that time. One I loved, but coth told me to pass bc he had bone spurs. I shared the X-rays and everything. And he was an ottb, believe it or not! I LOVED him, so that was devastating. Honestly I felt so safe on him.

You have to take everything CotH says in moderation and never forget to look at the horse in front of you and rely on the professionals that are actually dealing with the horse with you.

I looked for a year, sort of with a trainer, before I wound up with the unpredictable horse. He got CotH approval too.

I have since bought, through a different trainer, and am currently riding a horse that CotH told me to pass on. The horse was actually very lame at PPE and throughout our trial. I didn’t even ride this horse at trial because I didn’t trust my instincts enough.

It is a minefield out there. You can only do your best. The only thing I can say is that if you trust the current trainer then really listen to them and what they are trying to tell you about any given horse.

[Alterration]

@Sdel

I specifically made this point because while you were technically right in describing how to handle a pop up, your advice in no way took into consideration the skill level and capabilities of the person you were advising and the possibility existed for it to go horribly wrong.

That wasn’t my post. I in no way suggested that the OP ride out a pop up. What I was talking about was that it is rarely a true rear in saddlebreds and the trainer could and should be able to extinguish it quickly vs a true rear which is a very different scenario.

See, I think there’s a thing about communication in that it’s REALLY hard, especially on these threads. I’ve definitely (on long threads) mistaken one posters post for another if they had similar names or similar “beliefs”. But what you are attributing to me is untrue.

[Virginia_Horse_Mom]

He’s hanging out on a mat with me right now while chewing a bully stick. I just told him about the posts on this thread, and I swear to dog, he stopped chewing for a moment, looked at me long and hard, and then slowly and deliberately blinked out in Morse code…

T - O - R - T - U - R - E

They really are incredibly smart dogs.