Oh brother.
$2K is my hesitation.
Please.
Logic is the driver in conjunction with my vet, farrier, and multiple trainers. You seem to have missed that. My emotional reaction occurs when people misrepresent/misinterpret the information in my posts.
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His feed has changed dramatically, under vet supervision, from when he had ulcers to now. He was extremely hard to keep weight on. Now, he’s fat on pasture.
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Thank you! I really appreciate this post!
In no apparent order, this guy goes in a silver HS simple/easy bit. He graduated from a stainless steel, thicker bit which he learned to hang on. Is titanium better than silver? Interesting, a kimberwick. With a curb or jointed mouthpiece? Huh, I have a very gentle bradoon and gentle curb I could use on him to see if it helps.
Thanks, I can try the fenwick face mask. Thank you! He’s generally OK on trails with other confident horses. CONFIDENT horses (and riders). He has needed another very confident horse to help him cross water. He really responds to the “energy” of the horses he’s with.
This guy’s eyes were professionally checked, but he’s much less confident seeing things out of his right eye. Angles from each eye is something I haven’t thought about, thank you.
Thank you! I currently do not waste my money on showing this horse, it is disappointing to spend so much money when your horse won’t go near flowers on the letters and/or flowers on the judges stand, even when you arrived early to feed carrots from the judges stand and walk by the letters in both eyes. He can likely only be shown at upper levels when there’s enough on his plate to make him concentrate on the work at hand.
Thank you for your reply!
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You know, I wonder what acupuncture and traditional Chinese medicine can do for him. It can have great effects for humans who are hyper vigilant. Actually used for veterans.
Hi J-Lu, thank you for understanding my post. I really just want the best for you, especially as a fellow North Carolinian!
The Kimberwick has the regular mouthpiece with a port, the Cambridge mouthpiece. The 7/8 Arab mare who came down to the snaffle after 6 months–well I read Tom Robert’s “Horse Control and the Bit”, a really good book about bits. His explanation about the actions of the Kimberwick (solid mouthpiece, with a port, not an Uxeter, using a curb chain) on the horse’s mouth and the horse’s head inspired me to change her from the acceptable single jointed full cheek snaffle to the Kimberwick. My mare became much happier, her contact improved beyond measure, and she consented to obey my hand aids without arguments. I also could check her when she wanted to bolt with fewer harmful results to her desire for contact and the delicate tissues of her mouth.
For a long time before my MS crippled me I successfully used a regular Kimberwick whenever I looked at a horse and went “hmm, I wonder what could work with this horse for my first ride” (strange horse, no knowledge of the tack they had worn.) I especially valued the Kimberwick for riding a horse who had previous Western riding. The curb chain is there, the bit is nice and gentle, the curb chain helps prevent the mouthpiece from going too far up in the mouth and irritating the teeth, the Kimberwick is an absolutely marvelous bit to have in your tack box for those days when the Universe looks doubtful and your horse thinks everything MIGHT go haywire. And some horses prefer the Kimberwick (with a port, solid mouth) over every other bit invented by humanity.
I prefer riding in certain snaffles or the double bridle, but for me, ethically, the horse’s preference for that one certain bit is a command from the Universe to LISTEN to my horse. If the horse wants it, I will cheerfully ride the horse in a Kimberwick.
To understand about what I say about the titanium bits I must describe my hands. I have MS, with a hand tremor, lack of proprioception, bad balance, and a rather weak seat (even though it is usually a correct Forward Seat.) I do not have any difficulty with establishing contact with horses, in the past with just broken (by me), green, and ruined horses (which can be hard for a while.) My riding teachers tell me I have very good hands, luckily for the horses I know how to use them.
With the stainless steel bits I can readily use my legs, accept the forward reach of the head in my hands, and follow the motions of the horse’s head. Well timed hand aids are often obeyed promptly.
With the titanium/titanium coated bits the horses RELAX their mouths markedly. The tongue especially relaxes more, and it becomes more mobile in direct response to the hand aid. I can “tease” a horse’s head down, slightly giving and taking with loose and supple fingers and then giving just a little bit more, and out (open throatlatch). When I feel his tongue with the bit and following his tongue’s reaction, he relaxes and reaches out for the bit on his own without me having to use as much leg. Because the tongue is more relaxed the whole of the horse’s lower jaw relaxes, and the horse also moves his jaw to keep contact with the bit. The relaxed tongue and the relaxed and mobile lower jaw makes the horse delightfully light in the hand while keeping steady contact.
When I teach a new hand aid or refine an already known hand aid I get less resistance from the mouth of the horse when I use a titanium bit.
I hope this answers some of your questions. Good luck and take care!
P.S. I am REALLY looking forward to a coronavirus vaccination. Unfortunately I am allergic to eggs so I might not be able to use your vaccine. I look forward to one, eventually, that does not use eggs in production. Good work!
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I thought you mentioned he was insured when you treated him for ulcers - if he is still insured, wouldn’t that cover some of the cost? Cornell offered payment plans through Care Credit. There’s more than one way to skin a cat.
Explosiveness coinciding more with collected work + no images of the neck = I’d want to see the neck. I guess you could radiograph it for less money, but the benefit of the bone scan is it might show you something you never suspected in a totally unexpected area.
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I work on all kinds of things inside and outside the barn to desensitize my horses. Flapping hanging tarps and pool noodles, wobbly noisy surfaces, wind chime corner…etc. I ride toward ‘danger’…my horses kinda know that if they perk up their ears at something…then OFF we’ll go right up to it. But then, i’m a trainer…so
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Although the down side to a bone scan is if the neck lights up you still have to go radiograph and/or ultrasound the neck. The potential upside is you don’t go chasing images of the whole horse in case it’s not the neck. Having done a bone scan that provided a whole lot of no answers, I’m not sure I’d go that route again (and mine was more expensive–although was mostly covered by insurance–because we wound up retaking a whole series of spinal images that turned out to show no changes from ones we did 2 years prior). I could image, block, and medicate a lot of the horse using other means for less money. But I have also seen cases where a bone scan turned out to be very worth it to the owners.
FWIW, I had very good luck recently (last week) with a bone scan - it answered a bunch of questions. I know it’s a gamble, but when it works I think it’s incredibly worthwhile? I would have wasted the same amount in subsequent lameness exams that potentially wouldn’t have helped…
He isn’t “explosive” with collected work, He gets spooky, I wish you wouldn’t re-write the narrative.
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Please. You’ve ignored what this horse and I have done. I suspect you’ve never ridden a horse like this. We work with very qualified trainers, which you seem to ignore.
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He’s not lame at all, and this is an “exploratory” treatment rather than a responsive treatment. Ummmmm, no, insurance companies don’t cover this for a sound horse.
They will cover it unless they don’t cover diagnostics. Your vet can write something up that there are behavior issues that lead to a suspicion of a physical cause. Ask me how I know…
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FWIW, my horse’s issue mostly presented as “behavioral” under saddle as well. The most sore she ever looked was a 1 on the trot, only when it was super irritated after it was terrible for the hopping and anger under saddle.
Not opining on the insurance factor - I paid out of pocket and it was worth it for me, though obviously I’d feel differently if I took that step and still didn’t have answers. I was just frustrated as hell and knew my horse was in pain - felt good to have that validated when other veterinary exams weren’t giving me that information.
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Girl. [edit]. I’ve read every response on every page and when you say he splays his front end and spooks so hard you bail out, repeatedly, over 6+ years, it’s really not necessary to split hairs between “explosive” and “spooky”. Don’t ask people for help if you’re gonna [edit] when they offer it.
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Ditto.
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I’ve been clicker training my spooky horse since he first started taking treats (almost 16 years now), and my spooky mule for 21 years, and have no idea whether it’s helped with the fear issues or not. I suspect it’s helped simply because it’s helped open my eyes to ideas that I don’t think I would have ever considered if I’d stuck with primarily pressure/release.
I’ve also noticed that several others have mentioned Arab crosses, which is basically what I have. My horse’s dam has 2 Arab sires in her recent pedigree, and she’s reactive, and both her sons are the same. They all have their talents, but calm and steady aren’t the first ones that come to mind.
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Well then what do your very qualified trainers say to do about this?
How have the rides been over the past month? Any progress?
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