I bought a horse who seemed to have no show record prior to 2017, even though I know he had shown prior to 2017. I did some detective work and found that he had been showing under a different name, with a different owner, and different usef number. A few details were different such as different DOB but correct Year, and only sire stated under one number, dam and sire under other number. I happen to know that the two different owners had been in a relationship that ended. Has anyone ever heard of this happening? It doesn’t matter to me, but it does make me wonder what the circumstances were. I’m not willing to get in touch with the previous owners over this, I’m just curious!
I know someone who flat out lied to get a horse a second USEF number to show him when his previous owner thought he was sold as a retired trail horse. I’d like everyone to know this person is not a friend.
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This was a pretty common occurrence, at least before microchips were required. I have no idea if USEF now runs a microchip check to make sure the horse isn’t already registered.
Often nothing nefarious, especially if it was more than a few years ago.
Someone would get a horse that was already recorded and decide that it was easier or cheaper or something just to get a whole new number and maybe even a brand new name. You have to jump through a few hoops to get a change of ownership (and maybe pay money??). Easier to just forge a new ID for the horse. One scenario was when a trainer would be doing entries at the show, get told that the horse didn’t have an ID number, and it was just easier to fill out the paperwork for a new ID (usually without a lot of details such as sire and dam and birthdate) than to do a change of owner on the spot, especially with a long line of irritated exhibitors lined up.
I was doing entries for a friend whose daughter’s short stirrup horse had been shown in GP’s back in the day and had been a well-known breeding stallion. Obviously not a stallion at this point. I had carefully looked up his old USEF number and used it to fill out the entries. Horse show office people initially didn’t believe me that it was the same horse, then had me fill out paperwork because he was still recorded under his old owner, etc. Would have been way easier just to reinvent him.
Sometimes someone was trying to forge a new ID for the horse for a nefarious reason–erasing a show record, re-creating a green hunter, taking a few years off the age, etc. I imagine this is harder with microchips and age verification (for the horse age classes such as young jumpers).
If it bothers you, you can call the horse recording division at USEF and see what you need to do to consolidate the records under one name
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That sounds like an amazing short stirrup horse!
I think you’re right, nothing Nefarious. I’m not from the states. I didn’t realize how easy it was to change horse ID before microchip number was required. One of his ID numbers included microchip number and one didn’t.
That’s terrible!
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This thread is one of the primary reasons we use a breed that requires DNA to register the horse to prove parentage and the horse is shown under its registered name.
One can call their horse anything they want but for records it is to be shown under its registered name.
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This applies to breed shows. Take the same horse to an open show and people can claim what they want. I’ve read many TBs “lost” their papers and suddenly were unregistered WBs in the H/J shows.
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Back before microchips and easy internet access it was pretty common to have horses get more than one USEF number.
I remember going to a show and finding out it was rated when we thought it was a fun show. Because of that I didn’t have any info on my horses USEF number. The office just told us to fill out a new USEF registration form and don’t worry about it. So I know for a fact one of my horses has a second USEF number with exactly one show record on it floating around out there.
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Echoing what others have said, this used to be super common. Many times it was completely innocent because a horse’s history/identity failed to follow him correctly. Sometimes nefarious to make a horse eligible for classes he would not otherwise be eligible for, or to hide an undesirable history, or to turn a profit selling an ancient horse.
Hopefully this will become a thing of the past as microchips become ubiquitous.
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My history with microchips goes back to the very early use, my company was a sub contractor for Texas Instruments working in the development of uses for RFID technology (chips that stored data)
Sole reliance upon a “chip” for positive ID is a problem as chips can be duplicated … two or more chips can be given the same identification
microchip numbers can be duplicates. More than one animal can have the same identification number. The USDA (US Department of Agriculture) knows about this problem, but nothing has been done.
with the current environment of horse pricing/costs to me it would not be unreasonable for someone to replace a horse of value who was lost due to an injury/accident with a stand in that is chipped the same as the lost one
That is why USEF requires microchip numbers (at least for Hunters and jumpers),
But I do not know if they (USEF or show) scan the horse to check that it really has the correct chip.
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There are more half-Arab ponies out there disguised as Welsh X than many people think.
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I’m sure there are a lot of “unknown” breeding listed that are actually registered when you dig deep enough.
TBs, Appendix QH, Morgan’s ect. become whatever it takes to get the $$$.
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And even full Arab.
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Years ago, a good friend sold her Arab/Clyde X to a dealer–with his 1/2 Arab papers.
Sometime after that, a dressage trainer friend called her and said, “I think one of my students owns Max.”
Friend said, “well easy enough to tell–he’s freezemarked.” (That’s how long ago this was!)
She said she’d sold him with papers, and new owner was welcome to contact her if she needed history on the horse.
O called and said she had not been given papers w/Max, but was told he was an Anglo-Trakehner from Ohio.
Friend said, no, he’s an Arab/Clyde from Pennsylvania.
She offered to provide a letter to the AHR stating the papers were lost so O could register him if she wanted.
O was reluctant–apparently resistant to the idea she might own a part-Arab.
Friend pointed out possibility of USDF All-Breed Awards, IAHA year end high point awards, resale possibilities, etc., and she did finally register him under her name.
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That, too!
I grew upon a farm where we were breeding a responsible number of Arabian foals each year, but our trainer was one of those serial/hoarder style breeders with over a hundred on the property at any time. Mostly a lot of desirable, old, Crabbet bloodlines, but 3/4 of the foals born on any given year were complete garbage by AHA show standards.
The “nice” ones would go on to the weanling/yearling in hand classes and eventually go on to under saddle careers.
The junky ones would become unbroke breeding stock ( 
) or get sold cheaply around the community. But the thing was, while they weren’t typey or super correct, they usually were athletic little things with a nice jump. Many would pop up in the pony hunter classes sporting suspiciously quiet tails.
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Sorry I can’t figure Out how to reply to someone’s post while showing what they posted?
This is a jumper. The switchover between the previous owners occurred around 5 years ago, one record has the chip number and one doesn’t. Not sure what the requirent rules were at that time? It looks like he was registered around 2015 without a chip number.
Hit reply and then tne cartoon conversation bubble thing.
Replies to the post immediately above won’t even show who you’re responding to, assuming that the world knows it’s the previous post.
Video demo:
IMG_1695
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This happened with my old horse back before microchips. The horse was from Canada and we were not aware it was already registered.
I will say it was a major pain to get USEF to correct. I think it took well over a year (I think more to be honest) with multiple emails and follow up, sending documents etc to get USEF to correct it and consolidate into one USEF number. It was more complicated because I registered him under his “new” show name opposed to the barn name he had originally been registered under.
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