Horse Very Reactive to Tractors, Excavators, Skid steers, etc

[RhythmNCruise]

Okay, time for me to get some ideas from you guys. I’ll try to be as brief as possible.
Horse is a 14yo appy gelding. I’ve had him since he was a yearling. He spent about a decade growing up and learning to be a horse at my farm. My farm abutted up to some crop land. He saw tractors of all shapes and sizes. Combines. Backhoes, you name it, he saw it and ignored it. When I’d mow the pastures with my small tractor and brush hog, I’d literally have to get the towel out of my seat and wave it around the top of my head yelling to get him and his older pasture mates to get the heck out of the way. The tractor lived in the barn where they had access 24/7. It just wasn’t a thing. Heck, crop dusters flew over the crop fields and…no big thing.

Sold the farm, moved to boarding barn #1. Horse was okay for a few months, then slowly became more reactive and unsettled. I distinctly remember riding him past some guys using a dump trailer to dump gravel out on the driveway. It made a horrible noise. He flicked an ear sideways and walked on. Pfft. By the time I left that barn, he would stop, spin, snort, and lose his mind if he’d seen something like that.

Did a lot of diet and physical changes (feet angles fixed, magnesium added, low NSC feed, saddle fit fixed, etc) because there was pain in play (back pain). Horse improved.

Moved horse to boarding barn #2 (right beside boarding barn #1). Horse was immediately more settled. BUT, when heavy equipment appeared across the street (and I mean, there’s a 5 acre field between him and the street, this was NOT close), Mr. Horse got kind of looky and antsy. Weird. But he dealt. Then came the equipment to take down the covered arena. Horse was not happy at all at first, but eventually he got used to it. I could ride him up to the equipment when it wasn’t running and he was fine. I could ride near the equipment when it was running. No issue.

Moved horse to boarding barn #3. The first night he was there, for some reason a skid steer getting a bucketload of sand near the end of his small paddock (as in, he could’ve walked up and put his nose on the pile of sand and the skid steer) blew. his. mind. I arrived at the barn to feed him and he was in total meltdown mode and about to try to jump out of the paddock. I couldn’t understand it. He’d never been so “checked out” in his life over something. He was literally terrified. Shaking. Heart beating so hard I could see it.

He has never totally recovered from this and now views all tractors and equipment with serious suspicion. It’s to the point sometimes that if there is equipment working near he and his pasture mate’s barn, he will run to the back of the acre+ field (it’s a long, thin acre, so it’s a good ways back) and stand there blowing and fretting. I came out one afternoon not long ago and it had been a hot day (87). When he saw me he whinnied (trotting around at the very back of the field). The excavator was working a good…I don’t know, 100 yards past the barn. I went and got him and he was lathered from running and fretting. I led him up to the barn and he tried repeatedly to turn and flee, but I kept him with me. I managed to get him into one of the stalls (farthest from the machinery, which…as I’ve established, wasn’t that close). He dove to the water bucket and drank it nearly dry. The silly goosed was so afraid of the excavator he wouldn’t even come up to drink! I mean…that’s dangerous!

The crazy part is, his pasture mate, pays NO attention to this stuff. She could not care less. Meanwhile, my dude is hiding behind her, acting like the world is about to end.

It’s just so weird because he is literally the ONLY horse (out of 15 on the farm) who has this issue. No other horses pay any attention to the equipment.

I’ve tried ignoring him, leading him to the stuff when it’s not running, trying to soothe him, getting after him. It’s to the point that he’ll refuse to go places if he remembers equipment being there. Like…crazy stuff.

I know groundwork is what he needs. I just want to do it right and not make him MORE afraid and stressed than he is already. In all other aspects of his life, he’s a chill dude! And he used to be chill about this too, but…wow.

What do you guys think? I’m past worrying about the WHY behind it. His appa-screw-loosa brain just isn’t going to give me any answers. I want to help him overcome his fear. He’s too good a boy to have this roadblock. Besides, there is a LOT of machinery working at this farm. I keep thinking he’ll just finally get used to it, but man…he’s been there for a little over three months and while he’s not quite as explosively reactive and deathly afraid anymore, he still isn’t happy with it. Tonight, he couldn’t even eat his dinner in peace because he was too busy gawking at the tractor tilling up a lot a couple of pastures away. Just a normal tractor doing normal things. He’s staring at it like it’s surely going to murder him.

So what? Clicker training? Do I need to rewatch Warwick Schiller? Give me some advice, COTH.

(Sorry it was longer than I’d hoped. Thanks for reading.)

[Scribbler]

@RhythmNCruise

Okay, time for me to get some ideas from you guys. I’ll try to be as brief as possible.
Horse is a 14yo appy gelding. I’ve had him since he was a yearling. He spent about a decade growing up and learning to be a horse at my farm. My farm abutted up to some crop land. He saw tractors of all shapes and sizes. Combines. Backhoes, you name it, he saw it and ignored it. When I’d mow the pastures with my small tractor and brush hog, I’d literally have to get the towel out of my seat and wave it around the top of my head yelling to get him and his older pasture mates to get the heck out of the way. The tractor lived in the barn where they had access 24/7. It just wasn’t a thing. Heck, crop dusters flew over the crop fields and…no big thing.

Sold the farm, moved to boarding barn #1. Horse was okay for a few months, then slowly became more reactive and unsettled. I distinctly remember riding him past some guys using a dump trailer to dump gravel out on the driveway. It made a horrible noise. He flicked an ear sideways and walked on. Pfft. By the time I left that barn, he would stop, spin, snort, and lose his mind if he’d seen something like that.

Did a lot of diet and physical changes (feet angles fixed, magnesium added, low NSC feed, saddle fit fixed, etc) because there was pain in play (back pain). Horse improved.

Moved horse to boarding barn #2 (right beside boarding barn #1). Horse was immediately more settled. BUT, when heavy equipment appeared across the street (and I mean, there’s a 5 acre field between him and the street, this was NOT close), Mr. Horse got kind of looky and antsy. Weird. But he dealt. Then came the equipment to take down the covered arena. Horse was not happy at all at first, but eventually he got used to it. I could ride him up to the equipment when it wasn’t running and he was fine. I could ride near the equipment when it was running. No issue.

Moved horse to boarding barn #3. The first night he was there, for some reason a skid steer getting a bucketload of sand near the end of his small paddock (as in, he could’ve walked up and put his nose on the pile of sand and the skid steer) blew. his. mind. I arrived at the barn to feed him and he was in total meltdown mode and about to try to jump out of the paddock. I couldn’t understand it. He’d never been so “checked out” in his life over something. He was literally terrified. Shaking. Heart beating so hard I could see it.

He has never totally recovered from this and now views all tractors and equipment with serious suspicion. It’s to the point sometimes that if there is equipment working near he and his pasture mate’s barn, he will run to the back of the acre+ field (it’s a long, thin acre, so it’s a good ways back) and stand there blowing and fretting. I came out one afternoon not long ago and it had been a hot day (87). When he saw me he whinnied (trotting around at the very back of the field). The excavator was working a good…I don’t know, 100 yards past the barn. I went and got him and he was lathered from running and fretting. I led him up to the barn and he tried repeatedly to turn and flee, but I kept him with me. I managed to get him into one of the stalls (farthest from the machinery, which…as I’ve established, wasn’t that close). He dove to the water bucket and drank it nearly dry. The silly goosed was so afraid of the excavator he wouldn’t even come up to drink! I mean…that’s dangerous!

The crazy part is, his pasture mate, pays NO attention to this stuff. She could not care less. Meanwhile, my dude is hiding behind her, acting like the world is about to end.

It’s just so weird because he is literally the ONLY horse (out of 15 on the farm) who has this issue. No other horses pay any attention to the equipment.

I’ve tried ignoring him, leading him to the stuff when it’s not running, trying to soothe him, getting after him. It’s to the point that he’ll refuse to go places if he remembers equipment being there. Like…crazy stuff.

I know groundwork is what he needs. I just want to do it right and not make him MORE afraid and stressed than he is already. In all other aspects of his life, he’s a chill dude! And he used to be chill about this too, but…wow.

What do you guys think? I’m past worrying about the WHY behind it. His appa-screw-loosa brain just isn’t going to give me any answers. I want to help him overcome his fear. He’s too good a boy to have this roadblock. Besides, there is a LOT of machinery working at this farm. I keep thinking he’ll just finally get used to it, but man…he’s been there for a little over three months and while he’s not quite as explosively reactive and deathly afraid anymore, he still isn’t happy with it. Tonight, he couldn’t even eat his dinner in peace because he was too busy gawking at the tractor tilling up a lot a couple of pastures away. Just a normal tractor doing normal things. He’s staring at it like it’s surely going to murder him.

So what? Clicker training? Do I need to rewatch Warwick Schiller? Give me some advice, COTH.

(Sorry it was longer than I’d hoped. Thanks for reading.)

I feel like there’s got to be a pain or neurological issue brewing. The equipment is just the occasion that it gets called up.

Being an appie prone to vision issues have you checked his eyes?

[sherian]

being an appy have you checked his eyesight? Otherwise time and exposure and some positive reinforcement - I would think his turn out buddy being calm should help in the long run?

[luvmyhackney]

Have you treated for ulcers as a test and added some magnesium or alfalfa to sooth the tummy? It sounds like something’s hurting and the equipment is just pushing it over the edge.

Otherwise I agree with the WS videos. Plus how’s your anxiety and stress level?

[OverandOnward]

I don’t know for sure, but …

One of my horses who was fairly tame to the world suddenly developed a huge over-reaction to everything. At the time there was machine work going on about 50 ft from his stall window, and he didn’t like it at all. He was actually on turnout all day far away from this clatter. But the project was on an urgent deadline and ran until 9 pm daily, with lights and noise and bother.

The horse just lost it. He was doing the thing where he’s in his stall and still trying to run away, and had to be moved every night until the project knocked off at 9 pm. And there was a carryover effect, it became difficult to ride him because every small noise or sight brought a giant reaction that was not safe for a rider.

Treated for ulcers – the big treatment, ranitidine at least twice a day, in quantity in liquid down his throat – and it worked.

He settled down right away with the high-powered ulcer meds. He gave me no trouble about taking all that liquid. I suspect the relief was quick and he was all about it.

Once the big project near his stall window was completed, everything settled and his behavior returned to normal. No more need for ulcer meds.

[RhythmNCruise]

Thanks for the replies so far, everyone.

Eyes are good. Because he’s an appy (appy QH cross actually) I do keep an…um…eye…on his eyes, lol. Sometimes I think he sees TOO good, lol. And it is literally only when he SEES the machinery. He can hear it all day long and ignore it. Gunshots? No problem. Fireworks? Meh. He’s not bothered by noises. Maybe he’s deaf??? No…when I whistle he looks up. When a horse whinnies he whinnies back. Dang. I thought I was onto something.

I have never had him scoped for ulcers or treated him for them in earnest. I think it might be time. Lord knows he’s a worrier, and between the loss of his old buddies at my place, the move from his “childhood” home to boarding barn #1, and now the move to boarding barn #3 with all the big machines, if he doesn’t have ulcers I don’t know how. He doesn’t look like a horse with ulcers. He’s broad as the side of a barn, shiny, slick coat. He has on occasion been a bit sensitive and snarky about me grooming his flanks (other times…doesn’t care).

Oh, and he has been on Equioxx for over a year now. In fact, I had noticed an uptick in his sensitive flank stuff and dropped him back from a pill a day to a half a pill a day. Then I took him off completely not long after we moved to the new barn in an effort to remove anything that could be causing him issues. And he was fine until one day I noticed him a little stiffer when trying to lay down. BUT, he had been steadily calming down with the removal of the Equioxx. I forgot about that!

Ulcers. I bet they’re the culprit. I may try stopping the Equioxx again. He gets his last Adequan shot tomorrow and that should keep him comfy enough to be a very low-impact trail horse that lives in a pasture with a cushy stall at his disposal 24/7.

I will pull that Equioxx totally tomorrow and maybe at least get a few tubes of Ulcergard. I know I can’t heal ulcers with just a few tubes, but will it at least allow me to see if that helps, so I know if I need to bite the bullet and do the whole treatment?

Ulcers. Equioxx. I’m such a dingaling!

[RhythmNCruise]

And I just realized that I had the vet give him Banamine today before his vaccinations. I always do that because he can get a little punk feeling after his shots. I totally forgot about him being on the Equioxx. Hopefully, that didn’t do too much damage. Poor guy.

[OverandOnward]

Mine didn’t look like he had ulcers, either. He kept his strong figure and shiny coat. Maybe it takes time for the physical symptoms to develop? I didn’t guess that with him right away either, someone had to tell me to check. He had never had an ulcer issue before.

Your Ulcergaurd ‘test’ might tell you something.

I’m not terribly experienced with ulcers, just the one go-round. But it was amazing the level of relief the meds provided.

[RhythmNCruise]

I’ve ordered him seven tubes of Ulcergard. I have one here at the house too, so I’ll give him that tomorrow. The others will be here Wednesday. It can’t hurt, I guess.

It has to be something. A horse doesn’t just go from being indifferent to farm equipment to being a nervous wreck about it for no reason. I’m hoping it’s ulcers. Please let it be that simple.

[LCDR]

Any chance there is MSM somewhere in his diet - feed, supplements? A rare side effect is anxiety.

[RhythmNCruise]

No…I nixed the MSM about two months ago after reading about possible reactiveness from it.

He eats soaked timothy pellets with KIS Trace forage balancer, magnesium, salt, Probios, Omega Horseshine, a squirt of CocoSun oil from Ukele (new addition), timothy/orchard hay, and all the (currently sparse, will be decent soon) pasture he wants (out 24/7).

[RhythmNCruise]

And he’s a chunk of a horse. 16 hands and built like this. (comes from halter and western pleasure lines). This pic was taken in December. If anything, he’s gained fitness and weight since. He’s a solid boi

[endlessclimb]

Sometimes things far away are actually scarier to a horse than things close up. There’s a horse at the farm that’s ok with all of the haying equipment going right next to his turnout, but loses his gourd over the combine running about half a mile away. I had a similar problem with my late mare once when she spotted someone working a horse about a mile out at the top of a ridge. She was a MESS.

That doesn’t fully explain your guy, though. He appears as if he might be food motivated (lol) so I would go there with this problem, if the U-gard doesn’t make a dent. I would be conscious of making sure all the good things (walk breaks, snacks, etc) happen when he’s near the equipment - practice both facing the equipment and relaxing, and facing AWAY from the equipment and relaxing (while still being very near to it).

If that doesn’t work, I’d be a big meanie pants and tie him in a rope halter to a blocker ring with a big bag of the richest alfalfa you can find in front of him while the equipment is running (while supervising of course). Sometimes zooming around, they just get more and more and more worked up and can’t figure out a way back down. Tying, with the motivation of “ooh alfalfa,” will help him learn to not move his feet when he sees equipment.

[RhythmNCruise]

Why, whatever would make you think he’s food motivated? LOL! He is, but that’s one of the worries. When the mean machines are threatening, he won’t eat. Not a treat, not alfalfa (which also makes him a bit hot, so I’d need to find something else), not his breakfast/dinner.
He’ll do “drive by” snatches of his feed or hay while alternating between running toward the threat with head in the sky, eyes bugged out, and then retreating (“Nope, nope, nope…”) And most of this is at a trot. He’s not an energetic horse at all. Very conservative and would rather NOT be like this I’m sure. One doesn’t maintain his robust figure by wasting effort running around and not eating.

I’m definitely going to try the part about giving him breaks and treats near the equipment. I’ve actually done that some when riding. I’ll choose a spot next to a parked piece of equipment to dismount and praise, loosen his girth, give him a treat, take him back to untack, etc. And I think it kind of works for him. When I was consistent, I think I noticed a difference, but only with the parked equipment. But that’s still progress. And I have ridden him near the “normal” tractor while it’s running and he did okay. It’s like it depends on…I don’t know.

Just got back from feeding breakfast. He’s happy as a clam. All the machinery is silent this morning, LOL. I think the excavator is gone from the property, but some new thing is there that I assume is going to work on the driveway today. They’re likely to be working near his barn again at some point as there are piles of sand and dirt. I almost wish they would park the stuff IN HIS FREAKING PASTURE so he could just get over it. But it’s sporadic. There will be a lot of work for a week or so, and then the equipment is gone off property to do another job (BO is a contractor).

Anyway, he had a full tube of Ulcergard before breakfast and I removed his half a pill of Equioxx. I’d like to ride today, but that will depend on the activity of the machinery, LOL. I figure it’ll either be a nice riding day or a good day for some desensitization groundwork with scary machines.

And he definitely moves his feet when he sees equipment. You’re right, I need to teach him not to do that. He’s so funny to watch in the pasture. It’s like…he just can’t help himself. You can tell he’s not a horse that wants to run, so he trots slowly away until he thinks he’s safe. Stares. Trots back. Stares. Nope. Trots away. Maybe eats for a minute. Trots in a circle. It’s a slow little trot. Definitely not the kind of antics a spooked or excited horse usually displays. Just…“I can’t be still with that thing going over there.”

You know what else is interesting? I know his sire and some of his half-siblings also by his sire. His sire and at least one of his half-siblings is (was) a weaver when stalled and at all anxious. Like…major weavers. At shows his half-sister had to be tied in the stall or she’d weave nonstop. I wonder if that’s an inherited trait? When Milton is stalled and anxious (I do my best NEVER to stall him, but he can be fine about it as long as he’s not anxious), he walks the stall terribly and almost looks like he could start weaving.

Hmmm. I think I’ll get a blocker tie ring. I want a tie ring on the post of the barn/run-in anyway, and that would be a good kind to have.

[RedHorses]

Warwick Schiller. Rabbit practice.

It’s a way of helping the horse learn to manage his own anxiety and assess the worrisome things rather than just react to them.

BTW “rabbit practice” is my term for it, not WS’s.

[RhythmNCruise]

Yes, I’ve heard/read about “rabbit practice” and I think I have watched the videos about it with WS, but it’s been a while and I need to revisit them. Thanks for the reminder!

[OverandOnward]

@RhythmNCruise

When the mean machines are threatening, he won’t eat. Not a treat, not alfalfa (which also makes him a bit hot, so I’d need to find something else), not his breakfast/dinner.

That was another thing that happened when my horse was overtaken by ulcers. When the disturbance was going, he wouldn’t even acknowledge food. Or treats. Or someone holding his halter trying to help him calm down.

And he was also a well-built boi who loved his meals and treats more than anything. And he loved people bringing him treats.

[RhythmNCruise]

Ah, interesting.
I’m thinking ulcers have to at least have a part in this.
I just watched WS’s video about the rabbits and it makes so much sense. When my guy was at my place, which was “home” to him for a decade, he had the benefit of two older geldings that weren’t reactive and who raised him from a yearling to live life on my farm. From them he learned that tractors, combines, etc. were no biggie. Once they were gone and he moved away from basically the only home he ever knew, the holes in my training of him were revealed. I never had to worry about “rabbits” with him while raising and training him, because he never saw anything that he couldn’t almost immediately let go of. Even when we started going to shows, he’d be anxious when we arrived, but by the end of the weekend he was pretty fine with it all. And goodness knows the giant tractor that dragged the indoor coliseum could drive right past him and he wouldn’t even flick an ear.

I think the “rabbits” started stacking up the day his BFF was buried in front of him. Then he got moved away from home. Then his feed changed. He never gelled with any of the horses at the new barn. The saddle didn’t fit. His feet were having issues. He had back issues. He lost weight (imagine that!). I moved him to the farm next door and things started improving, but I don’t think some of those past “rabbits” were ever let go of. And I think that’s because I haven’t taught him how to let go of them. So, he can temporarily be “fine” when the world is working in his favor, but any “rabbit” introduced to him puts him over his limit again.

He’s very fond of his mare friend, and even though he behaves when I take him away from her for riding, groundwork, etc, she’s always calling for him and I think that is probably a “rabbit” too. He rarely answers her (maybe twice in all the times they’ve been separated over the past three months), but that doesn’t mean it’s not something he’s got stacked up in there along with ulcers, machines, new home, etc.

Interestingly, he’s not scared of rabbits, LOL. Or deer. We have a big herd of about 20 deer on the farm that are often in the pastures with the horses in the mornings and around sunset. He doesn’t care about them. When we’re riding in the woods, if we spook up a group of deer, he might flinch or spook in place, but he lets it go almost immediately when he realizes it’s deer. Which is kind of fun. They let us get very close to them. So pretty.

I also watched WS’s cognitive behavior therapy video. It makes so much sense. As someone who has anxiety myself and has had panic attacks, I can relate to what his wife goes through and what horses with anxiety go through. One of the first steps that really helped me with Milton’s anxiety a few years ago was getting MY anxiety managed. That made a huge difference in my life and certainly with the horse because his anxiety would make me anxious and it would snowball. And I don’t mean anxious like I was scared of it. I was just so determined to “fix it” that I would make myself anxious if I couldn’t. It’s one of the things I’m aware of now. Sitting here typing this, I want to go right to the barn now and “fix” his issues. Get the rope halter and go to work doing groundwork and helping him let go of some “rabbits.” But I’m forcing myself to wait because I know that’s the anxiety trying to take over. I need to keep MY feet still. LOL.

[RhythmNCruise]

Had a good ride. I took it easy since he had his spring shots yesterday. We rode around the scary (parked) machinery. He didn’t want to, but he didn’t put up much of a fight. It may have been the vaccinations keeping him placid. Whatever, I say. His face said, “I’m not happy about this,” but he stayed put. Actually reached out and touched his nose to the machine. We left it then and rode around the farm and came back. He went to the machine easier this time. Almost like he knew what I wanted, and was trying to do right even though he was clearly not a fan of it. I made sure to get off of him as soon as he stood beside it (actually between it and a dump truck he used to hate) semi-relaxed. As soon as I hopped off he licked and chewed, I praised him, loosened his girth and led him away. He was a little wary of it still behind him, so I had him stand with his butt to it and asked him to lower his head and relax. As soon as he did, praise and we walked on.

I think there is hope. Bless him, he wants to be a good boy.

ETA: I need a treat pouch that I can have attached to my saddle. I have a western saddle, so no problems attaching something. That way I can give +R as soon as he does something good.

[OverandOnward]

That sounds like an awesome ride !!!

One of the best things about desensitizing is the relief it brings to the horse. Even though this anxiety is part of being a horse, I suspect that it is highly uncomfortable to them, even physically painful, just as it is to us.