Hunter Myths - Spin-off of the Left Sided Mane - UPDATE: ARTICLE IS OUT!

[JenEM]

@fordtraktor

When I was showing in Zone 3 in the 90s, it was practically a crime/you didn’t fit in unless you rode in one of those Beval therapeutic pads with no shaped pad under. Trends change!

I feel like at least half of the things listed are trends that have come/gone within the showing lifetimes of many BB members. When I was a kid in the 80s, everything went in fullcheeks. In the late 90s/early 2000s, everything had one of those Beval halfpads. Everyone also had puke green TS and those awful GPAs.

Now, could I legally, under the attire rules, walk into the ring in a stripey GPA and puke green TS and a Beval pad? Sure. But odds are if you’re walking in the ring like that, you’ve been out of the ring a while. Even locally you don’t see folks turned out like that.

I actually participate in the last formal appointments class in the rulebook–ladies’ sidesaddle. And for that I do take turnout very seriously. But then that does make me want to have a little more fun with attire when I’m not specifically being judged on my glove color and earring choice–I’ve pinned at As in rust breeches, and non-white shirts, and in a pelham. But if you walk in the ring and stand out for whatever reason, you have to back it up with the ride, and make yourself look like you’re standing out a little because you’re just that good and you want the judge to really notice.

[Mukluk]

I just don’t have the conformity to fit in in hunter land. Which is why I prefer jumpers and eventing. Plus my horse is an OTTB. Though I know some have been successful hunters they certainly don’t seem to be the preferred breed.

[TheMoo]

@Mukluk

I just don’t have the conformity to fit in in hunter land. Which is why I prefer jumpers and eventing. Plus my horse is an OTTB. Though I know some have been successful hunters they certainly don’t seem to be the preferred breed.

I don’t mind conformity. I do think that people are too damn judgy. This thread is making me more determined to get my horse out to some local shows where the A/AA riders also show at. Many in zone three will clearly get the vapors as my OTTB learns the ropes in her black tack, me in my dress boots, and my non-tech fabric coat because wool doesn’t make me look like a stuffed sausage.

She will be braided on the correct side and my saddle pad is fitted.

[Mukluk]

A novel idea about braiding. How about alternating sides for each braid, left, right, left? It would certainly be original and refreshing.

[TheMoo]

@Mukluk

A novel idea about braiding. How about alternating sides for each braid, left, right, left? It would certainly be original and refreshing.

Don’t tempt me with a good time! :lol:

[adelmo95]

I played in the A circuit hunter ring for the first time in about 20 years in 2018. Being an amateur on a budget I did my own braiding etc. After years of doing jumpers and dressage I had gotten into the habit of doing big braids so when it came to trying hunter braids my first show despite my best efforts the braids were HUGE for hunter land. That being said they were tight, and my horse was shiny, and well turned out other than the braids looking a little funny. I forgot to mention the braids were also on the left hand side :eek:. I was competing against people who were either excellent braiders themselves or who had hired braiders, either way I had braid envy because they looked spectacular. Despite the fact that I had a huge appreciation for how nice properly done hunter braids could look (and worked towards mine looking that nice throughout the year - got to the point where my braids were mistaken for pro braids by the final horse show) I do not feel that they ever impacted my placing in the classes. Did my amateur mistakes, and my horse’s green moments impact our placings, of course… But did the braids themselves have an impact, not that I could ever tell.

For those curious about our turnout at the first show here is a video of our medal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=583fn5VL8zM . Oh I guess I went against a few other trends here: no standing martingale, D ring Nathe in the eq, and big braids on the left hand side. Please keep in mind that this is our first hunter show so I am well aware that we are not at the stage of being super competitive at the big rated shows and am NOT claiming to be. Video is just to give an idea of overall turnout and how my giant hunter braids looked.

[BigMama1]

@PonyPenny

I don’t get the point of this. Dressage certainly has its traditions about turnout and tack too, especially at rated dressage shows. I have also meant many dressage riders who have no idea why their horse goes in a flash nose band or loose ring snaffle, only that their trainer told them that was what was best for their horse. Dressage riders can be pretty ignorant too. Don’t think you are so special.

I have scribed at a LOT of dressage shows, and particularly at the lower levels have seen all combinations of tack and apparel, including horses and riders turned out for the hunter ring (sans martingale of course). As long as the horse and rider looked neat and tidy, I have only once heard a judge make any comment about tack or turnout and don’t believe the side of the mane you braid on, or whether your breeches are beige or white have any effect on dressage scores.

The one comment I did hear was when a rider with very busy hands that wagged the horse’s head from side to side constantly, opted to outfit said horse in a lurid lime green fly bonnet. The wagging head was the underlying issue but it was most definitely magnified by the fly veil and the judge mentioned it was an “unfortunate choice.”

So while many dressage riders may well choose certain pieces of tack or equipment because it’s what “everyone else” has, I think the difference is that nobody expects those choices to affect placings or scores.

[TheMoo]

@BigMama1 excellent post!

[eclipse]

@adelmo95

I played in the A circuit hunter ring for the first time in about 20 years in 2018. Being an amateur on a budget I did my own braiding etc. After years of doing jumpers and dressage I had gotten into the habit of doing big braids so when it came to trying hunter braids my first show despite my best efforts the braids were HUGE for hunter land. That being said they were tight, and my horse was shiny, and well turned out other than the braids looking a little funny. I forgot to mention the braids were also on the left hand side :eek:. I was competing against people who were either excellent braiders themselves or who had hired braiders, either way I had braid envy because they looked spectacular. Despite the fact that I had a huge appreciation for how nice properly done hunter braids could look (and worked towards mine looking that nice throughout the year - got to the point where my braids were mistaken for pro braids by the final horse show) I do not feel that they ever impacted my placing in the classes. Did my amateur mistakes, and my horse’s green moments impact our placings, of course… But did the braids themselves have an impact, not that I could ever tell.

For those curious about our turnout at the first show here is a video of our medal: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=583fn5VL8zM . Oh I guess I went against a few other trends here: no standing martingale, D ring Nathe in the eq, and big braids on the left hand side. Please keep in mind that this is our first hunter show so I am well aware that we are not at the stage of being super competitive at the big rated shows and am NOT claiming to be. Video is just to give an idea of overall turnout and how my giant hunter braids looked.

Hey I know that ring! I was in the adult amateurs probably that same show LOL

[adelmo95]

@eclipse

Hey I know that ring! I was in the adult amateurs probably that same show LOL

There is a very good chance that we were as I ended up doing 3 of the shows last year

[PNWjumper]

@TooManyBays

Yeah, I’ve seen that too. I think that usually a black saddle with dark brown bridle isn’t super noticeable, especially in French or Italian leather. I was more talking about matching black saddle and bridle… usually they also have a flash on too and a square saddle pad… then wonder why they didn’t place very well.

You’ve proven my point exactly, though. A black piece of tack (or even multiple) is NOT the issue. But black [other discipline] tack + a flash + the wrong saddle pad is a whole different story. Add in “green” riding, and it’s the whole picture. One discrepancy from the norm is generally not noticed. Pile up a few, however, and suddenly you stand out (and not usually for the better).

But to that point, doing something differently and then ROCKING IT is how new styles become “the new style,” so if you’re good enough to stand out, those “discrepancies” might just turn into the new trend.

@adelmo95 - lovely horse and lovely course. I wouldn’t have noticed the braids if you hadn’t prefaced the video with the disclosure.

[TheMoo]

Is anyone else curious to see how the brown tack, must braid on the right, omg how dare you walk into a hunter ring like that folks ride? Honestly. We know @PNWjumper can ride the pants off of a lot of us. Meup is a beautiful rider, but most having a hissy… I wonder.

And @PNWjumper I bet green rider had more to do with it than anything else.

[Can_tFindMyWhip]

@TheMoo

Is anyone else curious to see how the brown tack, must braid on the right, omg how dare you walk into a hunter ring like that folks ride? Honestly. We know @PNWjumper can ride the pants off of a lot of us. Meup is a beautiful rider, but most having a hissy… I wonder.

And @PNWjumper I bet green rider had more to do with it than anything else.

To this end, in the dressage world where excessive bling and color are pretty commonplace, but there is a little bit of an unspoken rule that you have to earn the right to wear wild stuff. You don’t want to look like you spent all of your money on patent leather everything and a custom show coat, and then skimped on training. I always brought my old fashioned navy Pikeur dressage coat with me to horse shows just in case we had a bad warm up, and we didn’t “deserve” the modern, burgundy coat or blingy browband.

It would be interesting to see what hunter riders who are at the top of their game could get away with. If they have the skill and nice horses to ride, it could really put an end to all of these people complaining that certain labels are necessary to win in this particular ring.

[TooManyBays]

@PNWjumper

You’ve proven my point exactly, though. A black piece of tack (or even multiple) is NOT the issue. But black [other discipline] tack + a flash + the wrong saddle pad is a whole different story. Add in “green” riding, and it’s the whole picture. One discrepancy from the norm is generally not noticed. Pile up a few, however, and suddenly you stand out (and not usually for the better).

But to that point, doing something differently and then ROCKING IT is how new styles become “the new style,” so if you’re good enough to stand out, those “discrepancies” might just turn into the new trend.

@adelmo95 - lovely horse and lovely course. I wouldn’t have noticed the braids if you hadn’t prefaced the video with the disclosure.

Oh I’m not disagreeing with you at all. But it seems that many people, whether green or just feeling like rebelling, will do crazy stuff then get angry or depressed when they place badly.
Whether people like it or not, it’s a sport of traditions. If you want to have your hair in a ponytail, use square colored pads, show in a hackamore, etc, go do jumpers. you will have so much more fun there.

[doublesstable]

@222orchids

I’m doomed. My new horse has a mane that lies resolutely on the left and I have no choice but to braid it there. And she goes best in a Pelham. Will her lovely movement, stunning looks and “jump the moon” style be enough to save us?

Both my horses manes love the left side… but the braider just braids them to the right. After several times of doing that, their manes are now kind of staying right…

As far as the Pelham - from “personal observation” sitting on the sidelines of the A Hunter ring watching one of my horses go - YES a Pelham can ding your horse in a class. There are tons of amazing movers out there and SOME judges will pin the horse with a snaffle over the horse in the Pelham. The Pelham is a perfectly legal bit… but it does present a different picture.

I had an old trainer say he saw my horse showing earlier and that he looked good. I said he’s being pretty good but a bit strong… his response was, “yeah I figured, I saw the Pelham”… Same horse show - One under saddle class in the Pelham pinned 4th, then three under saddle classes with a snaffle - same tough competition, three firsts… Another horse show I went in an under saddle class in the Pelham… He didn’t pin. I had people I didn’t know and even a few trainers I didn’t know come up to me and say - your horse should have won… several people said it was the Pelham…

Those are a few examples of the times I have witnessed what I thought was the judges distaste for a stronger bit.

I LOVE the Pelham… I ride my other horse in the jumpers and maybe some day a bit of Eq and that Pelham is a fabulous bit. I sure wish it wasn’t an issue in the Hunters but I can understand why…

[222orchids]

Doubles: You and I need a Pelham support group. To go back to my post, this mare has stunning looks, a beautiful way of going, perfectly square knees over every jump, and 20/20 vision. In other words, the stuff that MATTERS. The fact that she likes her Pelham better than her snaffle is the most ridiculous reason in the world to ding her in the rIng. When I was riding back in the Stone Age, a Pelham was typical. We need to get over this D-ring addiction and start pinning horses according to the criteria stated in the rules, and by custom.

[eclipse]

@222orchids

Doubles: You and I need a Pelham support group. To go back to my post, this mare has stunning looks, a beautiful way of going, perfectly square knees over every jump, and 20/20 vision. In other words, the stuff that MATTERS. The fact that she likes her Pelham better than her snaffle is the most ridiculous reason in the world to ding her in the rIng. When I was riding back in the Stone Age, a Pelham was typical. We need to get over this D-ring addiction and start pinning horses according to the criteria stated in the rules, and by custom.

I’ll join your group…I use a Pelham too! My big dude loves a Pelham, my little shirt 5ft1 body also loves the Pelham…sometimes snaffles just don’t cut it, and a stronger bit allows for lighter hands and aids lol

[Backstage]

@222orchids

Doubles: You and I need a Pelham support group. To go back to my post, this mare has stunning looks, a beautiful way of going, perfectly square knees over every jump, and 20/20 vision. In other words, the stuff that MATTERS. The fact that she likes her Pelham better than her snaffle is the most ridiculous reason in the world to ding her in the rIng. When I was riding back in the Stone Age, a Pelham was typical. We need to get over this D-ring addiction and start pinning horses according to the criteria stated in the rules, and by custom.

I agree. That said, while there are probably some judges who mark down a pelham regardless of performance, certainly many horses who go in a Pelham do not have the same soft connection that you see with a snaffle. A lot of people who use a Pelham are using them because the horse tends to get strong. It can be a good tool, but can also result in a horse that “has its head down” but also has a shorter neck, some tension and may end up behind the vertical.

Of course, the same thing can happen with a snaffle depending on the rider! and I’ve seen some horses that go beautifully in a Pelham.

Honestly, I think the reality is that while there are few judges out there with some real quirks and preferences, most will reward a good trip.

That said, I can’t speak to something like WEF-level competition. If you are faced with picking between multiple spectacular trips, you need to be a bit more particular. But then, I don’t think anyone is showing up in the hunters at WEF with a monoflap saddle!

I know many complain about the limits of hunter attire…but I kind of like it. I evented as a junior, and certainly by comparison have fewer decision to make about my show attire in my new show hunter life! It can be less “fun” at times, I suppose. But there are lots of schooling days at home when I can use my bridle with brass fittings.

[eclipse]

And…another myth blown rt out the window! (Hmmmm my quote isn’t working! I was quoting midges post lol)

[rockonxox]

I’ll join Pelhams Support Group too. I haven’t had any issues with the regional series marking me down because of it. Hopefully I’ll go to at least one A show this year and we’ll see what happens - although pretty sure that my horses sticky canter will be the downfall and not what bit he has. We use the pelham because 17.3 is a leaner (not “strong”, just big) and my 5’3 with short arms has difficulty with that in the snaffle. Both of us are happier in the pelham.

As someone who collects scores for shows and reads the comments (sometimes I get to see the matching rounds) tack has never been one of the notations. A horses approach and way of going over the fences and overall appearance (ie: clean and put together) > tack details.