I found out my trainer gave a beginner lesson on my horse after she told me that only she and her assistant would be riding him

[aGoodHoss23]

I am fairly new to western, as I grew up riding English.

Two years ago, I bought an Appaloosa because I have always wanted one. I bought him as a yearling and broke him myself. My goal with this particular horse is to do the HUS and be able to do very small courses with him in breed shows or the NSB (maybe?). I don’t know much at all about AQHA or showing. So I decided to put him in training. This is the second trainer I have gone to, as the first one I felt did not respect me or communicate with me. I am still in my 20s and I honestly do feel like if a trainer doesn’t think your horse is worth at least $20,000, they won’t give you a passing glance. I don’t think my horse is worth that much but he is not an ugly horse or a bad mover.

Anyway, I started him in training with this gal mid January and I found out a couple days ago that she gave a girl who is a complete beginner a lesson on him.
My horse is only 4 years old this year and has not been in consistent training and is in no way broke enough to pack a beginner around. I simply do not want him learning he can get away with ANYTHING. When I rode him I could tell that someone had been on him who had let him get away with naughty behavior.
I confronted my trainer about this and she was very defensive about it. It would have been fine if she had just said that she was sorry and it wouldn’t happen again. But she didn’t.

I just want to see what others think about this situation. Has this ever happened to you? What did you do? I think I am just going to pull him out of training because I am tired of the lack of respect I receive from trainers. I get it that it’s hard to get all your horses worked if you’re just one person and maybe your assistant is not super reliable or whatever reason. But I’d rather my horse not get ridden at all than to be ridden by someone who is not a strong enough rider for him.

[TMares]

I would not trust this person with my horse.

[Scribbler]

First verify this really happened. It could just be barn rumor and stirring the pot.

Once you have verified it really happened then ask the trainer in a nonconfrontstional way. Oh I understand you have Suzie a lesson on Spots last week. How did he go for her?

Trainer may answer honestly, he was a real sweetie. Or may lie and say there was no lesson. That’s why you need to know the truth.

Proceed from there. I would say something like

Has he been doing a lot of lessons?

Then finally well I’m a little surprised because I thought it was just going to be trainers riding him. A but surprised to have beginners on him.

See what they say. But end by saying I’d really prefer that only trainers ride him as that’s my original understanding bringing him here.

Don’t get into a fight. You might not have any good options. But you might also quietly move to another trainer if you are sure the problem won’t repeat there too.

I have to say I would trust my trainer to do what’s best for the horse and would not stay with a trainer if I did not.

[trubandloki]

@aGoodHoss23

I am fairly new to western, as I grew up riding English.

Two years ago, I bought an Appaloosa because I have always wanted one. I bought him as a yearling and broke him myself. My goal with this particular horse is to do the HUS and be able to do very small courses with him in breed shows or the NSB (maybe?). I don’t know much at all about AQHA or showing. So I decided to put him in training. This is the second trainer I have gone to, as the first one I felt did not respect me or communicate with me. I am still in my 20s and I honestly do feel like if a trainer doesn’t think your horse is worth at least $20,000, they won’t give you a passing glance. I don’t think my horse is worth that much but he is not an ugly horse or a bad mover.

Anyway, I started him in training with this gal mid January and I found out a couple days ago that she gave a girl who is a complete beginner a lesson on him.
My horse is only 4 years old this year and has not been in consistent training and is in no way broke enough to pack a beginner around. I simply do not want him learning he can get away with ANYTHING. When I rode him I could tell that someone had been on him who had let him get away with naughty behavior.
I confronted my trainer about this and she was very defensive about it. It would have been fine if she had just said that she was sorry and it wouldn’t happen again. But she didn’t.

I just want to see what others think about this situation. Has this ever happened to you? What did you do? I think I am just going to pull him out of training because I am tired of the lack of respect I receive from trainers. I get it that it’s hard to get all your horses worked if you’re just one person and maybe your assistant is not super reliable or whatever reason. But I’d rather my horse not get ridden at all than to be ridden by someone who is not a strong enough rider for him.

Can you clarify something - You know a beginner was given a lesson on your horse or you are assuming a beginner was given a lesson on your horse?

What does your boarding/training contract say? I ask this because I have seen trainers have a lesson student hop on for a quick lesson to see how the horse is doing, how the horse reacts to a different rider. Nothing nefarious going on. So wondering if your contract covers that.

If your choice of trainers does not work your horse because it is not a $20,000 horse then you need to look at different trainers. Appies can go English too. Why not take your appy to your previous English trainer?

[Zu_Zu]

1. get thorough clarification
2. schedule meeting with trainer ( a sit down)
3. IF true and trainer did not have ‘sound’ reasoning and/or an agreement can not be settled on
   then
4. start looking for a new barn - don’t burn a bridge til a new barn is available ”¢

• easy to get mad … get information first

Good Luck !

[joiedevie99]

No, that shouldn’t happen. Schedule a sit down with trainer. Tell her you’ve heard things from other people but want to hear the truth from here. How many people have ridden him, how many times? Let her know in no uncertain terms that you are not ok with anyone other than her and assistant riding him. Ask her to agree to this. If she does and you believe she is being sincere, give her another chance on a very short rope. If not, start shopping around, but don’t say anything about leaving until you have a new option lined up.

[Arlomine]

I’m a trainer.
There is NO good reason for a trainer to let someone ride your horse unless it’s been cleared with you first.

There is a tremendous amount of gaslighting in the industry about this, and its a way for trainers to have school horses which they are being paid to ride them themselves. They get paid for the lesson, and paid for the training ride that wasn’t done.
Trainers have high school students school the training horses when the trainer is out of town at a show. This is rampant, and the owners are made out to be unreasonable if they object.
If substitute riders are going to ride the horse at times, it should be stated up front in the training contract.

There are legit reasons to have a training horse ridden by others. Trainer may be out of town at a show, trainer wants to evaluate horse progress, horse is in part-training and needs more rides than owner can afford. These situations should be clearly communicated, otherwise absolutely not. The liability risk for the horse owner if something goes awry is huge, for one thing.
It goes without saying that a beginner on a four year old should just not happen, especially in these circumstances.

I have several horses in my barn who are ridden in lessons. The owners have watched the care I use in choosing riders, how I police the handling of the horses, and they are confident that it will be a win-win situation for all. They don’t charge to use the horse, I don’t charge the student to use the horse, and the horse gets worked. Sometimes horse owners trade mounts in some lessons to learn new skills. But it’s all been agreed upon ahead of time.
This creates an atmosphere of trust.

So yes, first you must confirm what happened. Ask other boarders if their horse’s are ever ridden by others.
Be direct in your conversation with the trainer, and ask if someone other than the trainer rode your horse. Don’t be specific about the circumstance… Any affirmative answer is a deal-breaker. Since The trainer is Getting defensive is suspicious, it points to feeling guilty. Not a good sign.

Start looking for another barn, and don’t tolerate being deflected.
Saying that you “prefer” that the horse not be ridden by someone else is leaving the door WIDE open for it to happen again.

[Bluey]

We never did, were not comfortable, can cause more questions then help.

BUT, have had other trainers that do, tell you about it and send pictures and even videos of the lesson, or parts of it.

As long as everyone knows and is ok by all parties, why not where that could help?

If we don’t trust a trainer to do right by the horse, we should not have our horse with that trainer.

[Pippigirl]

@aGoodHoss23

Anyway, I started him in training with this gal mid January and I found out a couple days ago that she gave a girl who is a complete beginner a lesson on him.
My horse is only 4 years old this year and has not been in consistent training and is in no way broke enough to pack a beginner around. I simply do not want him learning he can get away with ANYTHING. When I rode him I could tell that someone had been on him who had let him get away with naughty behavior.
I confronted my trainer about this and she was very defensive about it. It would have been fine if she had just said that she was sorry and it wouldn’t happen again. But she didn’t.

If your trainer’s response was very defensive with regards to giving a beginner a lesson, that would leave me wondering if there was other things going on as well.

I too have seen this happen quite a few times. The person is paying to have the horse ridden and trained but the trainer doesn’t put many miles themselves in the saddle.

[AKB]

In your situation, I would be looking for a new trainer.

My horse is in training board. If the trainer wants to use him to teach a working student, she clears it with me ahead of time. I ride most days. If I don’t ride on a given day, I am happy that the trainer makes sure he gets ridden. Even if they just have a working student trot him around the field, the ride is for my horse’s benefit and his fitness. Training board is supposed to benefit you and your horse. It is not a way to give the trainer a free school horse.

[TheHunterKid90]

I would not be okay with a trainer teaching lessons on my horse without express permission.
However, I do allow students looking for a little extra saddle rime to warm up horses occasionally. I think it’s good for the horse to feel a change of pace. It’s a great test of my training (it doesn’t matter if the horses listens to me if he blows off every non pro or kid that crawls on) and there’s generally no harm. I do think there are exceptions to every situation including a very young horse or one with very little training where I feel it could put the horse or rider in a poor situation. Or a horse that is being prepared at a very high level with an upcoming goal in mind.
In fact, I occasionally prepare horses that I plan to sell by putting other riders on to see if said horse is going to respond as well to a small or unfamiliar rider.

BUT, at the end of the day, all these things are clearly communicated to the owner…”are you comfortable with Susie riding Pork Chop occasionally so we can evaluate how he is improving with other riders.”

[roseymare]

@Arlomine

I’m a trainer.
There is NO good reason for a trainer to let someone ride your horse unless it’s been cleared with you first.

There is a tremendous amount of gaslighting in the industry about this, and its a way for trainers to have school horses which they are being paid to ride them themselves. They get paid for the lesson, and paid for the training ride that wasn’t done.
Trainers have high school students school the training horses when the trainer is out of town at a show. This is rampant, and the owners are made out to be unreasonable if they object.
If substitute riders are going to ride the horse at times, it should be stated up front in the training contract.

There are legit reasons to have a training horse ridden by others. Trainer may be out of town at a show, trainer wants to evaluate horse progress, horse is in part-training and needs more rides than owner can afford. These situations should be clearly communicated, otherwise absolutely not. The liability risk for the horse owner if something goes awry is huge, for one thing.
It goes without saying that a beginner on a four year old should just not happen, especially in these circumstances.

I have several horses in my barn who are ridden in lessons. The owners have watched the care I use in choosing riders, how I police the handling of the horses, and they are confident that it will be a win-win situation for all. They don’t charge to use the horse, I don’t charge the student to use the horse, and the horse gets worked. Sometimes horse owners trade mounts in some lessons to learn new skills. But it’s all been agreed upon ahead of time.
This creates an atmosphere of trust.

So yes, first you must confirm what happened. Ask other boarders if their horse’s are ever ridden by others.
Be direct in your conversation with the trainer, and ask if someone other than the trainer rode your horse. Don’t be specific about the circumstance… Any affirmative answer is a deal-breaker. Since The trainer is Getting defensive is suspicious, it points to feeling guilty. Not a good sign.

Start looking for another barn, and don’t tolerate being deflected.
Saying that you “prefer” that the horse not be ridden by someone else is leaving the door WIDE open for it to happen again.

This is spot on. I have seen many people bullied into having their horse be a lesson horse. I don’t think it is always a bad thing for others to ride ones’ horse or to have a lesson taught on one BUT everyone needs to be upfront. The bullying and “everybody does it so it is ok” needs to stop.

[ParadoxFarm]

I see what others are saying about having a more advanced student ride a horse or warm them up, etc., but I do not see in any way how the trainer can justify using this horse as a lesson horse for a beginner rider. My opinion is she was simply using this horse as a “free” school horse because she felt she could. Like others have said, check to see if this is true. If so, personally I would not let her train my horse. She’s shows very bad judgment, and I wouldn’t be able to trust her. I know I may be harsh here, but I don’t like dealing with folks I cannot trust. I’d find a new trainer.

[findeight]

Small detail…you say you are not familiar with AQHA and showing? You have an Appaloosa, correct? The Appaloosa club operates under very similar rules to AQHA but there are differences. Dies this trainer also handle Appaloosas or just AQHA? There is some breed …snobbery… between some AQHA barns towards the “ spin off” breeds like Paints and most of what you see in today’s Appy show ring, which has gotten pretty far from what Appys were in decades past.

When looking for barns and trainers, you will often feel more comfortable with an “ off preferred type” horse in a barn that routinely works with that type. Might not be so much value of the horse but type as well that’s making you feel unwelcome. Have there been other Appys in your barns?

And what is NSB?

Far as trainer using your horse in a lesson? Time for a civil discussion, especially didn’t see it personally. Get trainers side of the story. If it did happen and you otherwise are happy with the services, restate thus must nay ever happen again, perhaps there is some miscommunication since it happened in front if irger clients who told you. Be kind of stupid if trainer knew you forbade it to do it in front of everybody.

Nothing surprises me anymore but these things are often misunderstandings or something really was not clear. And you do share you have had trouble communicating with former trainers. Might be a good idea to get everything in writing, trainers are busy, writing it down helps both sides stay clear on expectations.

[beau159]

@aGoodHoss23

Anyway, I started him in training with this gal mid January and I found out a couple days ago that she gave a girl who is a complete beginner a lesson on him.

My horse is only 4 years old this year and has not been in consistent training and is in no way broke enough to pack a beginner around. I simply do not want him learning he can get away with ANYTHING. When I rode him I could tell that someone had been on him who had let him get away with naughty behavior.

I confronted my trainer about this and she was very defensive about it. It would have been fine if she had just said that she was sorry and it wouldn’t happen again. But she didn’t.

Curious, but how did you find out your trainer gave a lesson on your horse?

Regardless, you’ve already brought it up to the instructor (confirming it??) and it sounds like she didn’t see anything wrong with it.

@aGoodHoss23

Has this ever happened to you? What did you do?

I have never had this happen to me, and it is NOT acceptable in my mind.

It’s one thing if the trainer would have asked ahead of time, and gotten approval. But trainer did not.

I am paying for the TRAINER to ride and train my horse. I am not paying for someone else to possibly teach my horse the wrong things.

If I were you, I would be removing my horse from training immediately, and finding someone else. Not acceptable.

[jvanrens]

@findeight I think NSB should be NSBA.

OP, I’d likely be looking for a new trainer if this trainer couldn’t explain calmly why some else was having a lesson on your horse. If the other rider was just riding your horse around to cool him down after a training session I might be okay with that, but a lesson would make me very annoyed.

[aGoodHoss23]

For everyone asking if it actually happened. YES it did. The girl who rode him actually TOLD me she rode him and told me she was having trouble with him/ect she couldn’t get him to do certain things.
It isn’t stated in our contract but the trainer verbally communicated with me who would be riding him and it did not include this girl.

[aGoodHoss23]

@Arlomine

I’m a trainer.
There is NO good reason for a trainer to let someone ride your horse unless it’s been cleared with you first.

There is a tremendous amount of gaslighting in the industry about this, and its a way for trainers to have school horses which they are being paid to ride them themselves. They get paid for the lesson, and paid for the training ride that wasn’t done.
Trainers have high school students school the training horses when the trainer is out of town at a show. This is rampant, and the owners are made out to be unreasonable if they object.
If substitute riders are going to ride the horse at times, it should be stated up front in the training contract.

There are legit reasons to have a training horse ridden by others. Trainer may be out of town at a show, trainer wants to evaluate horse progress, horse is in part-training and needs more rides than owner can afford. These situations should be clearly communicated, otherwise absolutely not. The liability risk for the horse owner if something goes awry is huge, for one thing.
It goes without saying that a beginner on a four year old should just not happen, especially in these circumstances.

I have several horses in my barn who are ridden in lessons. The owners have watched the care I use in choosing riders, how I police the handling of the horses, and they are confident that it will be a win-win situation for all. They don’t charge to use the horse, I don’t charge the student to use the horse, and the horse gets worked. Sometimes horse owners trade mounts in some lessons to learn new skills. But it’s all been agreed upon ahead of time.
This creates an atmosphere of trust.

So yes, first you must confirm what happened. Ask other boarders if their horse’s are ever ridden by others.
Be direct in your conversation with the trainer, and ask if someone other than the trainer rode your horse. Don’t be specific about the circumstance… Any affirmative answer is a deal-breaker. Since The trainer is Getting defensive is suspicious, it points to feeling guilty. Not a good sign.

Start looking for another barn, and don’t tolerate being deflected.
Saying that you “prefer” that the horse not be ridden by someone else is leaving the door WIDE open for it to happen again.

Oh I straight up told her I don’t want him ridden by beginners.

[OverandOnward]

@aGoodHoss23

Oh I straight up told her I don’t want him ridden by beginners.

You need to clarify - by beginners, or by anyone other than the trainer and certain assistants?

Be specific and put it in writing. An email is fine. But if instructions/guidelines/parameters aren’t in writing then they didn’t happen, no matter how firm you felt you were verbally. People remember verbal communications through their own filter, but written communications are harder to misinterpret if they are written plainly and clearly.

What did the trainer say that made you feel bullied, per the thread title? Maybe I’m missing it but so far I’m not clear on that point.

I suspect that you need to be far more specific with your trainer, and that you need to get your thoughts and boundaries written in an email to the trainer. If you are alluding to things, assuming things, even just walking on eggshells in your written and verbal communications, you are leaving the door open to misunderstandings.

The trainer is not the boss, you are the boss. Your horse, your money. However the trainer is the expert, and as someone paying for that expertise that does put you in a somewhat dependent role in the relationship. Take accountability for your own role in this relationship. Of course be courteous in your communications, but also be professional in tone. Also, listen to what the trainer says, for clues to what is really going on. Very likely the trainer will say far more than she intends to say if you are willing to let her ramble on.

And don’t let your temper flare and interfere with your good judgment if you hear something that really upsets you. It is hard not to react strongly when you hear that your horse was used for a lesson that you didn’t know about. But take some of the communications advice from the other posters about handling this more smoothly … and leading the trainer to out herself, rather than you needing to make accusations.

And yeah, if I lost trust in a trainer I’d be moving asap. The trainer should know better. But she must be getting away with it with other clients if she thinks it’s ok to do things like this.

[aGoodHoss23]

@OverandOnward

And don’t let your temper flare and interfere with your good judgment if you hear something that really upsets you. It is hard not to react strongly when you hear that your horse was used for a lesson that you didn’t know about. But take some of the communications advice from the other posters about handling this more smoothly … and leading the trainer to out herself, rather than you needing to make accusations. :).

I used the word “confront” but that doesn’t also mean that I approached her and threw accusations in her face. That’s not how that went down at all. I asked her questions that led up to it and gave her a chance to fess up to it, which she didn’t.