I found the video from this year's NAJYRC Head of the Lake to be educational

[CrowneDragon]

It’s interesting to get to watch so many riders in succession.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdt3_-KXOhE

Since these are kids I don’t know that its appropriate to criticize individual riders (and there were a couple I wanted to hit with their own crop), but I wanted to share this for anyone else who was interested, because in a lot of the cases you can see many strides out exactly how things are going to go, based on how the horse is being presented and put together. Definitely things that can be applied to one’s own riding (if you, unlike me, have a horse that can jump right now ). It also shows the panic that can ensue after an air vest fills, and how forgiving fence design can help prevent a fall.

If you watch the video, be warned that there is an extremely annoying dog barking every time someone goes through.

[ACMEeventing]

I didn’t watch all of them, but I definitely see what you’re saying.

And, btw, the owners of that dog should have been hit with a crop and then asked to leave the area.

[whbar158]

Really interesting to watch, saw some really good riding and some really bad riding! I think it was interesting to see that most horses that cross cantered up to the drop into the lake did not have a good go at it. This is not about lead changes but about being balanced, ones who balanced on the counter canter were fine, I would expect if you noticed your horses was on the cross canter you would swap back to the “wrong” lead, that is what I do if we miss the change (even in the hunter ring). So the horse can be better balanced. A few horses did ok on the cross canter but they looked smaller and very athletic. A few rides were examples to me as why hunter people ask about lead changes for eventers and why they don’t have them. A few had the lets just ride forward (yes very important) and that will fix everything! Also this is just one point in the course and they are kids, not pros who probably have nerves and I don’t know how the rest of the course was going for some, if poorly then I do understand the fluster and less than stellar riding, nerves can really do a number on a rider!

I was very impressed by some of the rides! Some were very smooth and even some of the not so smooth showed good riding and recovery!

[merrygoround]

Some amazingly good horses. I didn’t keep an exact count, but I would estimate that only 5-6 riders actually looked like they belonged there.

Glad to hear that the dog left.

[subk]

I was surprised by how many horse stumbled on the first stride in the water or stumbled on landing.

[enjoytheride]

Lord, even the camera person apologizes for that annoying dog.

I could see the horses that came down on the lead to make the turn for the next jump came down more balanced and less likely to fall in the water as well as those who came in at an actually quite slow and collected pace.

[CrowneDragon]

The stumbling caught my attention, too. I presume that someone went out and checked the footing in there after several had similar issues.
There were some very honest horses out there, including one who went ahead and climbed in after I’m fairly sure he/she was told “I’m not so sure I want to go in there”.

Seems like this could be a good teaching exercise for a trainer with students learning these skills. Critique the approach and pause and have the students guess how the pair would fair and what issues they might have. It was a good demonstration for why you want to stay back and balanced over your horse, and good and bad use of the crop (particularly hitting the horse after a fence and more than 3 strikes…not sure if these are against the rules here).

[Heinz_57]

[QUOTE=whbar158;7728553]
This is not about lead changes but about being balanced, ones who balanced on the counter canter were fine, I would expect if you noticed your horses was on the cross canter you would swap back to the “wrong” lead, that is what I do if we miss the change (even in the hunter ring). So the horse can be better balanced. A few horses did ok on the cross canter but they looked smaller and very athletic. A few rides were examples to me as why hunter people ask about lead changes for eventers and why they don’t have them. [/QUOTE]

I’m no expert, and I’m certainly not even qualified to ride at the level in that video - but IMO, five strides out (or even 10) is not the time to be asking for a lead change or otherwise completely boogering up your stride and approach by trying to correct a lead in the last few strides to a combination like this. I didn’t watch the whole thing but the riders I saw that ended up cross-cantering looked like they came in on a counter canter and the horse elected to swap one end or the other mid-turn. I’d guess a good number of those horses DO have changes. Hard to say without knowing what the previous fence and line of travel was, why they chose to approach this fence in counter canter.

[whbar158]

Yes many did have lead changes and probably even ones that missed or were held wrong may have one. I do think 5 strides out is a fine time to do a change, jumpers do it all the time, and honestly it isn’t so much about asking for a change as balancing the horse as it needs to be, those that balanced either held a nice counter canter or had a nice smooth change. I was just pointing out that several riders were why people on the outside ask about changes because they did NOT balance well and cross cantered in and had scary moments, including several who fell. IMO it was more about the actual balancing than the actual act of a lead change, I am not saying get one at all costs, I am saying to balance and prepare your horse. Were there a few horses that balanced on the cross canter? Sure, but IMO that is not ideal. I did say the ones who balanced on the counter canter were fine and no need to fight for a change if they are hard or what not for that horse. I was more commenting on the ones cross cantering and why people on the outside make those comments.

Some horses are going to change their lead when you balance some may hold the counter canter, but cross cantering is not being balanced most of the time.

[WasthatC]

The majority of that video was horrible to watch. I agree that only 5-6 rode it like they belonged there.

Should we be concerned at the number of young riders that came through there yanking & slapping and then punished the horse that just saved their bacon? Ouch.

If 1/2 of those kids were mine they’d be watching some video and thinking about their use of the whip. One in particular wouldn’t be riding for a while.

Bravo to the ones that rode it well.

[ACMEeventing]

Okay, so I went back and watched the whole thing.

I rarely read the comments on Youtube, mostly because the annihilation of the English language makes my eyes bleed, but one poster had a really good point:

“The ground jury have interviewed me and said I should have pulled up at the fence before. They said because I am a high profile rider/role model for younger riders I should have been more sensible, and I received a yellow card for dangerous riding. I was completely shocked and devastated.”
Mary King

Just a few examples that I saw: 5 hard raps with the crop for a single refusal; 3 raps after negotiating the obstacle on the 2nd attempt despite zero help from the rider; and the one that really got me, the rider that fist pumped after her horse completely saved her bacon and then gave it the stick as she was riding away.

I know they are juniors and this thread was not intended to pick, but that was deplorable horsemanship. And, in some cases, a blatant violation of the rules.

The riders that rode it well rode it amazingly well, they were a pleasure to watch.

[Heinz_57]

[QUOTE=whbar158;7728740]
I do think 5 strides out is a fine time to do a change, jumpers do it all the time,[/QUOTE]

Agree to disagree on the timing, then. I don’t feel that “jumpers do it all the time” has any relevance to what a rider can or should do on XC at this level. Apples to oranges.

[whbar158]

[QUOTE=Heinz 57;7728808]
Agree to disagree on the timing, then. I don’t feel that “jumpers do it all the time” has any relevance to what a rider can or should do on XC at this level. Apples to oranges.[/QUOTE]

I think its fine to not ASK for a change to but I am saying they should be balancing then (if the horse gives a change then great, if not they are balanced) if the rider isn’t balancing those strides out what should they be doing? I am not saying every horse should be on the correct lead right there no matter what. Some executed nice smooth changes, some held a nice counter canter, considering the number of horses that were on the left lead there I am guessing the previous line had the horses landing/needing to go left. I don’t see anything wrong with getting a change there or holding a counter canter, I am saying I disliked the rides that were on the cross canter IMO they were not balanced.

If one doesn’t want to mess with a change there (especially if you are on a horse that maybe doesn’t have the best changes) then I see no problem with holding a nice balanced counter canter, most of the riders I saw that did a clean change did not really look like they were asking for a change so much as balancing the horse swapped cleanly for balance. Changes to me are about being balanced and straight which is why if my horse only did half a change (whether I asked or they just did because of the turn) I would ask them most likely to straighten and have them swap the front back so they are better balanced and straighter.

I was just trying to point out that over all turns like that when many of the horses that cross cantered into the jump had a bad jump that is why people question the lead changes, but many riders showed a well balanced counter canter works just as well.

[enjoytheride]

I actually thought that there were more good rides then not, well over 5 people. I saw a couple scary rides and a couple should have planned that better rides.

[Lindsayah]

I didn’t watch the whole video but I will say that I saw a few athletic riders that tried to keep out of their way and lots of forgiving mounts. Some people have said that lots of these kids didn’t belong there but I have an honest question.

At the pro level, I think the rider is much more influential on a horse (i.e. You could put William Fox-Pitt on my mare and she would look like a rockstar whereas with me, we sort of just piddle around). At this level for juniors, are the riders that influential or is the horse a major factor in their success?

Also, saw some stick action I didn’t think was very sportsmanlike and some I understood to be a “get your $h!t together pony” statement.

[fordtraktor]

Maybe it is just me, but I think the lead change thing is a pitfall of not putting changes on eventers. Don’t install the changes at the lower levels and you can’t ask for one 15 strides out when you have time to get organized; instead they have to make a tight turn and a horse with no changes ends up doing a half change in front and cross cantering to a big fence. Mistake.

At this level, changes should be second nature. They aren’t.

[NCRider]

[QUOTE=fordtraktor;7728916]
Maybe it is just me, but I think the lead change thing is a pitfall of not putting changes on eventers. Don’t install the changes at the lower levels and you can’t ask for one 15 strides out when you have time to get organized; instead they have to make a tight turn and a horse with no changes ends up doing a half change in front and cross cantering to a big fence. Mistake.

At this level, changes should be second nature. They aren’t.[/QUOTE]

Really? You attribute The problems in this video to not having their changes??? I see balance issues, impulsion issues, committment issues, horsemanship issues, lack of rider skill issues, among other things before I see “doesn’t have it’s changes” issues.

I saw a couple of really good rides, a couple of awful rides and many perfectly adequate rides. There’s a reason Rolex has a huge crowd at the head of the lake. Strange things happen at the water jump.

[fordtraktor]

[QUOTE=NCRider;7728940]
Really? You attribute The problems in this video to not having their changes??? I see balance issues, impulsion issues, committment issues, horsemanship issues, lack of rider skill issues, among other things before I see “doesn’t have it’s changes” issues.

I saw a couple of really good rides, a couple of awful rides and many perfectly adequate rides. There’s a reason Rolex has a huge crowd at the head of the lake. Strange things happen at the water jump.[/QUOTE]

No, of course not. That is not what I said. I was not talking about specific riders, just reflecting generally. But one hole is that if they had balance, impulsion and a good canter maybe they could get changes earlier. “Doesn’t have its changes” is a balance and impulsion issue.

Skipping changes sometimes means riders skip the other necessary elements too, maybe. It can be one symptom of a series of issues. If a horse is balanced, has impulsion and is cantering off its forehand it can switch. And it has to be somewhat balanced to switch, at least more than some of these.

I saw plenty of other issues but that had nothing to do with changes, but they are specific to riders and not an “eventing” thing so I don’t care to comment on them. The changes thing is a topic I can discuss without singling young riders out.

There was a thread a couple a weeks ago about eventers not doing changes. If changes were something we expected Novice horses to have, would you see as many horses here coming in unbalanced on the approach? Real concern as courses get more technical.

On the specifics here–my comment is that there sure looks like there is a hole to the slight right of center. Lots of stumbles on that track. And that is not anyone’s fault, riding-wise.

[lizloveshorses]

Thanks for posting this, OP. I’m finding it a great opportunity to watch the horses. When I see pros ride, they look so in tune with the horse, I don’t really notice what the horse is doing. Here, where there is a difference in the skill level of the rider and the level of the horse, I can really see which horses are hunting the fences, which ones are saints, and how lucky these kids are to ride these awesome horses.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

wow…I was going to stay out of this but can’t now. Those going on and on about lead changes…I call BS. You have obviously NOT ridden xc at this level. The first part of the video was a CCI1* (and this was where there were to most cross cantering/counter canter)…so these kids are all 18 and under and would have at most been riding at this level for 4 years with many not riding at that level for even that long. I suspect this question (head of the lake) was toward the end or at least 2/3 the way around—just based on the way things look and horses look. That means these kids and horses have been galloping and jumping for likely over 5 minutes. Horses GET TIRED and riders GET TIRED. And if it was earlier in the course–horses are often strong and rank! You also do NOT ask for a lead change in water. The focus is keeping the energy and getting the canter going as every stride in water zaps energy and has a drag–making the water to water jump a fairly technical jump. The approach looks a bit tricky as well and difficult to see on the video but I suspect it is slightly down hill after having a bit of a gallop…some of the kids were having trouble getting their horses back and balanced for the turn to the water…and the last thing you want to be doing coming into a water jump like that is pulling back. After dropping more than 4 feet into water and doing a bending line to a water to water jump on a probably tiring horse—the last thing (and it shouldn’t be even a thought in the rider’s head) is getting a damn lead change. The focus would be to get your balance back, and keep your horse in front of your leg and get them straight to that 2nd element…all while YOU as a rider are probably also feeling a bit tired.

The rides in the last part of the video is the CCI2*, and as would be expected, these riders are both older and more experienced and the horses in general are coming in much more balanced both on approach and in the water…all though that is a pretty decent drop in. Again…I doubt a single rider thought, and the they shouldn’t be thinking, a damn thought about their lead.

I would guess that just about ALL of those horses, jumping at home or just in a ring do lead changes. It isn’t a lead change issue at all.