[QUOTE=poltroon;8572780]
Those of you who have tried the leather bits, did you go loose ring or D-ring? I was wondering if the D-ring style would rub.
And thanks for the link to the mullen baucher![/QUOTE]
I had a leather loose ring, like all loose rings a half size large to prevent pinching. As long as the D ring is the correct size, and the bit is kept soft with a little veggie oil, it shouldn’t rub.
Well I got the Myler Baucher MB04 today and tried it out. She was the same 
I decided to work her in hand so I could get up by her head and see exactly what she was doing. She draws her tongue back, as if to put it over the bit, and then slides it forward and out the left side of her mouth. Over and over and over until I say “Knock it off.” Then she closes her mouth for a minute, goes along quietly taking a nice contact, and then it begins again. There was a Western rider out there who I was chatting with and she was kind enough to lend me a very very thin plain snaffle just to put it in her mouth and see if she would stop fussing with a thin bit. Same damn results even if just standing in the ring with us talking and the bit in her mouth. Draws up her tongue, tries to push the bit in her teeth, fails, gets pissed, sticks out tongue. Rinse and repeat. We then tried a thin leather strap which she was happily chomping away on and stopped the tongue behavior because she could chew on it. Finally just stuck a French link in I know she can get up in her teeth and same results…very happy and relaxed but chewing on it. Loudly. So I think I have a training issue. Crap. Double crap. She’s a very mouthy mare (has to pick up and play with anything and everything) so I’m trying to figure out how to correct this. Even without contact or a rider in she still chomps, or does the tongue thing as a frustration/conflict behavior if she can’t. She did it much worse when I took a contact just standing next to her and put some pressure on the bit and really started sticking out her tongue and drawing it back… Do I a) give her a bit she’s happy in but can chew on even though it’s horribly obnoxious and loud b) keep her in a bit she can’t get in her teeth but instead deal with the snatching and tongue behavior c) please insert your ideas because I’m out! LOL I have no problem doing groundwork or bitless or just lunging her in a bit on hangers for awhile, just not sure which one. I’m pretty open to ideas! I know it can take some time to adjust to a new bit so I’m going to try the Baucher a few more times but after my little theory testing today I’m fairly certain it’s just a bad habit. She is apparently convinced she is a puppy who wants to chew on her bone. And I have NO idea how to correct it of if I should just ignore it and push her up into the contact if she backs off and starts chewing. Oh pony. She’s lucky she’s so damn cute she’s worth the trouble!! LOL
I have N=1 experience, so it may not be worth much.
My horse will chomp his bit if he is bored/distracted or if he is worried. It’s not about the type of bit in his mouth or how much contact he has (or doesn’t have) while riding.
He’s generally worse just standing around, since there is nothing to occupy his brain and he goes looking for things to do. Since the bit is the most accessible thing for him to play with…
We just ignore it. We focus on work that keeps his brain engaged and a lot of positive reinforcement so he’s confident that he’s giving the right responses. As his confidence has grown, the chomping has generally diminished. He will still come out some nights chewing like a mad man, but it’s now just a good general indicator of his state of mind and I use that to adjust whatever I had planned on doing.
It took us a long time to get to a point where his general confidence level was high enough, and his ability to focus had grown enough, that we could get through an entire ride without any chomping. But we did get there.
And I have no idea if this is the “right” approach to the problem. It was just really easy in his case to figure out things that made him chomp or not chomp on the bit, and to reward the things that didn’t while working to improve the things that did. It wasn’t really about the bit; it was a mental thing for him.
What does she do if you invite her down into a stretchy frame?
My guy has tongue issues - they are somewhat different than yours - but when the tongue comes out, I send him long and low, which makes him put it back in his mouth.
Mouth/tongue issues are so hard to figure out. I would do my best to write down EVERYTHING about the problem and try to find a pattern. Does it happen more in one gait than another? Is it worse with more contact or less? Going one direction? What seems to trigger the behavior? What makes it go away? How does it compare when lunging without side reins vs. with side reins vs. under saddle?
FWIW, my first go into the world of Myler with Mr. Fussypants was their basic comfort snaffle. Then the MB03 (copper roller) then MB04 - the shallowest of ports. Nothing really changed for the better until I went to this MB33 WL (wide low). May not be a solution for your horse, but wanted to encourage you to keep trying.
Edited to add: I had marginal successes the first few tries w/ the MB 33 WL (enough to keep it on his bridle)…but it really took a week or 2 to truly see bigger, positive changes.
[QUOTE=myhorsefaith;8577543]
FWIW, my first go into the world of Myler with Mr. Fussypants was their basic comfort snaffle. Then the MB03 (copper roller) then MB04 - the shallowest of ports. Nothing really changed for the better until I went to this MB33 WL (wide low). May not be a solution for your horse, but wanted to encourage you to keep trying.
Edited to add: I had marginal successes the first few tries w/ the MB 33 WL (enough to keep it on his bridle)…but it really took a week or 2 to truly see bigger, positive changes.[/QUOTE]
Of course I just trialed the MB33 WL Eggbutt last month but due to the weather I only got 4 rides in it before the trial was up. She was no worse but no better so I sent it back. Wishing I would have tried it longer now! Might pull it back on trial again!
If you can, definitely give it a longer trial. I’m not convinced there is going to be a magical change-everything bit for my guy - but so far this is the closest I’ve gotten. At the very least it has allowed us to address the training issues in the most meaningful way, and in a few short months of using this bit, we’ve come leaps and bounds from where we were.
Hopefully you will find something that your mare likes/accepts enough. I think with these types of horses that is as close as we can get. I cannot wait to be proven otherwise…lol.
Well hallefrickinleuah!! There was a guy who drives horses was at the barn today and had a very thin Mullen over check bit (like one of you linked me to in the beginning!) We put it in just to see and she was WONDERFUL! Barely bothered it, took a nice contact and was happy happy! Now I just need to find one in either Eggbutt or Baucher. Does anyone know if I buy the overcheck with the tiny rings if there is somewhere I can send it to have the cheek pieces swapped out? Wow! Just so excited!!!
Yay!!! www.bitbybit.ws will do that. I linked to it in post #53.
(Over)Check bit #205 is the mouth piece, discuss ring options with them.
If, for some reason they can’t help, try, www.lwbits.net
Click catalog, it is mostly barrel horse bits but he can make anything. Click- mouthpiece, it is #6
Good luck
Wondering what bit you decided on, and how it is working?
I am interested in how the overcheck is working for you, too! The update on my dude is as follows: I finally tried a Neue Schule Verbindend 12 MM from dressage extensions.
The good: nicer, softer contact for the majority of the rid- feels more adjustable in so many ways - not as locked on to the bit as when going in the myler. The trot work has gotten much nicer.
The not-so-good: he can get that up in his teeth and the old “close to the end of my work” grind has shown up. It is very mild, though, and in our 8 rides, he has only “gone there” 3 times. It is a soft grind and if I change the subject on him a lot, he seems to forget about grinding. Again, training issue, but the change in tack brought it back.
Also, his canter work tanked for a few rides, where his trot work got better. Short of doing a mid-ride bridle change, we’re working through it and I’m happy to say that the last couple rides I’ve felt like the canter work is coming back now that he’s getting his confidence and losing the tension working in this bit.
Overall, I feel like it is a positive change. Maybe not “the one”, the silver bullet so to say, but I’m happy with it…for now…
In other news, little arab mare still happily trucking along in her $30 sprenger-esque knock off…:lol: bless her.
[QUOTE=Keg-A-Bacchus;8578132]
Well hallefrickinleuah!! There was a guy who drives horses was at the barn today and had a very thin Mullen over check bit (like one of you linked me to in the beginning!) We put it in just to see and she was WONDERFUL! Barely bothered it, took a nice contact and was happy happy! Now I just need to find one in either Eggbutt or Baucher. Does anyone know if I buy the overcheck with the tiny rings if there is somewhere I can send it to have the cheek pieces swapped out? Wow! Just so excited!!![/QUOTE]
Is there a problem with the small rings? Wouldn’t it just be like a bradoon in a double bridle?
The rings on a driving bit are tiny, but I can’t find any rules about the size of the ring, just the mouth piece, tongue relief etc…
I’m still trying to find a thin Mullen Baucher that isn’t on those tiny rings so I haven’t yet got to try it again. No luck with the two bit companies on getting a bit changed to Baucher but I’m still hunting! In the meantime I am riding in this gaited horse bit and by golly she’s going pretty flippin’ well! 90% of her head/mouth issues are gone! I’m going to see if it’s dressage legal if I have my welder chop off the shanks and file it down nicely. It’s reallllly curved over the tongue with a copper roller and independent moving sides. I’m riding with it like a Baucher and the shanks are just hanging there unused. It’s about 13mm thick and would be PERFECT if I could find it in 10mm thick. But she takes a lovely contact in it and hasn’t yet stuck her tongue out. She tried to grab it in her teeth, couldn’t, then snatched a couple of times in frustration but SO much less then before! I picked it up for $25 and figured it was worth a try! On the Baucher cheek it really holds it up off the tongue and gives it far more room than any of the Myler or other bits I tried. Now to find this bit in 10mm and make sure it’s dressage legal and we are set!! Anyone see anything illegal here? Here’s the bit we are currently in:
http://www.amazon.com/Tough-1-Premium-Comfort-Gaited-Shank/dp/B003M6VWHE
It has the mouthpiece of this Imus bit but with Baucher style cheeks with the shanks. You can see the amount of curve in the mouthpiece better here: https://phoenixrisingsaddles.com/index.php/shop/product/35-imus-comfort-gait-bit
This mouthpiece looks similar, with no alterations necessary: http://nsbits.com/product/comfy-contact-eggbutt/
I believe in another thread, it was determined that cutting/grinding parts off of bits was not legal.
[QUOTE=yaya;8597745]
Oh look! They have it in Baucher!
http://nsbits.com/product/comfy-contact-baucher/[/QUOTE]
It is PERFECT but it’s been recalled and they don’t have them available right now! Ugh!! I was allll over that one and I have a few emails out to see if they will be bringing them back!!
You know I would contact a really big Western tack store and tell them what you’re looking for. That’s not an uncommon western bit and they often have people who will make bits for you.
I feel your pain. I posted a thread looking for some design/ biomechanic info on the newer shaped bits so I could stop just basically guessing and try to make informed choices when wasting money on new bits. The best resource I’ve found so far is a polo bit designer. The lack of info on the theory and action behind these supposedly cutting edge designs is quite frustrating!
This may be too thick. It doesn’t give the diameter of the mouthpiece.
http://www.horsebitbank.com/informed-designs-hanging-cheek-mullen-490.phtml But it’s sold for ponies, and the pony O ring with a similar mouthpiece is only 11mm. Horse Bit Bank is great about answering emails, so you could ask them about the diameter.
This is a 10mm pony NS Baucher that comes in a 5" and is dressage legal. http://www.horsebitbank.com/performance-pony-tranz-baucher-10mm-12.phtml It’s not mullen though.
This one is very interesting and dressage legal in the UK.
http://www.horsebitbank.com/bomber-tube-control-plate-bc45-902.phtml
Isn’t the minimum legal bit diameter 11mm? or is that eventing dressage?
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