Incredible incredible horse

[QUOTE=Two Simple;2032654]
\Hell, even the resident Dressage Expert Grandiose, SLC herself has said it many times that you don’t go to a dressage clinic to be entertained. You don’t go to a dressage show to be entertained. You go to learn and appreciate. [/QUOTE]

I’ve been reading this thread (while doing many other things, off and on) for hours, and this is the first time I have felt compelled to respond.

Maybe YOU don’t. I do. I go to dressage shows because it’s fun–that is to say, entertaining. I audit clinics for basically the same reason, because I learn by DOING pretty much exclusively. I just find it fun.

Nobody wants to ride a 16 hand, good mover. They want 17+++, the huger the better.

Um. I do! I don’t want a huge horse with giant gaits. I can’t sit them, and lots of people can’t, not just me. I know lots of people who seek out small dressage horses. And they bring BIG bucks, too–check out the German Riding Pony.

Two Simple, you seem fond of making generalizations that don’t apply to as many people as you think they do. It might be useful for you to sit on your hands for a few days or weeks and just read for a while… it’s a good skill to learn, not to jump in constantly. I know, I still struggle with it :).

[QUOTE=chicki;2034088]
Ok I NEED to interject here. Besides being appealing to the eye, there is a function to that trot, there is a reason they breed for that, and it all relates to his ability to do dressage. Everyone here is argueing whether or not the horse was “trained” to do passage. He is just three,and even if he was asked for tiny steps, which I myself highly doubt, he is doing passagy movement DAMN WELL.Take your three year old all arounder out. Take and ride him 4 months walk trot canter…hey TRY and get half the passage out of him that this horse shows with his sort of passagy movement.I doubt anyone in the world could get much passage out of the draft cross I own, let alone at three yeards old!! She isnt built or bred for it. This horse is on the other extreme. My point is, there is a real good chance this horse is doing that passagy movement just by himself, with not real initiative other than being held back a tad. That is called ability. It is easy for the horse to compress and direct that energy upward. This is what 99 percent of the dressage horses out there lack and this is why not all horses are going to do grand prix. Anyone who is serious about dressage competition can see the INCREDIBLE value in this horses gaits, because we all know that EVERYTHING is going to be easy for this horse. That is what every competative dressage rider wants. Talent and natural ability. And that is something you dont train…it is there from birth. I think it’s hilarious that people who arent competative in dressage even comment about their perception about this horses value as a dressage horse. Really, he wasn’t bred to appeal to trail riders and people who are into little local shows. He was bred for the international competative dressage arena, and that is where he will knock the socks off everyone who knows what a dressage horse is supposed to be. End of story.[/QUOTE]
i very much disagree with this. i stated that Quaterback is exhibiting a passagey trot, not that he is performing the passage. this type of trot results from the horse sucking back as an evasion. untrained 3-yr olds do NOT know how to passage. that is a trained movement which can only be learned as a progression of collection. please refer to the training scale. this untrained horse can only begin his progression up the training scale once he has achieved rhythm and regularity. there can be no collection (yet), because none of the building blocks are there. the passagey trot is a fault because it shows the horse’s unwillingness to go forward. perhaps it will resolve itself, but a passagey trot is the last thing you want for correct dressage. i am glad to have been given the opportunity to comment on your post, because it seems that many dressage riders make the same mistakes that you have made. mbm is correct. you all seem to be wowed by this beautiful horse’s extravagant movement, but you haven’t even stopped to think whether this type of movement is correct for dressage. dressage is about training, not about exaggerated movements. why post videos on dressage board if you do not wish for comments on the horse’s training?

With race horses, it’s economic – a stallion can make more money in the breeding shed than he can on the track. Get a precocious youngster who wins Grade 1 races at two, retire him at three, and make a bundle breeding him to 100+ mares a year. Who cares that it’s ruining both the sport and the breed? Certainly not the big stallion farms like Coolmore and Ashford.

nappingonthejob

:lol: :lol: :lol:

sometimes you just have to do it…been there myself;)

The ignore button is brilliant. Don’t forget to log in though because if you forget to log in you might accidentally injure your eyes.

There is a difference between disagreeing and trolling. Think Kathy Johnson v. Any Trainwreck Ho. Trolls like to cause trainwrecks. Put the trainwreckhos and/or trolls on ignore . They thrive on attention.

Thanks for posting the videos.

Didn’t you state earlier in this entertaining trainwreck that the video was posted on the wrong forum? And wasn’t the question posed to you, “Where should it be posted?”

You never answered that question. Quite the opposite, from the statement quoted above, it appears you have reversed your opinion.

And to answer YOUR question, why do people feel the need to “comment on the horse’s training” when no critique was asked for? I honestly think they do it so they can then sit back from the keyboard and think about how smart they are.

As for the “I like it/I hate it” debate?

“You say to-may-to, I say to-mah-to, let’s call the whole thing off.” :lol:

I could watch that horse for hours. Beautiful animal. Thanks again for sharing the video!

[QUOTE=hitchinmygetalong;2034871]
Didn’t you state earlier in this entertaining trainwreck that the video was posted on the wrong forum? And wasn’t the question posed to you, “Where should it be posted?”

You never answered that question. Quite the opposite, from the statement quoted above, it appears you have reversed your opinion.

And to answer YOUR question, why do people feel the need to “comment on the horse’s training” when no critique was asked for? I honestly think they do it so they can then sit back from the keyboard and think about how smart they are.[/QUOTE]
i would suggest that this video be posted in the appropriate breed forum? or perhaps there is a forum for those who show young horses? this is a dressage forum, and the video posted is not of a dressage horse. a beautiful horse, yes. but not a dressage horse.

Oh Dear Me Foxxy Starr.
I beg to differ.
This horse was bred for dressage, please refer to his pedigree, what age do you recommend that he would be deemed a dressage horse?
Will he have to wait until he is an accomplished big tour horse?

Should you not be on a forum for trail riding horses? As all you seem to do is bilittle dressage and everything it entails.

TROLL ALERT!!!

Please, please, please ignore the trolls so this topic can get back on course. The development of the ignore function is like the discovery of fire. Really useful.:yes:

[QUOTE=DanniS;2034908]
Oh Dear Me Foxxy Starr.
I beg to differ.
This horse was bred for dressage, please refer to his pedigree, what age do you recommend that he would be deemed a dressage horse?
Will he have to wait until he is an accomplished big tour horse?

Should you not be on a forum for trail riding horses? As all you seem to do is bilittle dressage and everything it entails.[/QUOTE]
did you not know that dressage horses are trained, not bred? you seem to want to have it both ways. while he has numerous faults, they are exusable because he is green broke. but the fact that he is green broke is precisely why he is not a dressage horse.

Try and tell the Germans that dressage horses are not bred but trained!!
Yes he has numerous faults, when did anyone say he was perfect?
Actually please give me an example of the perfect horse, they don’t exist.

If perfection is what you are looking for in this horse you have failed miserably.

Why is it that you can’t just appreciate him for what he is and stop trying to make mountains out of molehills?

Just started my ignore list. edited to clarify: it was #329 that inspired me. edited to add: Ooooh, cool, now #329 is gone!

edited to clarify: Looks like the post numbers have changed (Of course, maybe I didn’t have my glasses on!), but the post I was refering to is now #320. Specifically, I am NOT blocking DanniS - I’ve agreed with her posts, and am glad she’s here to add something to the quality of the discussion.

It is really a shame that many people do not understand why horses with these gaits are good for upper level work. That’s very sad. All they can know, however, is their own little world trhat they are in, which most likely, given the statistics for USA dressage, doesn’t include any experience with training upper level horses. Sure, a few people have that experience - most don’t.

This horse isn’t ‘passaging’. He is excited, so his gait has hesitations and moments where he pops up or lifts too much. You are mistaking that for a passage, which is also pretty sad.

However, because he can lift himself up and because he can bend all his joints and move with such fluidity, it shows he will be a superior dressage horse. He has an unbelievable freedom of motion.

Because of his fluidity, freedom of motion and innate strength, he has much less chance of getting hurt during the training process. He might get injured in the paddock or while being transported or getting loose, but he has far, far MORE chance of holding up to the work. The work is hard. It takes many, many years to train an upper level horse, and it is more hours in the saddle than most horses will be able to physically withstand.

Sad but true, and something most people don’t want to believe - but the majority of horses that people attempt to get to the upper levels, will not make it. They will get arthritis in their hocks, usually, because they are working harder to try and do the work. We don’t want to believe this, but sometime, look around you. Talk to people - you won’t always get a straight answer, but quite frankly, a lot of horses can’t stay in upper level work. They have to drop down, get retired, or do light work. Why? Because they don’t have the conformation or the movement to make the work as easy as possible for them.

The only other choice with these horses is to do substandard work, without the degree of collection, the activity, the impulsion, and without the range of motion. That is what most less physically able horses do. They simply do poor quality work. They may win awards and give their owners a lot of pleasure, but they won’t perform in the elite ranks. They may win at local shows, but they won’t win where this horse is going.

And, there is a difference between schooling a horse like this and a horse that doesn’t move like this.

There IS a difference.

I had a horse, nowhere near as nice as this one, but pretty damn nice, and a step up from the previous horse in gaits and balance. He had more lift to his canter and balanced like this one - like a little rubber ball, all in one perfectly balanced little package. No, not as good as this one, but pretty damn good.

And the previous horse, after 6 years of schooling, did not, for example, counter canter as well as this pretty damn nice horse.

People want to believe any horse can win the Olympics, and any horse can do grand prix dressage at a competition, and any horse can do FEI.

Sure they can. But competitively? Stay sound? Do it without straining their body? Do it with such grace? No. Don’t even try to kid yourself.

This horse can.

MEP

MEP you have a PM

Oh, heck, Eggie. Does that mean I’m not a trainwreck ho? I beg to differ. I’m a veritable conductor.

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Now THAT is funny!

Following your “logic”, I guess no one can ever post a video or pic of a promising young horse anywhere on COTH anymore, simply because there are no BREED forums. Discipline forums, yes. But no breed forums.

Surely you cannot deny that this horse shows great promise for the discipline of dressage, as opposed to say, endurance? So I maintain that the Dressage Forum on The Chronicle of the Horse bulletin board is a completely appropriate place to put it.

Which begs the next question: Why do you have such a burr under your tail about this video? I can’t think of any logical reason for such vehemently negative postings.

For those who keep saying that this horse is green broke, I will repeat - most young stallions in Germany are started under saddle as coming 3 year olds. If this stallion followed the usual course, he was probably started last January or February. And don’t forget he WON the 3 year old stallion class at the Bundeschampionat in late Aug. / early Sept. He had to have been under saddle for at least a few months beforehand because horses have to qualify for that show by earning appropriate scores at several qualifying competitions.

And I doubt very seriously the horse is ridden like this on a regular basis. He probably gets a light work out a few days a week that focuses on the basics, probably goes on a walkband (treadmill) every day, probably gets a little hack outside once or twice a week, probably gets turned out in an indoor arena once or twice a week. It is also very likely that he is only asked to “turn it on” under saddle when at (or when preparing for) a big exhibition such as the Oldenburg stallion show.

This next year will be very telling for this horse. He will start breeding in earnest within a few months, and his work program will probably be stepped up in early spring to start preparing him for the Y/H championships in June. It will be interesting to see how he handles all the breeding and increased work.

I wish him and his owners the best. He is a truly phenomenal horse. They say that horses like this come along once in a lifetime, but Brandenburg has now produced two such divine creatures (although, unlike Poetin, this one has another gait besides just the trot).

Downyonder I applaud you, well said:yes:
Can I just say that we can’t forget Samba Hit I & II(competing at Hengelo, and doing well today).

I am VERY excited for this stud and it’s Principal Herr Jeurgun Mueller, they are getting the kudos they deserve

[QUOTE=hitchinmygetalong;2035053]
:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Which begs the next question: Why do you have such a burr under your tail about this video? I can’t think of any logical reason for such vehemently negative postings.[/QUOTE]

Because she’s trailblazer, trying to sneak back on the BB after being banned.

As for the rest of you – at least, those who I didn’t just send on a vacation for insulting people – if you cannot have this discussion in an adult manner, the thread will be closed. I do not have time for this crap. Grow up, or you don’t get to have the discussion.

And by the way, in the future, it is much more productive to email a moderator if you suspect a banned person has sneaked back onto the BB than to simply encourage them on a thread. Nothing like making me wade through 17 pages of posts on a Saturday morning… thanks. :rolleyes:

Oh Erin, you must have found something of redeeming value here! :winkgrin:

Sorry to have troubled you. It’s a gorgeous day here, maybe we just all need to go out and ride.