Why would an elbow replacement mean the end of riding?
If that is what she thinks, she needs to (a) talk with her doctor or (b) get a new doctor.
She was told that once she had it done, she couldnât risk further injury, even to the extent of a horse that might pull. She breaks easily soâŠ
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This is completely off topic,but a replaced elbow shouldnât break. I have a replaced hip and a replaced shoulder and ride. I guess, though if they are worried about bones around the joint breaking, that might be a problem. Ok, back to the decline, or not, of dressage.
That was what I was thinking. If the friend has osteoporosis, that is one thingâŠbut if the friend is ânormalâ in other ways then IMHO, obviously her doctor is clueless about horse people and needs to get a reality check.
I know people who are riding with 2 replacement hips, a replacement shoulder and a cervical fusion.
And another friend with 2 total knees. She was also worried about falling because of osteoporosis and arthritisâŠso I suggested she sell her horse and take up crochet.
The horse won out.
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Yes, she does have some osteoporosis and is slow to heal from any sort of fracture/break.
Dressage has more competition these days, too.
It used to be that if you wanted to ride English but didnât want to jump or do rail classes at H/J or breed shows, your primary alternate option was Dressage.
These days, breed shows are starting to offer working/sport horse classes to attract these riders. Obstacle and trail classes are popping up that offer the cerebral challenge of Dressage but with more âstuffâ involved for people who, it turns out, were maybe tolerating but not loving endless 20 meter circles. Working Equitation gives you a chance to continue with Dressage but also have some fun with speed.
There are options. Andâat least for me and among some people I knowâI can say those options are absolutely diverting us away from pure Dressage.
Arguably we were never going to be die hard Dressage purists or climb our way up the ladder anyway, but now instead of spending our hobbyist dollars/volunteer hours with Dressage trainers and at Dressage shows, weâre spending it with other disciplines. Or, at best, splitting it between Dressage and other disciplines.
Some of the attrition, quite honestly, is that people who were round pegs in oval holes are finding options better suited to what we want. And thatâs not a bad thing, but I do think that Dressage as a sport has been used to acting as the primary/first/default option for people like me when we left other sports, and some fraction of the decline simply has to do with the fact that there is more competition for our money and time now.
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Ok, summarizing here, from responses so far:
(1) Dressage is perceived to be declining, especially in large metropolitan areas, with a few metropolitan outliers;
(2) The main reason for the decline is economic (economic barriers including cost of board, training, horses, etc.), although access (also economic) is a large factor (no place to board and train, no trainers, prop).
(3) Other reasons cited for decline, include an aging population; other developed equine activities (like western dressage) that donât yet appear to have the same economic barriers or better suit some of the dressage consuming community; lack of time; and some wanted to put this all on competitive dressage and have a conversation about elite competitive dressage.
What else?
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Iâm repeating my previous post as it addresses a few more things in addition to things you mentioned above:
Cost - Cost of a horse, tack, boarding or property if at home, cost of care etc. (this however should be effecting all disciplines, if it isnât then perhaps dressage needs to address more specific details as why it is effecting it more then other disciplines).
Time - Most AAâs and probably some FEI level riders work full time, so time becomes an issue.
Availability or access to instruction - lack of good trainers, clinicians, show
Lack of school masters - to learn on or at least lesson on occasionally.
Attitude - dressage can and often does come across as elitist and not welcoming
Breed bias - by judges, trainers, clinicians, other riders
Lack of support for those in the lower levels, AA especially - by USDF or other organizations. I see very little in the USDF web site that address AA other than what is related to showing. See lots of programs for JRs and professionals, instructors certifications, trainers conferences etc.
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Itâs not WORTH the hassle to open a private boarding barn. In theory, I could have six stalls available which would generate some income. But it isnât worth the hassle of dealing with the people for me to do it. And thatâs the truth. The horses would be fine just a bit more work but the people coming into my home space just isnât something I want to deal withâŠmoney or no money. And to make it financially attractive as something Iâd want to do - I would have to make a nice profit from each stall. People calculate the costs of boarding a horse out pretty nicely to the penny but forget the profit part. There has to be a reason for me to do the extra mucking, etc. And by the time I tell you I need $800 a month per horse, theyâve already run the numbers in their head.
And Iâd say I get at least 4 people a year popping in to ask. Other people locally that I know with arenas and barns of 4 to 10 stalls generally feel the same way. Canât be bothered. In my little area there are tons of private places with some sort of arena or coverall (kind of a necessity in Canada really) and we all just do our own thing.
it is a pity in a way because small boarding barns offer great care and in some cases great friendships - but they can be a nightmare too for the owner and the boarder!
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It always amazes me how many people fail to realize that a boarding barn is a business and NOT a social service. Iâm at a nice barn where the board was recently raised less than 10% and is still, IMO, below market. One boarder actually said that it was unreasonable for the owner to expect to not subsidize the business from their savings! Spoken like someone who literally has never worked for living! :eek:
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The sad thing to me, is that quite a few horsey places locally have arenas that are now being used to store cars, or other equipment and making a bit of money that way. Less people traffic for the owner, less fuss and cars donât kick the living crap out of their stalls either or rub their bumpers on the fences! 
It breaks my heart to see a nice standardbred rack track turned into a track for dirt bikes, but a few folks have specifically bought horse places and done that. None near me luckily!
Where I am - there are some very nice former horse facilities that now belong to dog agility clubs. I went to look at a horse up north in Bellingham a couple years ago - they had a super nice facility with a loft viewing area, nice sized indoor ⊠and they were doing dog daycare with many of their stalls: Better money per day, fewer human hassles, and the dogs go home at the end of the day.
Seriously, we have a problem when people can find more money per day to keep a couple dogs, than to keep a horse. The business aspect of boarding horses is just not sustainable, at least in Western WA. I canât comment about other areas.
I donât think this is only a Dressage issue, I think it is a horse hobby issue.
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well if I read some of the thread here I am not amazed⊠I agree with Willy von Whompers.
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This scenario represents an even larger divide between the âhavesâ and the âhave notsâ of the horse world.
Back in the1990s, I saw one-income families buying a hobby farm with the non-working adult running a boarding operation that would allow her (usually) to have her horses pay for themselves. If this same scenario no longer requires any income, it takes way more wealth to own and run that hobby farm.
In my area, that 10-or-less stall farm with the required indoor would be at $700K proposition. And with that many head on the place, the property is probably supported by at least one âreal worldâ salary.
So if you have less wealth than what it would take to buy that AND you canât find boarding, you are really SOL⊠not just closed out of dressage but closed out of owning a horse at all.
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Also add that the hobby farm probably needs a good tractor with front end loader, maybe a hay spear, etc⊠muck spreader, bush hog, riding lawn mower, snow removal equipment (for Canada), decent fencing, arena harrows of some sort, etc, etcâŠit is not a small investment any of this stuff.
Even though all a potential boarder sees is some fields, an arena and a box stall. Iâve got all this stuff for myself and my own horses true⊠but more horses equals more wear and tear on the property, etc, etc⊠It isnât a small investment financially or timewise, so itâs no wonder a lot of places are just keeping their own horses.
I run a 60 Horse boarding barn. My business plan (such as it is) is to break even. The barn pays me no rent, no wages, no property taxes. It does cover some of the expenses on my couple fun horses.
The best source of income for the ranch is an outbuilding I rent to a retired man who keeps his cars and toys there. He comes maybe once a week to pet his classic cars, for a few hours⊠and he usually helps me fix some horse-damaged ranch item when heâs here.
I love my barn, the horses, and the people⊠itâs been my life and my dream since I was a kid. But the financial reality is that last year, I subsidized every horse on my place. Thatâs something I cannot continue to do, in good conscience, to my family and myself.
Boarding is usually a break-even business at best, with profits coming from training/lessons/sales which I do not do myself- Iâm just an amateur horse girl who loves the life. I have no partner to support me or my boarders, only my retirement account now that I no longer work a âreal jobâ after 39 years of owning another small business.
My current boarders, who may chafe at a price adjustment, still have a couple options in the area (mostly higher cost than me for comparable facilities) but what happens when those places sell, or thereâs not enough room for all the horses?
I believe every barn owner will seriously consider selling as they age and as the business hassles vs. rewards get higher. As so well put upthread, stables are not a social service and they ultimately need to be profitable or enjoyable for their owners. If not they will change hands at the highest price for the highest use which is, these days, often for development rather than horses.
In a high land value area (which is generally an urban area where there is a strong demand for boarding) boarding and by extension dressage and every other horse pursuit is imperiled by factors far beyond the math involved in counting bales of hay and scoops of shavings calculated by a boarder who thinks their barn owners are âgetting rich.â Horse properties do not sell for development or for non-horse uses because they were goldmines when they were stables.
None of these dynamics are new, but as I age, it feels like they are accelerating⊠and the barns topple to development or estate-seekers faster and faster. It sometimes seems the Golden Age of Horse Fun is passing⊠I was very blessed to experience it.
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In your scenario, the ânon-workingâ adult actually was working running a boarding operation and their âsalaryâ was basically equivalent to what it cost to keep their own horses. Itâs one business model.
I have a friend with a trust fund, no kidding, and she has a lovely facility that was bought so she could have her horses at home. Trails on their property, indoor arena and round pen, solarium, the whole nine yards. She takes in boarders to help defray her own costs, but isnât looking to make a profit or even break even. Did I mention she has a trust fund?
The other business model is the boarding/training business is a business and needs to be at the very least, self supporting. IME, itâs the people with the most $$ who are nickel-diming BOs and trainers.
The super âhavesâ can afford to just break even or not on boarding barns, the mere âhavesâ enough to buy a place people canât. Itâs all a matter of degree.
Owning a horse is expensive, no matter how you slice it.
I am one of those who is content to provide a profit to the farm owner for allowing me the use of their facility and caring for my horse. What I donât want to pay for it training that I wonât use. I would rather divert that $600 to $800 per month to better footing, better hay, another caregiver. I figure I am paying nearly $1,500 a month in board anyway: I pay $1,045 for a stall with turnout and one blanket change and hay twice a day. The hay provided is actually the worst hay I have ever experienced (part of the problem with this is sourcing it)âI would rather pay more than feed thisâbut because I donât have that choice, I supplement and buy premium grain and alfalfa for a few extra $100s a monthâŠbecause the arena is half regulation size, I trailer out to a friendâs place on the weekend to train and have the care and upkeep of this use on my truck and trailer, as well as shavings when my friend can let my horse stay overnight. I also have ancillary costs: because I must spend my weekends trailering out, and I have to do the second blanket change on my horse at night (as well as an extra feed), I pay people to clean my house, cut my grass, etc. If the choice is losing boarding barns to development or paying more, I choose paying moreâbut of course, I donât get that choice.
As for the trainers, I donât know how they are making it.
I am now looking for a small horse propertyâ5 acresâbut canât find anything within commute distance that isnât in the multiple of millions of dollars or that doesnât prohibit horses (yes we now have developments of 5 acre farmettes where you are not allowed to have a farm!). But I always have hope that my company will allow me more telecommuting and then I can move out into the sticks where they still allow you to keep a horse on your 5 acresâŠ
I agree that the non-working spouse who ran the boarding barn was working⊠but, as you say, it was to defray the costs of her horsing.
And for as much as BOs claim boarders donât know what it costs, non-farm owners also might not appreciate the tax advantages of having a legitimate business helping to finance a real estate investment.
And I, too, know legit horse trainers who work hard but are also helped by family money. That makes it hard for the non-trust funded pro to ever have her hard work help her get ahead.
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Lots of interesting tangents in this thread! The quote below and the discussion around the topic struck me as odd.
âMy concern is that the current crop of top riders seems to have zero interest in teaching or passing on their knowledge.â see posts #55 and 61
Not everyone wants to teach. And, within the subset of riders who may want to teach, only a small number can become effective teachers. I think all of us can remember teachers in the academic arena who were brilliant, widely-published, etc. but were horrible teachers. The same is true within the equestrian world. If you see someone who rides well but declines to teach, you should not immediately assume they are being selfish. Teaching requires passion, effective communication skills and infinite patience and not everyone at the top of their profession has those abilities.
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