Is there a market for anglo arab stallions?

[ljshorses]

[QUOTE=feather river;4088549]
RPSI accepts mares on a broader scale than some other European registries. They are a more “open book” [like the ISR] than some others. Obviously some of us here are breeding on various levels.

Breed whatever you want. Stay in your own registry. Be proud of your produce and your registry.

What I said was “Arabs excel in Endurance”. They dominate that sport. I don’t know what your agenda is, but obviously there is one. :eek:[/QUOTE]

I’ve been reading this thread and pretty much keeping out of the cat fight, but really…RPSI is like ISR??? As for educating oneself, you are more than welcome to join us at Lazy J Sporthorses for our RPSI inspection August 2nd. You obviously have got the Books of RPSI not straight in your mind, yes BOOK II is like the ISR but BOOK I is like the Old NA. I know this because I have bred both and been to MANY inspections of both RPSI and ISR/Old NA (the slash is designating the 2 books or divisions of this organization). RPSI has the 2 books but it is not represented in their name (kind of like the KWPN has seperate books for the Dutch Harness horses and the riding horses but they are both registered under the KWPN). If you need further information a phone call to the registries would also be helpful.

[pegasus44]

[QUOTE=feather river;4088532]
Well let me ‘splain’ something to ‘ya’. That is not the registry registration paper. that is the application for the DNA. And yes it says the foal is getting SF papers. But it is not the “papers”. But the post was originally about Baladin being both a SF and an AA. He is not both. He is an AA. He was approved by the U.S. SF registry, when they were in existence, for producing SF horses. In France, the SF is their ‘warmblood’ registry. They allow breedings to AA stallions. [Being a teacher to some of you just makes my head hurt! To some of us, words have meanings–obviously to others of us, words are kind of squishy.][/QUOTE]

I think you should contact the people at the SF Registry in France and let them “splain” it to YOU. Here is the guy to talk to patrick.clerin@haras-nationaux.fr

He handles the registrations. Hope you understand French.

[pegasus44]

And you will have to give us more info than “‘Anglos’ are winning here and abroad in Jumpers…and Eventing.” WOW that is a stretch. The only ones winning in are the French AA’s. I already stated that.

I’ll post this here as well…

Just this weekend, SNOOZE ALARM (50% Arab) placed 8th in the CCI3* at Jersey Fresh. They beat some pretty good company.

There is a half Arab that is top 5 in the US in Dressage YR level right now. She won a silver medal at the NAYRC Championships last year.

Both are American-bred.

[Tiki]

VolteVT, there are quite a few - perhaps the majority - stallion owners in this country who would be raving jealous that you get about 10 breedings a year. Most get 5, give or take 1.

[feather_river]

[QUOTE=pegasus44;4088573]
I think you should contact the people at the SF Registry in France and let them “splain” it to YOU. Here is the guy to talk to patrick.clerin@haras-nationaux.fr

He handles the registrations. Hope you understand French.[/QUOTE]

yes I do, but the registries for SF and AA are different.

[pegasus44]

[QUOTE=feather river;4088944]
yes I do, but the registries for SF and AA are different.[/QUOTE]

Of course they are different with different criteria, but you said Baladin could NOT be registered SF and AA.

Did you ask Patrick? Did he say a horse cannot be registered both??

Here is a quote from the Anglo stallion KEYWEST’s website:

Keywest AA (1998, bay, 1.67 m, 64.01% Arab) is a 9-year-old Anglo-arab event stallion, already competing at international 3-star level in France. Winner of France’s prestigious 3-year-old stallion competition in 2001, he is registered with both the Anglo-arab and Selle français studbooks. Keywest combines excellent conformation, power, and style with top French bloodlines.

(website URL http://www.chevalkeywest.com/)

[feather_river]

[QUOTE=pegasus44;4090937]
Of course they are different with different criteria, but you said Baladin could NOT be registered SF and AA.

Did you ask Patrick? Did he say a horse cannot be registered both??

Here is a quote from the Anglo stallion KEYWEST’s website:

Keywest AA (1998, bay, 1.67 m, 64.01% Arab) is a 9-year-old Anglo-arab event stallion, already competing at international 3-star level in France. Winner of France’s prestigious 3-year-old stallion competition in 2001, he is registered with both the Anglo-arab and Selle français studbooks. Keywest combines excellent conformation, power, and style with top French bloodlines.

(website URL http://www.chevalkeywest.com/)[/QUOTE]

Well you are quoting from the owner’s website. Go and read it. It says ‘Keywest AA is a 9 year old Anglo Arab event horse’. It says he is an Anglo Arab right in the first sentence. The sentence does go on to say he is ‘registered’ with both the SF and the AA registries. I know Patrick, having managed a French SF stallion last breeding season whose mother was a French AA. Patrick says Baladin is approved to cover both AA and SF mares, but he only has one set of birth papers and those are AA. Some owners don’t understand the difference between registered and approved–but horses in Europe only get one birth registration [‘registered’] paper. Approved breeding stallions can get approvals from more than one registry–they do not get additional registration papers. Their original registration paper is usually stamped by the various registries who have approved them for breeding that registry’s mares:eek::eek:

ps/Patrick manages both the AA and the SF registries for Americans seeking those papers on their foals.

[pegasus44]

You managed an AA stallion? Who?

You said it was an SF stallion with an AA dam. Which is it?

[feather_river]

Edelweiss de Bonce

[QUOTE=pegasus44;4091166]

You said it was an SF stallion with an AA dam. Which is it?[/QUOTE]

Edelweiss de Bonce. He is a very nice stallion, and one to use on heavier warmblood dressage mares or to produce eventers and jumpers. I also own a Matcho AA/Graphit/Gotthard German Hanoverian mare, and love the French AA horses when bred into those older German lines. The resulting horses which I have seen in Germany [all of which were Hanos] were usually a bit more sensitive and of a modern type.

[pegasus44]

Edelweiss is not an Anglo, he’s a Selle Francais! Why would you call him a French Anglo?? Only his dam was AA (38.9% Arab), and quite a ways back.

He has blood other than TB and Arab, (most likely French Trotter, but his half-bred ancestors are only listed as Demi-Sangs) therefore he couldn’t be registered AA.

Baladin, on the other hand, is only Arab & TB, which can be registered SF and/or AA. SF is a fairly open book, unlike AA.

[feather_river]

[QUOTE=pegasus44;4091646]
Edelweiss is not an Anglo, he’s a Selle Francais! Why would you call him a French Anglo?? Only his dam was AA (38.9% Arab), and quite a ways back.

He has blood other than TB and Arab, (most likely French Trotter, but his half-bred ancestors are only listed as Demi-Sangs) therefore he couldn’t be registered AA.

Baladin, on the other hand, is only Arab & TB, which can be registered SF and/or AA. SF is a fairly open book, unlike AA.[/QUOTE]

Get over it. Read my post before you start typing, PLEASE.

I never said he is an AA. I know he cannot be registered an AA. He is not registered an AA–he is registered a SF. I had his French foal papers/passport, I should know. His father, I Love You, was a SF. His mother was an AA. You at least say his dam was an AA but add “and quite a ways back” What does that mean. His mother was an AA. She was his mother. How far back is that??? Go look at the pedigree and figure it out yourself.

Of course he has blood other than TB and Arab. His father was a SF. Most of us understand that. You apparently don’t.

Baladin is AA. I have said that at least 3 times on this post. He can be used to breed AA’s to mares that qualify and are approved by the French AA registry, and to breed SF’s to mares approved by the French SF registry. Most of us know what that means. We have been over this already. Do you just like to argue, or are you just having a REALLY BAD MONTH?

You are starting to make my head hurt.

[pegasus44]

Wow. You are quite the piece of work. Good quick edit on your part. I knew I read it right! Here is the email notification I received of your post as you wrote it. I’d be happy to forward it to you.

Dear pegasus44,

feather river has just replied to a thread you have subscribed to entitled - Is there a market for anglo arab stallions? - in the Sport Horse Breeding forum of Chronicle Forums.

This thread is located at:
http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=203853&goto=newpost

Here is the message that has just been posted:

---

—Quote (Originally by pegasus44)—
Of course they are different with different criteria, but you said Baladin could NOT be registered SF and AA.

Did you ask Patrick? Did he say a horse cannot be registered both??

Here is a quote from the Anglo stallion KEYWEST’s website:

Keywest AA (1998, bay, 1.67 m, 64.01% Arab) is a 9-year-old Anglo-arab event stallion, already competing at international 3-star level in France. Winner of France’s prestigious 3-year-old stallion competition in 2001, he is registered with both the Anglo-arab and Selle français studbooks. Keywest combines excellent conformation, power, and style with top French bloodlines.

(website URL http://www.chevalkeywest.com/)
—End Quote—
Well you are quoting from the owner’s website. Go and read it. It says ‘Keywest AA is a 9 year old Anglo Arab event horse’. It says he is an Anglo Arab right in the first sentence. The sentence does go on to say he is ‘registered’ with both the SF and the AA registries. I know Patrick, having managed a French AA stallion last breeding season. Patrick says he is approved to cover both AA and SF mares, but he only has one set of birth papers and those are AA. Some owners don’t understand the difference between registered and approved–but horses in Europe only get one birth registration [‘registered’] paper. Approved breeding stallions can get approvals from more than one registry–they do not get additional registration papers. Their original registration paper is usually stamped by the various registries who have approved them for breeding that registry’s mares:eek::eek:

---

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See where it says you managed a French AA stallion??

As far as my reference to Edelweiss' dam, she is AA quite a ways back, 4 generations or so I think.

[ljshorses]

Wow, is all this bickering really necessary. I wanted to read a thread about “Is there a market for Anglo Arab stallions” but instead I read who’s registered as this or that…really who cares? I would really like the thread to return to the op’s original posted question. It has definitely gotten off track.

[pegasus44]

Just trying to dispel the misconceptions that run rampant on this subject.

[feather_river]

[QUOTE=pegasus44;4091910]
Just trying to dispel the misconceptions that run rampant on this subject.[/QUOTE]

Well I concede the high ground to you. You are undoubtedly the world’s expert–and if anyone questions that, they can just ask you to get a confirmation.

In the future I will just try to avoid scraps with you, since facts don’t seem to matter, another’s thoughts and viewpoints are unimportant, and quoting people out of context seems to be your specialty.

[ancientoaks]

[QUOTE=feather river;4092020]
Well I concede the high ground to you. You are undoubtedly the world’s expert–and if anyone questions that, they can just ask you to get a confirmation.

In the future I will just try to avoid scraps with you, since facts don’t seem to matter, another’s thoughts and viewpoints are unimportant, and quoting people out of context seems to be your specialty.[/QUOTE]

Gosh, you sure have alot of spare time on your hands, and seem to spend it bashing ANYTHING remotely related to anything arabian.AND with that holier than thou attitude that is so attractive and so likely to ‘sell’ your opinion…Here and on another thread that you hijacked like this one…and perhaps need to get back to breeding, training, showing and selling all those International show jumpers you claim to have, manage and know so much about. and the western pleasure horses you know so much about, and the Doc Bar breeding you know so much about, and the Arabian registry and show scene you know so much about, the Half arabian registry you know so much about and the Hanoverian registry, approval and ‘intent’ that you know so much about, the SF registry and everything else you claim to be an expert on…and amusingly, it was pointed out in each of the above subjects, your inaccurate or downright wrong statements.

Everyone here would dearly like to get back to the subject of the OP…

Of course there is a market for a performance proven Anglo Arabian stallion, as there is a market for any well bred and proven sport stallion. AND, as another poster stated, if you’re getting 5 breedings that’s pretty darn nice in this day and age…
As someone correctly said on my post regarding arabian bred sport horses, there will ALWAYS be a certain number of people prejudiced against anything ‘arab’ up close, and that will slowly change but never disappear…Every year more and more buyers and breeders are seeing the value in adding arabian (thoughtfully and carefully bred arabians) blood to their sport horse programs. the more of these animals that get ‘out there’ and succeed, the more in demand they will become…It’s a matter of proving they can do the job and that takes time, as well as the quality of riders to help make it happen…The horses cannot do it alone…

[Maddie]

Well said ancient oaks! I agree on all counts.

[feather_river]

OUCH

[QUOTE=ancientoaks;4092702]
Gosh, you sure have alot of spare time on your hands, and seem to spend it bashing ANYTHING remotely related to anything arabian.AND with that holier than thou attitude that is so attractive and so likely to ‘sell’ your opinion…Here and on another thread that you hijacked like this one…and perhaps need to get back to breeding, training, showing and selling all those International show jumpers you claim to have, manage and know so much about. and the western pleasure horses you know so much about, and the Doc Bar breeding you know so much about, and the Arabian registry and show scene you know so much about, the Half arabian registry you know so much about and the Hanoverian registry, approval and ‘intent’ that you know so much about, the SF registry and everything else you claim to be an expert on…and amusingly, it was pointed out in each of the above subjects, your inaccurate or downright wrong statements.

Everyone here would dearly like to get back to the subject of the OP…

Of course there is a market for a performance proven Anglo Arabian stallion, as there is a market for any well bred and proven sport stallion. AND, as another poster stated, if you’re getting 5 breedings that’s pretty darn nice in this day and age…
As someone correctly said on my post regarding arabian bred sport horses, there will ALWAYS be a certain number of people prejudiced against anything ‘arab’ up close, and that will slowly change but never disappear…Every year more and more buyers and breeders are seeing the value in adding arabian (thoughtfully and carefully bred arabians) blood to their sport horse programs. the more of these animals that get ‘out there’ and succeed, the more in demand they will become…It’s a matter of proving they can do the job and that takes time, as well as the quality of riders to help make it happen…The horses cannot do it alone…[/QUOTE]

You must live next door to pegasus44. you arab folks are sure a cranky lot. aren’tcha.:eek:

[ASBJumper]

Um, actually, FWIW, feather river, your posts have disgusted and annoyed me as well… and I’m not an Arab person.

I’ve been lurking, on this thread AND on ancientoaks’ thread about her Arab mare, and was so shocked at your elitist, snotty attitude that I did a search for all your recent posts. Definitely one heck of a trend, there. :eek:

You need a crash course in people skills. Stat.

Carry on, guys! This is a very interesting discussion.

[feather_river]

[QUOTE=ASBJumper;4093743]
Um, actually, FWIW, feather river, your posts have disgusted and annoyed me as well… and I’m not an Arab person.

I’ve been lurking, on this thread AND on ancientoaks’ thread about her Arab mare, and was so shocked at your elitist, snotty attitude that I did a search for all your recent posts. Definitely one heck of a trend, there. :eek:

You need a crash course in people skills. Stat.

Carry on, guys! This is a very interesting discussion. :)[/QUOTE]

another arab going to give me skills lessons—very interesting…