Yes it does, and she’s not like…others. And while we can sit here and debate all day, what is it truly getting done? Nothing. Everyone has their opinion. No one is right or wrong. We all know what the basic standards of living are for a horse or any animal is. Proper and adequate food, water, vet care, and shelter. I believe what, Leslie, was asking was to be respectful and not “wet the decks” in her place of business. Matters of abuse should be addressed privately.
FI, let me put this in another perspective. Yes, I AM responsible for reporting it, BUT shutting the cam off on a true neglect case is actually counter-productive. Why? Because there are no witnesses.
I am not going to rehash it but most of the info is in my thread on the This isn’t likely to end well thread. How much of what she was saying was truth and how much was a lie is unknown but no one without a mental illness can deny that mare suffered a horrific and prolonged death. The cam was taken offline at the request of the owner because she was getting so many comments about her [treatment] of the mare, so I agree that they took away the evidence. BUT, I have screen shots!
If you have the d-link ip cameras, they provide a free service to broadcast your cameras so that you can access them remotely. It is limited to one username, so you would not have a “community” watch like mare stare (but you could share your account issue with trusted friends).
Laurie, I am truly sorry that this happened to this mare. It is heart breaking, I know. Unfortunately, it seems that she may have been seeking the advice of a vet (all be it, possibly misguided), so as far as the state is concerned, she may not fall under what was categorized as neglect.
I cannot, nor any other provider, control whether the owner shuts the cam off or not. There is no way to force it to stay on. This is why it is sometimes pertinent to keep criticism or critical observations behind closed doors. I will always kick myself for not calling the authorities when I was concerned about those arab mares. It was pitiful and sickening to see their huge bellies and every hip and rib bone sticking out.
You’ll have to forgive my investigative college student mind, but I tend to try to take in the whole picture. I am not quick to judge, but I am not slow either. I’ve been around, trained, and owned horses throughout my life, so I know that there is a flip side to everything and there will always be what if’s. I am not defending the owner, but many times, things are not always as they seem on cam.
K~2, I know that ip cams work for some, but they can quite expensive to purchase. I, personally, would never own one because they give hackers direct access to your computer through your router, not mention anyone viewing because of dangerous java access issues. I think it is much simpler to stream the cam to a provider, and have the cam password protected. Most streaming providers secured their servers so that there is no backward access through the cam stream.
I think the best way to explain my position is that, as a business owner, I have to remain objective. I have to have cold hard facts. I do not want perspective cam owners the impression that every time they turn around, someone will be accusing them of not properly caring for their animals. In MOST cases, owners do take care of their animals, and I would willingly go under the bus for those who do.
We all have our personal standards, we all have our ways of doing things, and we all have our reasons. In general, anyone who is experienced with a particular species knows the care they require. Some of us prefer a “hands on” approach while others prefer “hands off”.
Truthfully, as a business owner I don’t expect you to gather evidence and turn in your clients. But I don’t expect you to enable the abuse either which is exactly what Mare Stare did by silencing anyone that said anything that could be perceived as being the slightest bit negative. That mare’s death is squarely on Mare Stare’s shoulders just as much as it is on Mary Owen’s shoulders. They BOTH stood by and let her suffer for over a week.
I understand completely Laurie. We could probably run this around in circles all day and never get any clear answers. I know what I would have done, have done in the past, and where my standards and morals are. All I can say is that at least she finally found rest.
I have seen cases where horses go a week without pooping, and then finally poop. Ask Sandy Bolen. She had a dwarf miniature that we watched for a week. She and her vet did everything possible to get him to poop. Her vet, who is one of the top vets in the country, finally said that it was time to leave him alone and see what happens. He finally did, only to go down again 3 months later. He was 15 years old (ancient for a dwarf mini with his issues). If you had watched him on cam, you would have never thought he was getting any special treatment. You wouldn’t know that when he went down out back of the barn, I told Sandy to swat him with a riding crop to get him back on his feet. Is that neglect?
So, do we have an answer to the question in the OP?
You can purchase security systems that will stream to your computer or phone very reasonably. I can allow my friends and family access to mine to help watch my mares. Works great if you prefer privacy. I have seen set-ups similar to mine at Sams and Costco, although mine was custom.
I got 4 IR cameras and a server for about $800. I’ve had it for 6 years and it’s been worth every penny.
[QUOTE=Laurierace;7391320]
How about not pooping for 5 days due to a supposedly twisted rectum?[/QUOTE]
The twisted rectum was discovered on 1/20 at 1030 am vet treated Fancy for hopefully stool would liquefy and pass. This is what was seen on cam after vet left and fancy was cramping. She did pass 2 small stool in those days 1/20 and 1/21 go back and look at my updates. Vet was back out 1/21 and worked on her and on 1/22 at 8 am I made decision to have vet euthanasia her. Even tho she had passed more stool and rectum started to open since foal was out of her small pelvic area.
[QUOTE=Laurierace;7391507]
I am not going to rehash it but most of the info is in my thread on the This isn’t likely to end well thread. How much of what she was saying was truth and how much was a lie is unknown but no one without a mental illness can deny that mare suffered a horrific and prolonged death. The cam was taken offline at the request of the owner because she was getting so many comments about her neglect and abuse of the mare, so I agree that they took away the evidence. BUT, I have screen shots![/QUOTE]
I was notified by Heather from MS, about what was going on the comments made and she suggested for me to put cam private. Vet told me Fancy might get uncomfortable with treatment. My fault for not thinking ahead and taking her off cam. My worker was in barn watching her. I had to go to town to get feed while I was home.
this was not intended for purposelessly making fancy suffer.
If that helps you sleep at night, more power to you.
[QUOTE=Laurierace;7397011]
So, do we have an answer to the question in the OP?[/QUOTE]
Laurie, I do not provide anyone, at this moment, on this forum with streaming cam service, although I am more than happy to. Live cams are easy to set up, especially if you already have a system. We can stream IP cams, although there are some limitations with certain brands. If someone has satellite internet, ie hughesnet, I recommend a package that offers at least 40 GB of bandwidth. If anyone needs help figuring out what to purchase for cameras, I am always available for questions, even if you do not plan to stream them live.
Ok, you folks already got the other topic shut down with the bickering.
Please refrain from turning this one , which could actually be informative and helpful, into a trainwreck also.
I agree. I don’t want to talk about dead horses anymore either. I am interested in hearing about alternative hosting services.
I agree sixpoundfarm, hence, my previous post.
I am definitely curious about my options for live streaming. I have my first foal due in April and would love to share live video with knowledgable breeders so they can offer suggestions and their input. But I would hate to be on the receiving end of negative criticism.
[QUOTE=HorseKrazy;7399488]
I am definitely curious about my options for live streaming. I have my first foal due in April and would love to share live video with knowledgable breeders so they can offer suggestions and their input. But I would hate to be on the receiving end of negative criticism.[/QUOTE]
please don’t be afraid to put your mare on cam because of what you have seen happen w/this owner. I had my mare up last year, and it was definitely a good experience. even with a really bad last day, I was not criticized once. she was pacing, rearing, scaring the crap out of myself and everyone watching. I haven’t gone back and reread the whole thread, but I do not remember one negative comment. In fact, I received texts and phone calls all day reminding me to breathe, to stay calm, and just general support for a situation that could have quickly gone out of control.
I say go for it… 
Obviously any negative comment would have been deleted immediately so that doesn’t mean much. I will not give my money to someone whose philosophies I do not agree with.
