Looking to travel to Europe to buy a hunter - Advice please! :)

[TrueNorth]

I’m looking into making a whirlwind of a trip to Europe in search of an affordable hunter horse. :winkgrin: I’ve got a long list of items I need and am in a lower price range so I thought this might be the best way to get what I’m looking for. Plus, what an amazing adventure!

Also, I’ve heard when you visit you can usually negotiate them down in price because they know you are serious and are willing to come out. So it should offset the $2-3K on travel. Crossing fingers.

Who would you recommend I go visit? I’m looking for young hunter type horses that are 16.3h+. I realize most will need to learn how to be a hunter. I need an honest dealer because I really need a sound, sane horse that will last me a long time. We take very good care of our horses, never over jump and this is my last chance.

[keepthelegend]

I always say this, but especially if on a budget…try the UK. Go to a barn that has working hunters and look at their young horses that are just doing small novice classes and look at the young event horses. Free jump or set up a little jump and try some show (flat) horses as well. I have come across some super nice horses and ponies…brought over a pony that won at Harrisburg from Wales and a few others that were in the top 10 at the Pony Finals from England at very affordable prices off the beaten path of Holland and Germany. It’s harder to find and they are not presented as hunters whereas other countries have really caught on, but you can find a good one. Also try auctions. We bought a nice hunter from the Brightwells show jumping auction - he cantered around in a perfect rhythm, was slow in the air, and moved like a hunter. Nobody was interested as a jumper and we bought him for 7,000 pounds. Sold him to a client of Liza Boyd’s and now doing great as an A/O horse. I hope to not sound tooting my own horn, just saying some great finds in England/Wales/Ireland! We have never spent over 10,000 pounds!

[AKB]

My friend imports horses from Ireland on a regular basis. I think it is easiest if you work with an agent who regularly does business with someone who you know. That way, he has an incentive to find you the right horse so your friend will keep using him. My friend has gotten really nice horses through the agent. He checks them out very carefully if she sees one she likes on the videos he sends. She is very specific about her criteria ( e.g., quiet temperament, decent mover but not extremely big mover, good jumper, 15.3-16.2h).

[2tempe]

IMO you SHOULD.NOT.GO.ALONE. You need a trainer who can evaluate suitability of the horse to become a hunter and will be better off having a professional that you know and who as some stake in the outcome. I would never trust a horse dealer or agent in a foreign country if I was alone.

And don’t forget that whatever you end up spending will include somewhere around $8-$10k to get back to USA and in your barn. I’d think if you add that amount and whatever your price range is you could find something in US.

The risk you run is that you go over there in in your whirlwind time, look at, maybe ride 10 or more horses, maybe a few twice, then feel pressured to make a decision while knowing little about the horses. Recipe for mistakes IMO.

Though I’ve never shopped in Europe, I know a number of people and trainers who have. The pro’s generally did ok. The amateurs, not so much. Not that they didn’t get nice horses, but rather that they weren’t a great match.

I can’t speak for pricing, but if they negotiate down, you can be sure the horse was priced up in advance.

[TrueNorth]

Amazing! That is the kind of thing I’m looking for. Any contacts that you recommend specifically out there?

[TrueNorth]

Yes, I will be going either with my trainer OR if it doesn’t work numbers wise I will be sending over a recap of videos and information of each one for her to do negotiations and to look into vettings. She will also coordinate with my vet while I’m out, so that it is all seamless in terms of approving the right one before I leave. We would be looking at more like 75-150 horses, not 10. We would only ride the ones we like. Horses are actually half the price, so the import price really doesn’t come into play. It’s much cheaper to breed, care for and show in Europe.

[ako]

I went to Holland and Germany myself, with my trainer, and purchased a mare. 75-100 horses? You’ll be staying a month, then? Even the largest breeders won’t have more than a few horses close to your criteria on hand and under saddle. And they won’t waste their time showing you so many horses they know you won’t consider.

Figure $8-12,000 for import and quarantine (upper numbers for a mare). The car rental will be almost $1000. Hotel, airfare, food, etc all add up.

Estimate a year to train the jumper out of your hunter.

Just a heads-up from someone who did it, don’t expect to sit on so many horses. I sat on maybe 10. I didn’t get on maybe 10 others (why waste anybody’s time?). Every horse will be beautifully prepared and presented to you - that takes time. I don’t think you’ve done your research yet.

I would assume $50,000-60,000 in travel, import, purchase, etc, unless you go to more out of the way places. (Ireland, Denmark, dealers with less of a name, auctions, etc.)

[vineyridge]

PM the COTH poster Kareen, who is a vet and also helps Americans buying horses in Germany. Over the years that she has been on COTH, I’ve been impressed with her apparent integrity. Even if you don’t use her services, she probably has good advice that she is willing to share.

[TrueNorth]

That sounds about right. I assume they were going to have about 75+ available and I’ll probably only will ride 15 or so because I will only like that many. I’m hoping to travel to a few farms, so I’m assuming we will see a lot but we will have that laid out before we go. I remember when we went to Canada there were 200 to choose from at one farm. Of course, I’m only thinking of staying a week or so, so it would be seriously crammed with those kinds of numbers. I know about the import costs, but often you can find nice hunter types for $20K, so if you add $8K to import, you’re already ahead of the game. Also, I’m fine with a year transition, I’ve ridden a few recent imports before and they seem to have the similar training (forward to the jumps, use more contact in the hand, and need to learn to take leg better). Sound about right?

[QUOTE=ako;8412072]
I went to Holland and Germany myself, with my trainer, and purchased a mare. 75-100 horses? You’ll be staying a month, then? Even the largest breeders won’t have more than a few horses close to your criteria on hand and under saddle. And they won’t waste their time showing you so many horses they know you won’t consider.

Figure $8-12,000 for import and quarantine (upper numbers for a mare). The car rental will be almost $1000. Hotel, airfare, food, etc all add up.

Estimate a year to train the jumper out of your hunter. (My mare is by Baloubet du Rouet and she happily goes around like a hunter princess. Now.)

Don’t get me wrong, I got the horse of my dreams. She’s all that and more. She was bred for the top levels of sport, not for a weenie amateur. But she really tries to please.

Just a heads-up from someone who did it, don’t expect to see or sit on a fraction of those horses. I sat on maybe 10. I didn’t get on maybe 10 others (why waste anybody’s time?).

Shockemohle.[/QUOTE]

[ako]

[QUOTE=TrueNorth;8412099]
… often you can find nice hunter types for $20K…[/QUOTE]

I contacted a few places in Holland before I went over and they basically told me to go elsewhere (invariably Germany) when I told them my budget was €25,000. (And the Euro was a lot stronger then!) They didn’t even want to see me with that budget. (In the end, I upped my budget.)

You will definitely find people who will try to take advantage of the foreigner. (Like the jerk who offered me essentially a schoolie for €28,000 when I wasn’t interested in the horse if it was free.)

[BostonHJ]

Where are you located in US? Worth a little networking on here to see if anyone knows of something within driving distance to you before you go abroad. I say that having purchased a share in a phenomenal young horse who was found super close by.

[TrueNorth]

I think I’m in that middle place where I’ve done research and know people who have had success. However, I also am aware that people have been swindled and scoffed at in my price range. What’s funny is that I’ve already seen two fabulous horses for around $35K completely imported with x-rays. My only reason for not buying them is because I would prefer to ride the horse before committing. I can’t do this again, so I want it to be right. Of course, it’s always a gamble, but usually you know when you ride a horse if you will be able to figure it out together if you’ve been doing it a while.

Thanks all for the advice. I would really love recommendations with names/farms that you think would be fair priced and I can do my homework from there. I will obsessively search out references to make sure we are headed down the right path.

[TrueNorth]

That would be fabulous! I’ve been searching on ProEquest, BigEq, Facebook, DreamHorse. Nothing quite right so far. I had two that I was interested in. One didn’t vet, the other got in a bidding war and I couldn’t go up. I’m in Southern California, but would be willing to travel for sure. I’ll be in CT/NY for Thanksgiving and have been looking nationally in my searches. Europe is totally last resort. I’m just not impressed with anything in my price range lately. Believe me, not looking for a 10 hunter by any means, just something that will be fun and moderately competitive if ridden well at smaller-medium sized shows.

[QUOTE=BostonHJ;8412142]
Where are you located in US? Worth a little networking on here to see if anyone knows of something within driving distance to you before you go abroad. I say that having purchased a share in a phenomenal young horse who was found super close by.[/QUOTE]

[woodrwo]

If you are in CT/NY you should contact David Hopper in Amenia, NY. He has been doing imports for a very long time and has a good reputation.

[HuntrJumprr]

Have a game plan to maximize your time there. Have a budget. DONT go alone. Preferably with a trainer or agent that knows where to go, speaks the language and has established professional relationships. I’ve bought greener than I was looking for, and kept over for several months before importing (and been very happy). Boarding, training and showing is so much cheaper over there - if you don’t have a time crunch. Don’t be afraid to negotiate, but not so low it’s insulting. Narrow down the few you like for a repeat ride before heading home. You can find some real gems at the smaller, not as well known barns. Have a wonderful trip!

[snowrider]

As well as the UK and Ireland consider eastern Europe. A friend had imported several horses from Croatia and holy moly were they nice. And cheap. And the industry of exporting is in its infancy there so she said there was no high pressure sales or anything, the sellers were really invested in a good buying experience and good recommendations. Plus the horses were raised outdoors and had been trail ridden and so far have been very sound and sane.

[Madeline]

Must be discouraging to US hunter breeders to read this…

[horsechick]

Benny DeRuiter ALWAYS has fabulous horses

[horsechick]

[QUOTE=Madeline;8412352]
Must be discouraging to US hunter breeders to read this…[/QUOTE]

And yes…

[ako]

One more thing… Go not just with someone, but someone you can trust. My trainer was offered cash to sway the decision at every.single.place we went. And told me because she’s not the type to take it.

To all the U.S. breeders, I would have loved to find something here. I looked for a year.