Mare fight

[Hometot]

I have 2 8 yr old mares (ones 14 hands and 15 hands) that I recently combined pastures and combined them together. They have been side by side but not able to touch for awhile so I figured combining would be easy. It didn’t go too bad. A couple of hiccups but nothing dangerous or too dramatic. This was Jan 9th

the smaller of the 2 (dreamer) has become the alpha. And my horse that was super friendly, would gallop to me wherever I was, anytime. Any day. Won’t hardly come to me at all. If she does come. The other runs her off. She doesn’t fight back just walks off as the other is coming.

today I took dreamer out and when I got back my horse was at the barn waiting … She was up against the barn wall outside. With her head facing the fence. I took off the halter off dreamer went straight to her and started kicking. She was trapped. They broke the fence in the scuffle but no one was hurt. I has to Holler and wave the leads towards them and they ran off. And no more fighting.

but when I go to my horse. Dreamer comes and runs her off. The only other time is w grains and they don’t fight. They just keep switching feed bowls over and over.

suggestions ?

[SuzieQNutter]

There should never be only 2 grain feedbins. More than 2. The more the better and far enough apart so that one mare cannot keep the other at bay.

You need to be the top of the 3. Teach the dominant mare to come to you. No running the other horse off is allowed. You are the boss. The dominant mare comes to you or leaves when you say. She is not allowed to go for the other mare in your sight ever. Believe me when I say my horses are in control with a look from me.

Never again put the under mare in the situation where she is trapped. Never put them in a small area together.

When handling the under mare you should always know where the other mare is. Be careful as your mare will go through you to get away from the other mare. It is up to you to always keep the other mare at a distance.

The key to all I have said above is you.

[Hometot]

Yes I get it’s totally me. How would you go about that

There are 3 bowls. Not 2. But they still all do a dance over there. Today I moved the bowls in a better straight like and fed that way while I stood there and kept them in line. No fights. Afterwards I wanted to take out my horse but dreamer kept trying to get to her and mine would start panicking. Finally I got her haltered and out and she again panicked and has become buddy sour? So the lead mare is freaking out in the field. And mine is freaking out where I am. I had to have my husband help me get her back in and the lead mare away to unhalter her.

I’m very frustrated. My horse is one that not a week ago I could groom and saddle her without even putting a halter on her and shed sit there. My daughter braids her hair for hours and now I can’t even halter her without her freaking out.

I’m overwhelmed today to say the least. I’m not sure where to start with this and which horse to begin with.

[Scribbler]

Why don’t you go back to separating the horses, if that worked better for you?

[candyappy]

Honestly, I would not keep them together as the smaller horse sounds like a bully. Why subject your mare to being tormented on a daily basis? Just go back to how it was or I can guarantee you will have an injury.

[tazycat]

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Reported

[JB]

Horses should not have to fight over food, not hay piles, and especially not the “yummy” meals. Separate them for meals, either in separate pastures, or tie them far enough apart they can’t reach each other with flying feet.

How big is this pasture? It sounds like overall this isn’t a good match, period. But if it’s small enough that the submissive horse can’t get away, that’s asking for trouble. Some horses just cannot co-exist together.

[SuzieQNutter]

As others have said, separate if you can.

Doing what I do is that I am experienced. I can halt, back up and ask forward from a distance. The horse comes to me when called. I can point in a direction and say Get so as they leave a gate for me to drive through with a car or from on horseback I can ask them to back by saying back and waving my finger from side to side.The submissive horse is fed first. So as they can finish before the dominant one.

This is something for you to keep in mind and work up to. It will not happen overnight for you.

[Hometot]

It’s about 4 acres or so.

so I fed them tonight. All went well. They were hanging around together. No food left. No fight. They don’t fight on the hay bale which is opposite side of pasture but I watch and no scuffles.
after about 10 minutes of eating and me loving on them i am in the barn area and see the smaller mare going toward mine which is in the corner of a wooden gated area. She turns and starts kicking. Broke the fence on this side now and my mare runs off out to the unfenced pasture. She’s been out in it before and I normally walk up yo her and halter and lead back. Well tonight she wasn’t having it. Even pinned her ears at me. She ended up running and finally my husband which doesn’t do horses had to go to her and halter her for me. She refused to go so he had to lunge her a bit and then she shaped up and walked w him back up to another gate. The mate was waiting for her and I ran her off. We put her back and they walked off peacefully w no issue.

So obviously my mare has lost respect for me in the course of this week… something i have done as she’s fine w my husband.
is it because the other mare is violent w her when I’m around ?

I do have someone that work a w horses coming Thursday.

[Scribbler]

@Hometot

It’s about 4 acres or so.

so I fed them tonight. All went well. They were hanging around together. No food left. No fight. They don’t fight on the hay bale which is opposite side of pasture but I watch and no scuffles.
after about 10 minutes of eating and me loving on them i am in the barn area and see the smaller mare going toward mine which is in the corner of a wooden gated area. She turns and starts kicking. Broke the fence on this side now and my mare runs off out to the unfenced pasture. She’s been out in it before and I normally walk up yo her and halter and lead back. Well tonight she wasn’t having it. Even pinned her ears at me. She ended up running and finally my husband which doesn’t do horses had to go to her and halter her for me. She refused to go so he had to lunge her a bit and then she shaped up and walked w him back up to another gate. The mate was waiting for her and I ran her off. We put her back and they walked off peacefully w no issue.

So obviously my mare has lost respect for me in the course of this week… something i have done as she’s fine w my husband.
is it because the other mare is violent w her when I’m around ?

I do have someone that work a w horses coming Thursday.

Separate the horses now. Learn some ground handling skills.

Your one mare knows you can’t keep her safe and she is trying to stay alive.

Respect isn’t really a thing. Horses will always act to save their own skin.

Separate the horses now before one breaks a leg. Your horse is right. She can’t trust you to keep her safe.

[LaurieB]

@Scribbler

Separate the horses now. Learn some ground handling skills.

Your one mare knows you can’t keep her safe and she is trying to stay alive.

Respect isn’t really a thing. Horses will always act to save their own skin.

Separate the horses now before one breaks a leg. Your horse is right. She can’t trust you to keep her safe.

^^ This.

[Sistersiouxz]

Your mare is afraid and has no peace. Put her back in a safe place. The potential for worse action is high.

[Hometot]

I’m outside now in the freezing and dark putting.ip the fence to separate

[Hometot]

Separated them. They are both just sitting at the fence w eachother like best buds.

[Hometot]

I have someone coming on Thursday to observe and help me through some ground exercises. Making sure I’m lunging correctly and things. We have their pastures touching but separated by the fence area. My mare is back to her normal self of coming when called and wanting to be groomed…but definitely is in heat (winking, mucus, etc). Possible the other mare is in heat also but haven’t observed the normal tell tell signs.

I’m going to work both mares separately for the time period and walk them around the pasture together when I have 2 able bodies to lead them. Then I’m going to turn out in their own pastures where they are safely able to interact. I’ll try to reintroduce together at a later time.

I did realize that dreamer was fine w my mare until my mare had trapped herself in a pen corner or I was haltering and she wasn’t free to move away.
If i move them back together in the future I am going to rope off this coral area … otherwise they are in a big open area. This is just a peace off of that. It’s not tiny but both big blow ups have been in this area which is the only part of the fence that is wooden
this mare was in a hard from ages 1 to 3. From 3 to 8 she was by herself. For about 4 months before we got her she was in a herd of 5 and was the middle. Not top mare. And not bottom. Primary geldings.

my mare was w a large herd and she said she was never in the top with horses coming and going she never tried to rank up and was satisfied being the low horse. When she got here she was in w minis and she was the top dog but she is never aggressive towards the minis.

anyways. Today has been peaceful. Everything back to normal like it was last week LOL ty for all the help and if anymore suggestions please let me know.

[Scribbler]

Absolutely bad things happen when one horse is trapped. The dominant horse gives a warning with her ears, other horse can’t scoot, dominant horse kicks, other horse panics and kicks back.

Don’t ever have two horses loose in a small enclosure or one tied, one loose, unless you know they are absolutely totally fine with each other. Ditto to feeding them together.

In the wild or even in a big enough field one horse can just run off the other horse.

My mare leans over her paddock fence and plays very subtle dominance games with her mare neighbor. Who can make the other shift her feet with the least signal like a flicked ear. Sometimes they hsul off and double barrel the fence. Then once it’s settled for that day they settle down and may even sleep standing up head to head or groom each other.

But the status contest is ongoing. Horses don’t have stable rolls even in a given herd, let alone between herds.

[SuzieQNutter]

I don’t understand why you are putting them together if you are able to have them separate. I would check the under mare for ulcers. She will have been stressed several times a day.

It is great that you have someone coming. I think you are going to learn a lot. “Loving” on them is not helping this situation.

[Hometot]

If i have to keep them separately permanent… 1 will have to go. Not just the inconvience of having to buy 2 of everything, 1 field doesn’t have easy access to water so I’m having to carry water, and no exit out of 1 of the fields now and the point was being able to ride them together.
The trainer for tomorrow is sick so she’s hoping she is better tomorrow. Today was frigid temps ans a very busy day so just the feeding, petting and checking everyone quickly was done.

[Mouse_amp_Bay]

@Hometot

If i have to keep them separately permanent… 1 will have to go. Not just the inconvience of having to buy 2 of everything, 1 field doesn’t have easy access to water so I’m having to carry water, and no exit out of 1 of the fields now and the point was being able to ride them together.
The trainer for tomorrow is sick so she’s hoping she is better tomorrow. Today was frigid temps ans a very busy day so just the feeding, petting and checking everyone quickly was done.

Horses are herd animals. Not fair to keep just one due to ‘inconvenience’.

Honestly it it sounds like you are over your head. Hopefully a competent trainer will be able to assist.

[SuzieQNutter]

Carrying water is something a lot of us do. A wheelbarrow and a big water bottle with a lid that screws on.

Being able to ride them together can still be done if they are separated.