Jealoushe, It says that the content is not available. Did they remove it?
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Rank and file. Carry on. I just canât.
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Which one? There is a good conversation happening on the JH post.
If you canât distinguish between a scratch on the horseâs body from hitting a fence and a bloody mouth, I donât know whatâs wrong with you. I cannot imagine that the Eventing exception for the blood rule was designed to allow riders get away with harsh bitting regimes, aggressively ripping offf their horses faces in order to gallop as fast as possible up to the last 2-3 strides before a fence, coming off course with dripping blood, having your complicit grooms wipe off the evidence while smirking at any official who tries to stop you while the ground jury looks the other way.
Scratches from fences/galloping etc are almost inevitable from the nature of xc. Bloody mouths are not.
Becky Holder got pulled up and eliminated on xc because her white horse had a body scratch from a fence. None of these officials or ULRâs said boo in her defense AFAIR.
ML has now visably bloodied her horsesâs mouths at least 6 times and theyâre all rushing to her defense.
Clearly officials in this sport canât be relied on to exercise their discretion in a fair and impartial way. I repeat, none of this would be happening if they werenât turning a blatant blind eye to clear horse abuse.
Iâm losing tons of respect for these riders. Do they think theyâll get a free pass next time they need one if they come out publicly in support of ML now? Do they think Mrs. Mars might buy them a horse?
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You know I didnât use to be a proponent of the all or none rule but looking at other breeds partial rules do not work.
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Iâm wondering what the point of officials is if they are all supposedly terrified/powerless against evil BNRs and their sponsors. :rolleyes:
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They are on track to be required to have DQPs inspect their horsesâŠtrained USDA employees. Nothe sure what Iâm talking about? Welcome to padded horses.
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I might have misheard on the Becky Holder situation years back. I was a few jumps away and saw them pull her up. I had heard that she decided to withdraw, wasnât eliminated, but I could be wrong. It was 2012 and my memory sucks. But I was of the understanding that she was not interested in risking her horse to finish. Novel idea, thinking of the HORSE.
I think the other side needs to realize that people gave the officials plenty of chances to do the right thing, now they come out whining that the âbulliesâ are going about it the wrong way. âThey should write the FEI, the USEA, leave her sponsors aloneâ. Well, we DID that. YEARS ago and NOTHING happened. Maybe the âbulliesâ are tired of beating their heads against a brick wall. It doesnât change.
I was there back in 2015(?) when Demeter was ridden to exhaustion and fell late on course. VERY similar to what happened to Johny last year at Badders. Both pretty tough to watch. Elisa was given a(well deserved) yellow card and immediately issued a statement claiming all the blame. ML? Crickets⊠When the same situation happens with two different results, makes you wonder whoâs pulling the strings.
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Worth repeating!
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Get this. She deleted two of mine. One was only videos of her riding. Someone said she saw her ride in person and has âsoft hands.â My response was âsoft hands?â followed by three videos showing her âset and yankâ move. Smh. If sheâs not ashamed of her riding, why delete the videos?
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THIS
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She was pulled up and delayed late in the course (over 1/2 and they were not going to take off the time I believe). At that level, it would be unfair to the horse to continue as he was taken out of his rhythm and likely was tired. She really had no choiceâŠdoing right by her horse required her to retire. It was basically a very slight scratch but because he is whiteâŠthe blood showed vividly.
There are two separate issues with the blood ruleâŠone is abuse and the other is public image. I have seen blood on horses, including bloody mouthsâŠand rarely would I say they were results of abusive riding and rarely would I say it was risky or abusive to continue (obviously it depends). But the public image is real the reason I think we will end up with a zero tolerance blood rule. It just plain looks bad to the public (both eventing public but especially non-horsey public) to see a horse with a bloody mouth or nose.
As to the $$$ lossesâŠwell hellâŠIâm an ownerâŠand all riders make mistakes. Go off course, make an errorâŠhorses lose shoes, bang themselvesâŠget shipping fever. There are equimpment failuresâŠand many other ways we loss our entries. The sport is expensiveâŠand to me, I canât really defend the image of a horse with bloody mouth/nose being allowed to continue with the images for the sport that it will produceâŠeven if it means my horse will be eliminated. But I am concerned about such a rule change as I personally dislike zero tolerance anythingâŠbut then anything that allows subjectivity also is open to criticism and corruption.
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This times 100.
I am Sooo sick of the UL riders calling all of us âArm Chair Quarter backsâ
it is insulting and totally untrue. Most of us have ridden all our lives, and are very talented knowledgeable horsemen.
Just because we all do not compete at the upper levels, does not make our opinions invalid. Sickening.
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Hopefully the frenzy cools off, and Badminton may be enough of a distraction to help that happen.
But yeah ⊠I am going to have a hard time forgetting who posted what, and how disconcerting their remarks have been. Dismissing public image, animal welfare ⊠and most importantly the people who support THEIR sport and SPONSORS.
Certain people who think of themselves as big names and leaders need some serious remedial social media charm schooling. Refusing to enter the 21st century wonât stop the 21st century.
If any of those FB remarks are important to any readers, screenshot them soonest. They will probably go >blip< and disappear once cooler heads prevail. Minutes, hours or days as is needed for that to happen.
I am not for a 100% blood rule, at all. I am for horse welfare to be taken far more seriously by the officials.
By characterizing everyone who doesnât agree with them as âwanting a 100% blood ruleâ, certain people are chipping away at the possibility of a respectful discussion leading to policies and rules that most of the community can live with. Because the smurfs may not ride in the big leagues, but they do support the big league sponsors and represent the sponsorâs target audience. Some have forgotten that.
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I went and reviewed the FEI rules for eventing, dressage, and jumping re: blood/bleeding. Dressage is a straight elimination for âfreshâ blood with dried blood requiring an inspection by the vet to deem whether or not the horse is fit to continue the rest of the competition. Eventing leaves blood completely up to the discretion of the GJ, specifically calling out âminor casesâ of blood in the mouth from a bitten tongue or lip as being okay as long as authorized by the vet to continue.
Jumping seems to get it closest to fair, IMO: " The following paragraphs lay down the reasons for which Athletes are eliminated in Jumping Competitions. The Ground Jury
must enforce Elimination under the following circumstances: ⊠Horses bleeding in the mouth (in minor cases of blood in the mouth, such as where a Horse appears to have bitten its tongue or lip, Officials may authorize the rinsing or wiping of the mouth and allow the Athlete to continue; any further evidence of blood in the mouth will result in Elimination);"
It leaves room for the GJ to act case by case, but also enforces that if they initial judgment of it being a minor injury/that the horse should be allowed to continue was a mistake, as evidenced by the continued bleeding of the site, it will result in elimination. At least thatâs how I interpret that rule.
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We are also their sponsorâs target audience.
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But isnât that always the case with a hold for any reason? It might have made a difference that he was very late on course, I think something like 2 from last, and maybe she felt he was getting too tired anyways, who knows.
And I 100% agree that a no tolerance rule would be a bad idea. Way too many tiny scrapes from brush, etc to really make that 100% feasible. I would love if they did a warn list or something. Specifically applied to blood in or around the mouth, which I feel is rider influenced at least a good chunk of the time. My ideal world would be first instance, youâre put on a watch list, second yellow card, 3rd and youâre out and suspended for a good length of time.
Just canât imagine that would come into play except in a case where there is a real problem, not just an oops. Iâve been riding for 30 years, mostly eventing (though obviously at smurf levels), foxhunting, and some straight dressage. In those 30 years Iâve seen blood around my horseâs mouth twice. Once from a nose bleed after gallop sets, and once from a loose ring that pinched out hunting. Added bit guards and it never happened again.
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Please donât believe that many UL riders or BNRs refer to all of us âlower level ridersâ in any such derogatory terms. Weâve trained long term with serveral of them, have gotten to know them on a close basis, met their fellow âbig nameâ friends during training or social times. Tried some horses offered for sale by several more. These are all riders we all know of. They were all, every single one, incredibly nice. Never a hint of looking down on anyone in eventing that doesnât ride at their levels. Itâs kind of weâre all in this crazy sport together.
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I donât understand how a BNR could insult a LLR or these âarmchair quarterbacksâ because LLRâs fuel the sport. They spend money with BNR at clinics. They spend money to watch the events where these BNRâs compete. They volunteer at these upper level events. They buy from BNR sponsors. So these lower level riders do play a significant role.
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Exactly right!!
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