Mb civil suit rulings 11/15/2022

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

You are still not really answering my main question. I will play along* and say sure, maybe Eggbutt talks to LO and everyone associated with Michael, maybe they do lunch on Tuesdays, compare holiday recipes and talk about weather… How does that mean Michael knows what is happening on this forum?

I am just saying that Eggbutt, the dominant poster on these threads, is not simply a random Internet poster with no ties to the principals. It appears she has been in communication with Lara Osborne as recently as September. Lara Osborne communicates with MB and his lawyers.

I have no idea what Lara Osborne or the lawyers communicate to
MB about what is said on the forum. I would hope that they don’t burden him with any discussion of it at all.

So, your whole point was that you wanted to say over and over and over again that you feel that Eggbutt posts a lot and in your opinion talks to people that matter, and some how her posting a lot makes it matter who she might talk to outside the forum? Did I read this comment right?

I do not assume that LO knows what goes on here.
I do assume that if/when she talks with Michael she is not wasting her time talking about COTH.

I was just answering the questions you addressed to me, @trubandloki. If you’re not interested in the answers, why pose the questions?

[DownYonder]

@omare

I think patients that are legally prescribed controlled narcotics often are drug tested to make sure they are using them and not selling.

Even so - the patient could take enough of the med to satisfy the test requirements and still sell the surplus. IIRC from the previous thread, it seems that it was not terribly difficult to get scripts for suboxone, esp. for users who knew which doctors to patronize. So a user could obtain multiple scripts from multiple doctors, maybe in different states, and filled by multiple pharmacies in multiple states, and voilà - they manage to procure multiple boxes at the same time to sell or trade.

And I would hope that with all the recent focus on the opioid crisis, things have tightened up and it is not as easy as it was in past years to circumvent the rules.

[ASB_Stars]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Yes, her behavior was one of a constellation of factors that caused him stress prior to the shooting.

What sort of monetary damages (compensatory and punitive) do you think would arise from the stress she created through the making of the audio recordings and the SM posts prior to the shooting?

Remember, it has been clarified by Lazaret that his counter suit for the recording is not a defense against her suit against him for having shot her.

What are the other stars on that constellation? I’m thinking that there are more stress factors caused by LK than you are allowing for.

I don’t need to remember that- I didn’t forget it. I do understand the nature of counter claims.

[Sdel]

Here is a clip for you and @Rubyroo

Start at around 17:19. Commentators is saying LK’s testimony was just unbelievable. Analyst is pretty much saying she thinks the jury didn’t like LK/RG and that the jury sympathized with MB felt they would need to bring a gun to defend themselves against them too.

https://youtu.be/ubufL2hkuWU](https://youtu.be/ubufL2hkuWU)

Guess it’s not so far fetched of an idea if it’s being broadcast on a national television channel.

[DownYonder]

@Rubyroo

Why would the jury think it was their job to protect Michael?

Maybe because they - unlike the prosecution’s two “star witnesses” - are empathetic and caring people, who recognized that a good and decent member of society had been targeted and preyed upon by drug addict grifters who were aided and abetted by an equally callous parent who - as a retired attorney - should KNOW BETTER and should certainly BEHAVE BETTER.

[trubandloki]

@Maria

I do not have inside information, but I think eggbutt knows MHG and her family from that time period. I am sure she will correct me if I am wrong. And I will not get my knickers in a knot if she does.

So if eggbutt is friends with MHG for years and she heard of the horrors that happened, why would it be a problem to reach out to a fried to see if she is ok or needs anything?

Clearly some people go thru life differently than others. (And I am not talking Kanarek family different, that is a whole new scale.)
I am with you on this. If I knew someone on a personal level from years back and something was going on in their life that was horrible that I might be able to help them with (moving a horse, etc) I would for sure reach out and offer support.
To some people here that is clearly a weird thing to do.
Society has all sorts. Those willing to help, those willing to find being helpful as nefarious.

[trubandloki]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

You are still not really answering my main question. I will play along* and say sure, maybe Eggbutt talks to LO and everyone associated with Michael, maybe they do lunch on Tuesdays, compare holiday recipes and talk about weather… How does that mean Michael knows what is happening on this forum?

I am just saying that Eggbutt, the dominant poster on these threads, is not simply a random Internet poster with no ties to the principals. It appears she has been in communication with Lara Osborne as recently as September. Lara Osborne communicates with MB and his lawyers.

I have no idea what Lara Osborne or the lawyers communicate to
MB about what is said on the forum. I would hope that they don’t burden him with any discussion of it at all.

So, your whole point was that you wanted to say over and over and over again that you feel that Eggbutt posts a lot and in your opinion talks to people that matter, and some how her posting a lot makes it matter who she might talk to outside the forum? Did I read this comment right?

I do not assume that LO knows what goes on here.
I do assume that if/when she talks with Michael she is not wasting her time talking about COTH.

I was just answering the questions you addressed to me, @trubandloki. If you’re not interested in the answers, why pose the questions?

Well, that is a strange response to my question that was never actually answered.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Sdel

Here is a clip for you and @Rubyroo

Start at around 17:19. Commentators is saying LK’s testimony was just unbelievable. Analyst is pretty much saying she thinks the jury didn’t like LK/RG and that the jury sympathized with MB wasn’t going to side with them after they drove him insane.

https://youtu.be/ubufL2hkuWU

It was Bilinkas’s job to make MB look sympathetic and to make LK and RG look unsympathetic. He was quite effective in doing his job.

Making the defendant appear very sympathetic and the victims unsympathetic is what you want to do to set the stage for jury nullification. Bilinkas set the stage well. That’s what your quotes illustrate.

Whether the jury did or did not then engage in jury nullification is a separate question.

I have no way of knowing for a fact whether there was jury nullification at play here.

I find it absolutely absurd to think that a jury sympathetic to MB would have engaged in jury nullification to change the verdict from NG to NGRI. If they thought the prosecutor had not met his burden on actus reus, the jury did MB a horrible injustice if they returned a verdict of NGRI instead of NG.

[Kitty64]

It’s also the prosecutors job to present evidence to get someone convicted. As the commentators said, there wasn’t even evidence for the attempted murder of RG so it shouldn’t have been charged. The prosecutors case was flimsy, the witnesses unlikeable.

[Sdel]

@Kitty64

As the commentators said, there wasn’t even evidence for the attempted murder of RG so it’s shouldn’t have been charged. The prosecutors case was flimsy, the witnesses unlikeable.

And this is supported in that the prosecutor was willing to drop the charges for RG when offering the rejected plea deal.

[Rubyroo]

@DownYonder

Maybe because they - unlike the prosecution’s two “star witnesses” - are empathetic and caring people, who recognized that a good and decent member of society had been targeted and preyed upon by drug addict grifters who were aided and abetted by an equally callous parent who - as a retired attorney - should KNOW BETTER and should certainly BEHAVE BETTER.

But they could be all these things without deciding that if they didn’t protect the defendant, no one else would.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Kitty64

It’s also the prosecutors job to present evidence to get someone convicted. As the commentators said, there wasn’t even evidence for the attempted murder of RG so it’s shouldn’t have been charged. The prosecutors case was flimsy, the witnesses unlikeable.

What? The amount of evidence required to charge someone and get a grand jury indictment is less than the amount of evidence required to convince a jury that the crime was committed to the standard of “beyond a reasonable doubt”.

[DownYonder]

@CurrentlyHorseless

It’s absurd to think that the jury was doing MB a favor by reaching of verdict of NGRI if they did not think the state had made its case.

It is absurd that you cannot grasp the concept that the jury may very well have realized that MB needed help from mental health professionals, and may very well have realized that he needed protection from the K-Klan.

Those two factors would have weighed heavily on my mind, and after considering all the options, I think I would have realized that NGRI covered all the bases:

1. NGRI was an acquittal;
2. NGRI would help ensure that he got help before he was released;
3. NGRI would mean he would not be “in the community” where he would be vulnerable to continued attacks by LK.

[Sdel]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Kitty64

It’s also the prosecutors job to present evidence to get someone convicted. As the commentators said, there wasn’t even evidence for the attempted murder of RG so it’s shouldn’t have been charged. The prosecutors case was flimsy, the witnesses unlikeable.

What? The amount of evidence required to charge someone and get a grand jury indictment is less than the amount of evidence required to convince a jury that the crime was committed to the standard of “beyond a reasonable doubt”.

More arguing with lawyers….actual criminal defense lawyers in this case.

[CindyB59]

There is so much repetitive crap posted here, can I request on more?

I can’t find how to put someone on ignore. Tell me how, please. I was anticipating some legal stuff when I woke up to 97 new posts. Nope, same ol’ same ol’ except with a new poster who hasn’t read/watched the history before posting.

I’m not usually snarky, and I’m not really trying to be. But it’s disappointing.

Come on @ekat…find us something new

[Rubyroo]

@Sdel

And this is supported in that the prosecutor was willing to drop the charges for RG when offering the rejected plea deal.

I agree with this - I don’t think anyone was surprised that Michael was found not guilty of the charges for Rob. I certainly wasn’t.

[MorganSercu]

@Sdel

More arguing with lawyers….actual criminal defense lawyers in this case.

To clarify something, Sdel is NOT stating that MB’s criminal defense lawyers are participating on this thread. Sdel is pointing out that there are criminal defense lawyers who are members of CotH posting here to clarify things for the readers.

Carry on.

[Knights_Mom]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Sdel

Here is a clip for you and @Rubyroo

Start at around 17:19. Commentators is saying LK’s testimony was just unbelievable. Analyst is pretty much saying she thinks the jury didn’t like LK/RG and that the jury sympathized with MB wasn’t going to side with them after they drove him insane.

https://youtu.be/ubufL2hkuWU

It was Bilinkas’s job to make MB look sympathetic and to make LK and RG look unsympathetic. He was quite effective in doing his job.

Making the defendant appear very sympathetic and the victims unsympathetic is what you want to do to set the stage for jury nullification. Bilinkas set the stage well. That’s what your quotes illustrate.

Whether the jury did or did not then engage in jury nullification is a separate question.

I have no way of knowing for a fact whether there was jury nullification at play here.

I find it absolutely absurd to think that a jury sympathetic to MB would have engaged in jury nullification to change the verdict from NG to NGRI. If they thought the prosecutor had not met his burden on actus reus, the jury did MB a horrible injustice if they returned a verdict of NGRI instead of NG.

Hilarious!! No help was needed to make LK and RG unsympathetic. None. At all. Whatsoever. Ever.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Sdel

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Kitty64

It’s also the prosecutors job to present evidence to get someone convicted. As the commentators said, there wasn’t even evidence for the attempted murder of RG so it’s shouldn’t have been charged. The prosecutors case was flimsy, the witnesses unlikeable.

What? The amount of evidence required to charge someone and get a grand jury indictment is less than the amount of evidence required to convince a jury that the crime was committed to the standard of “beyond a reasonable doubt”.

More arguing with lawyers….actual defense lawyers in this case.

Who is “an actual defense lawyer”?

Is there an actual defense lawyer who thinks that no one is indicted unless there is enough evidence to get a conviction 100% of the time?

[MorganSercu]

Very important - after you have added a name (use the drop down - do not type in name yourself) and chosen length of time you have to “save changes”

ETA: I realized one of the screen shots was unclear - choose “preferences” to get to “notifications” and “users”