Mb civil suit rulings 11/15/2022

[smoofox]

@trubandloki

This made me laugh. Clearly you have never been to a barn? Standing in the parking lot, even in gross miserable weather, is totally a thing.

Definitely a thing. Boarders meet each other as they are coming and going…and chat. Staff chats with boarders as they come and go. We even put down some patio tiles and added a little bench right at the parking lot just to help with that,… just under a cedar tree to encourage people not to stand out in the rain. Because it happens.

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

On what statements has IM been proven wrong?

I provided you screen shots of many things in a past thread, that you promptly ignored, clearly.

Obviously.

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

On what statements has IM been proven wrong?

I provided you screen shots of many things in a past thread, that you promptly ignored, clearly.

Yes, I remember. You’d claim he said “yadda, yadda, yadda”, and then when the screenshot came up, it would turn out he had actually said something different.

Don’t bother with screenshots on my account. I’m not aware of anything he’s said that’s been clearly refuted.

Again - telling others how they should post. Your hero IM/JK has been wrong many times - you just refuse to acknowledge that and will strain to interpret his posts to be anything but what they are actually saying.

[Warmblood1]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Warmblood1

@CurrentlyHorseless

@BrownDerby

Some of the comments here are IMO just sick. If I were the assistant trainer at a big name barn, and partners with the owner (i.e, on the same page) I would darn well be entitled to ask her to leave. They safety of my children at stake? H*ll yeah.

You wouldn’t have legal standing to end the boarding relationship or training relationship between MB and his client.

What an ironic statement. That only MB had the right to ask her to leave. And we are told we worship him. It also reeks of LK entitlement. I can imagine LK torting that only MB could ask her to leave.

Would you say the same about JH as you do MHG? JH, who also worked with clients, trained LK quite a bit according to her social media posts, but even though he directly trained her, directed worked with her, he had absolutely no say in the matter? That MB wouldn’t take his assistant trainer’s opinion (of 15 years) into consideration?

I didn’t realize MB was running a monarchy here and that we know for certain he wouldn’t take any of his associates opinions into account. What a strange assumption to make. Is this how your involvement with businesses have been? You’d be the minority.

Not only was MHG his partner, she was a business partner, involved in the workings and operations of HH. Why on earth would he not take how she felt into consideration?

These questions are rhetorical as I do not believe this is in anyway how things worked. I also know you do not know how things worked.

@CurrentlyHorseless

@smoofox

If she was riding at our big boarding barn… barn and arena closed at 10:00. Only that late as we had some shift workers. No signed waiver/paperwork - no riding. No excuses. No exceptions. The sign/notice that must be posted on the wall is not a substitute. Surprisingly enough, our boarders did not see any of those documents as a nefarious Licence to Kill. Nor did they plot against us and put up cameras and mics…

In your barn, did you require the signed waiver before the first ride or before the horse was brought in to the premises?

Did you ever wait until 16 months after the first ride to require a signed waiver?

I don’t think the document was a license to kill. There is no such thing.

But I cannot think of a rational explanation that MB would permit her to ride multiple horses for months without having required the signed liability waiver, then require her to sign a waiver on Aug 4, 2019, at which point negotiations for her departure were already under way.

You do not know if this was a waiver, first off, and you do not know if this waiver was for LK or her guest. Stop pretending to know.

It also truly does not matter if she had signed one previously, had not, if this was an updated contract, etc. If she truly felt MB was entrapping her in some sort of murder conspiracy, she should have left immediately. Instead she did not most irrational and inflammatory thing and stayed while digging further in. Her behavior was negligent and reckless.

If her training agreement was with Michael Barisone, then Michael Barisone had the responsibility to end the training relationship.

As assistant trainers, JH and MHG can convey to the head trainer their preferences to not train or interact with LK and their preferences that LK be told to leave. I don’t tell my employer what clients the firm can or can’t take on.

I think the essence of the conflict was that LK wanted to train with MB and not be relegated to the assistant trainers, and MHG wanted her gone altogether.

MB, as head trainer, needed to make a decision to tell LK to leave, as MHG wanted, or tell MHG that he was keeping LK as a client. It appears he let the conflict fester and escalate rather than making a simple choice in April or May or June or July.

On Aug 5 Tarshis finally communicated to LK that she needed to leave. It is not clear to me whether Tarshis took that step on MBs instructions or whether Tarshis and JK stepped into a vacuum left by MBs indecision.

Her training was not just with MB. Her social media posts that are still up on her public FB acknowledge JH and MHG in their involvement with her training as recently as June of 2019 for MHG specifically. This was not a situation where she was solely working with MB. In fact, that was a chief complaint of LK’s which you also acknowledge - that she was not solely trained by MB.

You are describing a business relationship you know nothing of. You are setting stipulations in stone that do not exist. If an assistant trainer is working predominantly with a client and they do not want to work with the client, they usually do not work with the client. There are few hard and fast rules in business and businesses operate differently. You are presuming things about their business hierarchy that are based on zero evidence or facts.

[trubandloki]

@Jealoushe

I guess everyones ignore stopped working

I do not claim to have anyone on ignore, I have never claimed to have anyone on ignore…

@CurrentlyHorseless

I’ve only been asked to sign an initial waiver prior to the first ride. I’ve never been asked to “renew” either the waiver or the boarding contract.

Your mileage is different than mine.
But I am sure that does not surprise you.

@CurrentlyHorseless

Given the timing and the ugly situation at HH and MBs statement that he would get LK to be begging to leave by making things miserable for her, I suspect that the documents MB wanted her to sign, and called 911 when she refused to sign, were changing the terms of their contract in a way advantageous to him and disadvantageous to her, rather than asking her to renew a liability waiver she had previously signed.

I can say that anytime I have had to sign a new contract while boarding, the changes are typically something that make things better for the owner. I mean…why else would they be changing the contract. Maybe adding a line that covers them for something they had not thought of before. Or adding a line about no loose dogs. Or changing the board price. A new waiver might be because their lawyer wanted to update something. Really, this is not near as nefarious as you are trying to twist it into. Either sign the new contract or find a new barn.

[OntheFnce]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

On what statements has IM been proven wrong?

I provided you screen shots of many things in a past thread, that you promptly ignored, clearly.

Yes, I remember. You’d claim he said “yadda, yadda, yadda”, and then when the screenshot came up, it would turn out he had actually said something different.

Don’t bother with screenshots on my account. I’m not aware of anything he’s said that’s been clearly refuted.

Edited to add, I’d say pretty much everything about IM’s comment has been proven wrong.

[smoofox]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@smoofox

And one more time, for those in the back who still do not seem to understand this, he did nt call 911 simply because they refused to sign - but because of their aberrant behavior when asked to sign.

Yes, the aberrant behavior was RG staring directly at MB from the parking lot and filming MB with his phone while waiting for the police to arrive in response to MBs 911 call.

Would the staring and filming have occurred if MB had not engaged them by demanding they sign the documents?

Wow.

You really think all that happened was benign “staring”?? Imagine LK and her usual histrionics when anyone dares to correct or confront here - if it was crazy here or on other SM - think how it would be in person!

I am bemused that you would think it was simply staring that was the issue, considering the ninja tactics and other misery that was being inflicted on that barn.

They are BOARDERS - and ones with problematical behavior. They need to sign whatever is required to stay there or LEAVE - as a result of what they have done and said. How hard is that to understand? Unless you are LK - who is above and beyond any rules of any kind.

[smoofox]

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

Given the timing and the ugly situation at HH and MBs statement that he would get LK to be begging to leave by making things miserable for her, I suspect that the documents MB wanted her to sign, and called 911 when she refused to sign, were changing the terms of their contract in a way advantageous to him and disadvantageous to her, rather than asking her to renew a liability waiver she had previously signed.

I can say that anytime I have had to sign a new contract while boarding, the changes are typically something that make things better for the owner. I mean…why else would they be changing the contract. Maybe adding a line that covers them for something they had not thought of before. Or adding a line about no loose dogs. Or changing the board price. A new waiver might be because their lawyer wanted to update something. Really, this is not near as nefarious as you are trying to twist it into. Either sign the new contract or find a new barn.

BINGO. Thank you.

ETA: we had to change up the boarding contracts when one boarder decided the rules did not apply to her and she could ride whenever she damn well pleased, help herself to feed that was not hers - a long lost of issues. We reinforced the hours the barn and arena were open and said the gate would be LOCKED at 10:00 pm. Feed room locked in between feedings. All boarders approved - except for that one but she came around when fellow boarders talked to her and reminded her what a nice facility it was, less $$$$ than other nearby barns… plus location, location, location…

[Warmblood1]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@smoofox

And one more time, for those in the back who still do not seem to understand this, he did nt call 911 simply because they refused to sign - but because of their aberrant behavior when asked to sign.

Yes, the aberrant behavior was RG staring directly at MB from the parking lot and filming MB with his phone while waiting for the police to arrive in response to MBs 911 call.

Would the staring and filming have occurred if MB had not engaged them by demanding they sign the documents?

This is like asking if a sexual assault would have occurred if someone hadn’t worn a short skirt.

He had every right to ask them to sign what is assumed to be a waiver of liability. RG’s intimidation and harassment were completely unwarranted.

SMH.

[trubandloki]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

On what statements has IM been proven wrong?

I provided you screen shots of many things in a past thread, that you promptly ignored, clearly.

Yes, I remember. You’d claim he said “yadda, yadda, yadda”, and then when the screenshot came up, it would turn out he had actually said something different.

Don’t bother with screenshots on my account. I’m not aware of anything he’s said that’s been clearly refuted.

I think this is a good representation of you not remembering posts well. Good thing you do not trust your memory on such things.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@smoofox

Again - telling others how they should post. Your hero IM/JK has been wrong many times - you just refuse to acknowledge that and will strain to interpret his posts to be anything but what they are actually saying.

No, I’m not telling her how to post. Or you. She is perfectly free to post screenshots or not, as the spirit moves her.

I’m just saying that I am not requesting screenshots of her. Or you.

I am not aware of statements that IM has made that have been proven wrong. I’m not convinced by the assertions by others that he has “been wrong many times”.

If anyone wishes to post a screen shot of a particular statement of his they considered wrong, that might convince me. But I’m not asking or demanding anyone post screenshots. I’m happy to continue in my belief that IM has rarely been proven wrong.

I understand you believe otherwise.

[Jenerationx]

@Knights_Mom

I got the impression she feels owning multiple horses makes her more legit as a horseman.

Anyone else ever get that feeling?

I certainly did when I posted something about how staying and playing her game of poke the bear was probably a bad idea as is having so many animals you don’t have an exit plan available for them. She asked how many horses I owned and why I’m on a horse forum if I don’t own any. So, apparently you can’t be on COTH unless you’re a horse owner according to her.

[OntheFnce]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@smoofox

Again - telling others how they should post. Your hero IM/JK has been wrong many times - you just refuse to acknowledge that and will strain to interpret his posts to be anything but what they are actually saying.

No, I’m not telling her how to post. Or you. She is perfectly free to post screenshots or not, as the spirit moves her.

I’m just saying that I am not requesting screenshots of her. Or you.

I am not aware of statements that IM has made that have been proven wrong. I’m not convinced by the assertions by others that he has “been wrong many times”.

If anyone wishes to post a screen shot of a particular statement of his they considered wrong, that might convince me. But I’m not asking or demanding anyone post screenshots. I’m happy to continue in my belief that IM has rarely been proven wrong.

I understand you believe otherwise.

Now your changing the goal post to “rarely” proven wrong? I just posted above a screenshot where everything IM said was WRONG.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@smoofox

They are BOARDERS - and ones with problematical behavior. They need to sign whatever is required to stay there or LEAVE - as a result of what they have done and said. How hard is that to understand ? Unless you are LK - who is above and beyond any rules of any kind.

I agree that if they declined to sign a new contract with new terms, he could require them to leave with whatever notice was required in the previous contract.

If they refused to sign to new terms on Aug 4, he can ask them to leave on the terms of the previous agreement. Apparently Tarshis informed them that they needed to leave the next day.

What part of any of that requires calling 911?

[MHM]

Well, it’s only been 2.5+ years since that post by JK/IM. Maybe we’re all going to get our notifications from safe sport at any moment.

When someone repeatedly says “it’s not clear to me” after things have been plainly demonstrated multiple times, I can only think that the person is wearing broken Mr. Magoo glasses, or has no interest in seeing the truth.

[smoofox]

@Jenerationx

I certainly did when I posted something about how staying and playing her game of poke the bear was probably a bad idea as is having so many animals you don’t have an exit plan available for them. She asked how many horses I owned and why I’m on a horse forum if I don’t own any. So, apparently you can’t be on COTH unless you’re a horse owner according to her.

I do not currently own a horse of my own. But I am owned and employed by 25. Does that count?

[Knights_Mom]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@smoofox

If she was riding at our big boarding barn… barn and arena closed at 10:00. Only that late as we had some shift workers. No signed waiver/paperwork - no riding. No excuses. No exceptions. The sign/notice that must be posted on the wall is not a substitute. Surprisingly enough, our boarders did not see any of those documents as a nefarious Licence to Kill. Nor did they plot against us and put up cameras and mics…

In your barn, did you require the signed waiver before the first ride or before the horse was brought in to the premises?

Did you ever wait until 16 months after the first ride to require a signed waiver?

I don’t think the document was a license to kill. There is no such thing.

But I cannot think of a rational explanation that MB would permit her to ride multiple horses for months without having required the signed liability waiver, then require her to sign a waiver on Aug 4, 2019, at which point negotiations for her departure were already under way.

I signed upon coming in and when they renew. From time to time my barn says they redid theirs and like a normal person I read it, and sign it.

[OntheFnce]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@smoofox

They are BOARDERS - and ones with problematical behavior. They need to sign whatever is required to stay there or LEAVE - as a result of what they have done and said. How hard is that to understand ? Unless you are LK - who is above and beyond any rules of any kind.

I agree that if they declined to sign a new contract with new terms, he could require them to leave with whatever notice was required in the previous contract.

If they refused to sign to new terms on Aug 4, he can ask them to leave on the terms of the previous agreement. Apparently Tarshis informed them that they needed to leave the next day.

What part of any of that requires calling 911?

MB has a duty to protect his employees and clients from threats. If he feels the situation warrants a call to 911 then that is his call.

[Knights_Mom]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@enjoytheride

@CurrentlyHorseless

In your barn, did you require the signed waiver before the first ride or before the horse was brought in to the premises?

Did you ever wait until 16 months after the first ride to require a signed waiver?

I don’t think the document was a license to kill. There is no such thing.

But I cannot think of a rational explanation that MB would permit her to ride multiple horses for months without having required the signed liability waiver, then require her to sign a waiver on Aug 4, 2019, at which point negotiations for her departure were already under way.

Barns change contracts all the time and have people sign new releases or add an additional stipulation to the contract. It is entirely plausible that there was a new contract that would cover the time LK continued to board there even though she had already been asked repeatedly to leave. Nothing about an additional contract would have waived the requests to leave.

Notice “as of 12/01/22 barn hours are now 8am to 10pm unless given specific permission by barn owner”

I agree. I think the documents were changing the terms of her contract with MB, or perhaps putting in writing terms that had previously been left unwritten.

I think she has the right to decline to agree to a new set of terms. He had the right to tell her to be out in 30 days if she did not agree to the new terms. He had the right to tell her to be out in 30 days in any case.

That’s why I’d be interested in seeing the document. I don’t think it was a “license to kill”, but I don’t see the point of the document unless MB wanted to change the terms of the boarding or training agreement.

Out in 30 days? No way. Sign or goodbye. You don’t give someone 30 days to get hurt on your property.

[smoofox]

@CurrentlyHorseless

What part of any of that requires calling 911?

Once again, you manage to ignore the antics and threats that had become “normal” by that point. I imagine the reaction to that new document was explosive - based on LK’s repeated threats and bragging about what a badass she was on her SM posts… as witness by her SM posts about that incident.

But you think it was all about benign staring.

Mmmmkay.

[Knights_Mom]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Given the timing and the ugly situation at HH and MBs statement that he would get LK to be begging to leave by making things miserable for her, I suspect that the documents MB wanted her to sign, and called 911 when she refused to sign, were changing the terms of their contract in a way advantageous to him and disadvantageous to her, rather than asking her to renew a liability waiver she had previously signed.

So then she should LEAVE

GET THE F OUT
GO
VAMOOSE
EXIT STAGE RIGHT
DISAPPEAR
SKEEDATTLE

[trubandloki]

@CurrentlyHorseless, I think I asked this just yesterday. Did you watch the trial or the online recordings of it. Specifically the testimony of Ruth Cox? It was suggested I think yesterday you watch that regarding the 911 call you are insisting was from them not signing papers. Have you watched it yet? I have to assume not because you are still spreading incorrect information, that was covered in the trial. You making up what happened is saying more about you than I think you would like it to. Maybe go watch the testimony.