Mb civil suit rulings 11/15/2022

[trubandloki]

@Warmblood1

Beefman500 seems like the perfect sponsor for LK.

I can not like this enough!

[Aussie_2020]

@Knights_Mom

And even though no attorney has filed a Notice of Appearance for them doesn’t mean they don’t have an attorney advising them. Like say LKs attorney.

I agree with this because on another thread a poster that has a pretty good handle on the K clan said they believed one attorney was advising them all.

[CanteringCarrot]

@Warmblood1

@CanteringCarrot

@Warmblood1

It seems like the most important and meaningful thing the judge did was grant Mb’s amended claims to his counter suit, including the issues with the wiretapping act. Apparently MB has most of the relevant information issued in the subpoenas already and that the judge pretty much gave clear instructions on how to issue a new subpoena for further information that is more specific and very likely to be granted.

Maybe the communication on JK’s part to the judge had some bearing on the outcome of the contempt ruling and the view point that the subpoenas were too broad. Perhaps JK communicated that JK/KK were out of town and that was an explanation of why he outright ignored the subpoenas. Who knows. However, what JK maybe did not think of is that his communication with the judge proves JK is well aware of what is going on with the case and that JK/KK will be expected to comply with future subpoenas even if out of state. JK outright ignoring an additional subpoena that is well constructed and legitimate will not be well tolerated.

At this point, I’m pretty neutral over how the civil case pans out. I think both sides will be awarded some monetary amount. However, LK has already jeopardized her reputation and ruined any real chances of success as a dressage rider. She will never have a reputation worthy of a successful professional. Any professional worth their salt will avoid her like the plague. She will forever fight an uphill battle in the horse world, by her own making. She has essentially locked herself into a position as an adult amateur who will forever struggle with finding trainers, US breeders and partnerships, sponsorships, and/or boarding/training facilities as well as various professionals within the sport willing to work with her.

Personally, I’d much rather have a decent reputation and some chance at real progress as a rider with the potential for future riding opportunities than win some money in a civil suit. IMO, LK has already woefully lost and no amount of money will be able to salvage what she has done to herself. I think the progression within the sport is what LK ultimately cares about and she knows that is ruined - hence, her anger, deep dissatisfaction with life in general and refusal to move on.

I mean really, at this point, what has she got to lose?

Well - a lot of money lost due to costly legal representation and I suspect even further damage to her reputation when MB opens his mouth and tells his side of the story. MB has the most credibility here, which is pretty wild considering. I suspect there is A LOT we haven’t heard. Potentially she will be extremely limited with her financial decisions should she owe MB money - limited with assets she can have in her name, future financial decisions, etc.

Basically digging her metaphorical grave even deeper.

I mostly agree with all of that, but if the money isn’t hers, and she doesn’t actually have any/or much, she might not end up being able to pay MB, if it comes to that. Meanwhile her father can still fund her lifestyle, I would think? Basically, I think it depends on how her/their money is kept and structured. Just a thought.

Also, she’s of unlimited means, so how could she ever be limited, financially

She’s already damaged her reputation, but there could always be more, I suppose.

[roseymare]

Reading these threads makes me NOT question why I did NOT attend law school! LOL

I am pretty sure first semester would have made my eyes cross.

[Sdel]

@roseymare

Reading these threads makes me NOT question why I did NOT attend law school! LOL

I am pretty sure first semester would have made my eyes cross.

I wouldn’t have been able to handle the working for the benefit of slimy people aspect of law.

[Warmblood1]

I’d really love to know more about the status of any inheritance, etc. Just from a legal perspective and what would be protected and what wouldn’t. From what I understand, not every trust is untouchable.

I’m not sure if LK has ever earned her own way in life or if she’s just been given money. If she does owe MB money and her trust (if that is indeed what she has) is protected, then she is still going to have to keep assets out of her name and perform 47D chess for any financial decisions for a very long time. Not the way I’d want to live.

As far as daddio - just looking at real estate assets that are very easy to check online - I don’t believe JK or KK are of unlimited means either. I think this suit is draining them financially. JK comes across as too angry, bitter and resentful to be just concerned about golf. I also think he would have hired a better lawyer than Nagel if he had more personal resources.

[roseymare]

I think I could to a certain aspect because it could be all about making sure they had a fair trial.

[Christa_P]

Just curious in terms of money - who officially owns her horses?

[Sdel]

@roseymare

I think I could to a certain aspect because it could be all about making sure they had a fair trial.

It’s not about begrudging them a fair trial. I wouldn’t be able to live with myself to help someone slimy get away with any form of societal benefit from treating other people like dirt.

[roseymare]

My husband is on his way home from the Keeneland sales and found a signed Kyra Kyrklund book at an antique mall somewhere in Indiana.

He’s a keeper.

[Einhorn]

@Warmblood1

However, LK has already jeopardized her reputation and ruined any real chances of success as a dressage rider. She will never have a reputation worthy of a successful professional. Any professional worth their salt will avoid her like the plague. She will forever fight an uphill battle in the horse world, by her own making. She has essentially locked herself into a position as an adult amateur who will forever struggle with finding trainers, US breeders and partnerships, sponsorships, and/or boarding/training facilities as well as various professionals within the sport willing to work with her.

I don’t know about that, she’s apparently already got herself established in a pretty high end barn, and had the rented apartment as well, so she’s got that going for her.
I suspect she’ll have trainers as long as she keeps paying, since money talks. Now if for some reason she leaves that location, that’s where it could come up when trying to get another high class place. and if she doesn’t pay timely, that could give her a worse reputation than this case does.

[clanter]

@Einhorn

she’ll have trainers as long as she keeps paying, since money talks.

not always, there were several ahole billionaires that I refused to do any security work for (Ross Perot was number one)

[Warmblood1]

There is a big difference is paying a large amount of money to board and get private lessons and being a successful international level rider.

Without a doubt, there are going to be some BOs that will take her money and some trainers that will give her lessons. But she will still be severely limited on BNTs who will be willing to take her as a client. MB had many connections in dressage and most are in favor of and sympathetic to MB. What LK did to MB is of pretty much every professional equestrian’s nightmares. Most people are not going to risk their own hard earned reputation on LK and that is why she will constantly be fighting an uphill battle.

She is going to be hard pressed to get sponsors. Hard pressed to find breeders who want her to promote, ride and represent their horses. Hard pressed to develop relationships with trainers who have influence in competition. She will be able to find some people to take her money but her options in dressage have become severely limited IMO.

[Maria]

So in thinking about this, if LK has to pay damages to MB. We don’t know if her money is hers or in a trust. We know that JK writes the check(s) that come from the bank. We know her home in FL is protected. Doesn’t she also have a home in NC? Is that jointly owned by LK and JK? From a very quick google search, if I read it correctly, the NC home can be auctioned off to pay a debt.

Just thinking about the potential future.

[OntheFnce]

@Knights_Mom

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

But we can end our tiresome back and forth. I’ll just cite the judge’s ruling whenever you assert that MB was found not guilty.

Should I cite the Judgement of Acquittal form? I think it is more legally binding than this document you are puffing your chest about. Or are you just ignoring that?

I am aware and have never disputed that NGRI is an acquittal. It’s an acquittal based on the “not criminally responsible for his conduct due to insanity” part of the NGRI verdict.

@Knights_Mom has asserted that the judge is “wrong”, just like she has asserted Hut-Ho and I’ve been wrong on this. That’s what I’m puffing my chest about.

I have not heard back from @Ekat and @lazaret on whether they are still sure the issue of whether Barisone shot her will be relitigated, given what the judge has stipulated as the background of the civil case. .

I continue to assert that you and the judge are wrong as Guilty but Insane is not allowed or no longer allowed in NJ.

We all know what the verdict was. Well most of us do.

Someone either needs to get a horse and ride or maybe take the LSAT and go to law school. Although, based on their skill set, the LSAT may be a bit of a challenge.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@eggbutt

I wonder how quickly that acquittal form was put in front of Sceusi and how quickly he reamed his clerks?!

LOL

Both Sceusi and his clerks are doubtless perfectly aware of the acquittal form and also understand that there is no inconsistency between the NGRI acquittal and what Sceusi stipulated regarding the plaintiff being shot by MB.

But let’s wait for Bilinkas and Deininger to file their motions expressing outrage that the judge would state as a background fact that MB shot LK multiple times without provocation. I don’t see how it benefits SGF to attempt to deny that MB shot LK, so I’m not waiting for a filing from them.

(TBH I’m not waiting for objections to Sceusi stating as a fact that MB shot LK from Barisone’s lawyers, either. That was sarcasm.)

[Knights_Mom]

It’s a free country.

[hut-ho78]

@Knights_Mom

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

But we can end our tiresome back and forth. I’ll just cite the judge’s ruling whenever you assert that MB was found not guilty.

Should I cite the Judgement of Acquittal form? I think it is more legally binding than this document you are puffing your chest about. Or are you just ignoring that?

I am aware and have never disputed that NGRI is an acquittal. It’s an acquittal based on the “not criminally responsible for his conduct due to insanity” part of the NGRI verdict.

@Knights_Mom has asserted that the judge is “wrong”, just like she has asserted Hut-Ho and I’ve been wrong on this. That’s what I’m puffing my chest about.

I have not heard back from @Ekat and @lazaret on whether they are still sure the issue of whether Barisone shot her will be relitigated, given what the judge has stipulated as the background of the civil case. .

I continue to assert that you and the judge are wrong as Guilty but Insane is not allowed or no longer allowed in NJ.

We all know what the verdict was. Well most of us do.

I’n the states were Guilty but Insane exists, the party found guilty goes to jail for a regular term and is a criminal but treatment is mandated by the court. It is different from Not Guilty by Reason of Insanity where the defendant was found to have committed the act that would otherwise be a crime but is not guilty of the crime because he was unable to form intent. NGI goes to jail for a specific period of time like any other criminal. NGRI goes for mental health evaluation and is institutionalized until no longer a threat to self or others.

[eggbutt]

@Angela_Freda

@eggbutt

Can you imagine any business willing to sponsor Lauren Kanarek in any way whatsoever?

Dressage Hub?
NP steaks/publishing/security?

Certainly not DH! SW is a hard-core MB supporter.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Knights_Mom

@CurrentlyHorseless

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

But we can end our tiresome back and forth. I’ll just cite the judge’s ruling whenever you assert that MB was found not guilty.

Should I cite the Judgement of Acquittal form? I think it is more legally binding than this document you are puffing your chest about. Or are you just ignoring that?

I am aware and have never disputed that NGRI is an acquittal. It’s an acquittal based on the “not criminally responsible for his conduct due to insanity” part of the NGRI verdict.

@Knights_Mom has asserted that the judge is “wrong”, just like she has asserted Hut-Ho and I’ve been wrong on this. That’s what I’m puffing my chest about.

I have not heard back from @Ekat and @lazaret on whether they are still sure the issue of whether Barisone shot her will be relitigated, given what the judge has stipulated as the background of the civil case. .

I continue to assert that you and the judge are wrong as Guilty but Insane is not allowed or no longer allowed in NJ.

We all know what the verdict was. Well most of us do.

I am honored to be deemed by you to be wrong in the company of Hut-Ho and Judge Sceusi.