I know nothing about killing horses for insurance at Flintridge. The vet still alive? Not a surprise since sexually assaulting young women was the norm. The deep dark secrets of the equine industry, no matter how famous someone is or isn’t, should come forth and be out in plain sight. Killing of horses, sexually assaulting young women…all the shame.
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alot of folks would just as soon not hear certain names within the industry again. I understand that. But if the shame is not out there and folks reminded, then it goes away, it is swept under the rug. Look at USA Gymnastics and swimming and what those athletes endured for years. We cannot take the same route. I knew who Jimmy Williams was but never met him; Paul Valliere I met on one occasion, never met Barney Ward. Never met George Lindemann either; but we all know what Barney did/had done for insurance $$$. Who was the vet that euthanized horses for money at Flintridge?
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Here’s something I’m interested in: The COTH article says there were 9 presidents in the 70s alone of Flintridge. Let’s figure out who they were. I’m talking names. Who was there then, who knew? Go
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What I heard second hand, after the fact, would have put it early to mid 1980s. There was a certain vet in that era who would do the tail surgery on the western pleasure horses. Maybe the same guy.
It’s probably on a plaque in the clubhouse. Alan Balch was president in Oct 1993 (http://articles.latimes.com/1993-10-07/news/vw-43035_1_long-beach) but don’t know how long his tenure lasted.
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It wouldn’t really matter how long or short Allyn Porsche served on the Flint Ridge riding club board. He was ultra influential, helped financially by horses that she me back to him promoted, and he was virtually in love with Jimmy Williams. None of that would matter except that he served on numerous boards that govern our national Hunter Jumper world during that time. And if you research the Jimmy Williams award, you would find that he funded most of it. Truly, he had tears in his eyes when he spoke of Jimmy Williams and his admiration for him. Herein is the date your problem… We have a culture culture of People at the pinnacle of the horse world who would back anybody who had a relationship with them. All of this is so we can paint, and I am sorry it’s coming out today, as it serves nothing and no one any good.
People at the pinnacle of the horse world who would back anybody who had a relationship with them. All of this is so we can paint, and I am sorry it’s coming out today, as it serves nothing and no one any good.
Allan Balch
Confused. Is Alan Balch the “Allyn Porsche” you mentioned earlier ?
Yes
there were dozens of those anywhere on the East Coast. I wouldn’t assume it is the same vet.
knew someone who has the tail done, it went septic and the mid-five-figure horse died. Late 1990s so would be a low six figure horse now.
Nothing much has changed with this trainer.
We’ve removed a line of discussion re: accusations of insurance fraud. If the issues were reported upon by a reputable news source or there is a record of it being addressed by the court system or law enforcement that can be referenced, it can be discussed.
Thanks,
Mod 1
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How convenient. Well, if this is the standard then you better go start removing a lot of other lines of discussion across all the COTH forums.
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Frankly I support the removal of the insurance fraud posts, esp. those including names. If the poster(s) can find the links and share them, then we can discuss it.
There are rules here and we must abide by them.
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@pds not really, they’re pretty consistent regarding discussions of crimes not associated with legal cases, or in this case widely corroborated claims that have been published publicly for years now.
Discussions of shady behaviour usually get a pass, like organizational rule breaking, but not claims of crimes unsubstantiated by court records, filings, etc.
@TMares agreed. And if there are substantiated claims of unrelated crimes, they can probably be in their own thread rather than once again muddying up and superseding sexual assault and abuse.
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To answer the question about the presidents of Flintridge in the 70s, I used to be a member and went back and looked at my old roster which listed them.
They were: Bond Jobe (1968-70), Paul Fornaciari, William E. Steinwedell, Dr. James Brenner, Wilson Bradley, Robert Luarte, William Gerecke, Thomas Stoever, Priscilla Cole, and Frances B. Steinwedell (1979-81).
Most or at least many of these were parents of children there, or were showing themselves. Some familiar names given who is now making the accusations.
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Given the information now coming to light it certainly seems that there was a culture at Flintridge of acceptance, cover-up and/or “looking the other way” with such criminal behavior.
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I completely disagree.
I’m not around the shows any more. It’s been a long time. But this article and this thread were sent to me a while after it came out. And something’s not right about all this, which is why I looked up who ran the place in the 70s.
First off, people are talking about how Flintridge was 38 to 45 years ago, from how I figure it. It doesn’t seem to me like many of them were around there. I was. It is clear that both parents of one of Jimmy’s accusers were very involved in running it. You don’t get to be President of the place without being a Director first, and there must have been a bunch of directors, but I’m not sure how many. I just can’t believe all those adults and parents were “looking the other way” or “covering up” something like “criminal behavior.” Jeeeeez.
The way I remember it, we kids couldn’t get away with anything. The place was crawling with adults, mostly parents. And there was another Mr. Williams, don’t remember his first name, who ran the stables, with his wife. No relation to Jimmy, IIRC. Lots of grooms, too. I got caught smoking near the haystack once when I was in high school and was practically thrown in jail. Scared the life out of me. With good reason. And I never smoked again.
When we had lessons, there might be 20 of us in the ring at the same time. All the parents sitting there watching us. I hated having my mother there hanging around the barn when I got ready and then watching every move I made. I told her it made me nervous. But if she wasn’t there, there were a lot of other moms and some dads at all times. Jimmy would just laugh and say, “it’s good practice for going to a show. You’ll get over your nerves.” And I did. “The more you ride, the more it becomes second nature,” he said. I was horse crazy and that was great. I wanted to ride any horse I could get on. I always thought all the moms and dads were in cahoots to keep an eye on all of us. I found out later that a lot of them didn’t get along at all, but it didn’t seem that way to me.
The idea on this thread that somehow being in a private club made it a more likely place for misbehavior is just wrong, I think. It was the opposite. Everyone was into everyone else’s business. It was very competitive, but I always thought in a good way. If anything was happening like has been described in the article, I didn’t see it or hear about it. If my parents did, we would have been out of there in a heartbeat, I know. They would have gone straight to the police and sued that place for everything it had. And my parents were not the only parents there like that, that’s for sure. These were people with a lot of money and big reputations who loved their children and if anything were overprotective of them. Which is why they paid to be in a private club where they could control things or at least thought they could.
I remember Jimmy hugging my mother and me, with my dad right there. He didn’t kiss me but he kissed my mom on the cheek all the time and it lit her up, that’s for sure. He looked like a movie star to us. I don’t remember my dad being upset, mostly just bored, because the horses weren’t his thing anyway. He wanted to be on the golf course.
Jimmy wanted everyone to be a good sport. Not everyone could win, and plenty of us didn’t win very much, but we looked up to those who did. We wanted to be like them and Jimmy encouraged us to watch everyone else and learn, learn, learn, and he was always there to talk with our parents about what to do, where to go, how to show. He told us to sit in the grandstand all morning and watch everyone else to learn what to do and what not to do and said he would always answer our questions. And he did.
He gave us strict rules on being ready on time, not to complain about where we were in the order if we had to go first, that kind of thing. No whining about judging. He taught us to watch everyone else, and we learned to count strides on his system way before anyone else was counting strides. I remember he made us count the landing stride as one. When everyone else started they didn’t count the landing stride. That was very confusing at first but he explained why and then it made sense to us.
So all I’m saying is the Jimmy Williams and Flintridge I knew or thought I knew is not what I read about in the article or on here. I guess I’m lucky we always had good times there. But I think there are lots and lots of people just like me, and have to be, or Flintridge and Jimmy couldn’t possibly have been so successful, but I don’t know how many are still around. My parents and probably most of the parents of kids from that time have to be long gone, so I don’t like the thought of them being called accepting of “criminal behavior” because I know they were not and never could be.
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Two Lea thank you for sharing your story. The whole it didn’t happen to me and I didn’t see it happen to anyone else so it wasn’t common knowledge doesn’t fly though. We see what we want to see, especially when we are that invested in something. My guess is the parents weren’t there solely to watch lessons either. Like walking your kid to school, you don’t have to see someone get abducted to know it can and does happen so better safe than sorry. Everyone knew, they maybe just didn’t know how much they knew.
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