Yes, they will have this available. We just haven’t made it that far yet as the overall financial commitment was really, really high.
Agreed. I think maybe telling them her goal was to ride at a NCAA level in college prompted some of this. This is certainly our fault, but I also believe telling them she’s serios about her riding and not just here to play on pony’s is something they needed to hear directly (which they mostly already knew).
She just needs more saddle time, and hopefully we can get that in an affordable fashion.
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Yes, the book that @Railbird mentioned is adult-oriented and not so in the weeds that you’ll be deathly bored, but it will give you a very realistic idea of the training, care, and management that goes into these animals and showing—and perhaps give a bit more insight as to why you must own or lease an animal to bring your daughter’s riding to the next level.
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Yes, this makes sense. I think we’re eventually going to have to make a decision between:
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More seat time at an affordable cost, meaning 3-4 days of riding each week on multiple horses and moderate horses at horse shows or even a half-lease type format
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We go all in with a higher end horse lease that sets her up for better performance at horse shows.
From what all I have read in this forum today alone, I honestly lean toward a moderate, half-lease type structure (if they will even offer us this) and us putting more $ toward more lessons or riding days without instruction and more shows (regardless of whether they are A-rated or not). Or just upping the riding days and shows, but let them give her any horse they like and we’ll just see how she does. It sounds like Time/Experience with horses at this age is more valuable than Show Performance or Show Level (A vs. Non-Rated).
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Right, ask them for a blank copy (though with amounts written in), so you can read it to understand it better. So you as a family can discuss it and decide if it is financially doable and time doable, etc.
They should be more than willing.
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Yeah, this is ideal. Reminds me of when my neighborhood friends and I would jump on our bikes at 7:30am, go all over town and do all kinds of crazy things, and be back home at 6pm for dinner! Unfortunately kids these days just don’t get those opportunities in mid-sized cities, it’s way more structured and supervised nowadays. I think you can still get those experiences in more rural, non-suburban areas but we just don’t live in one of those areas unfortunately.
@Railbird–this is a great post.
OP, if you’re not comforable with the financial commitment this entails, it doesn’t mean that your daughter can’t ride, is a bad rider, or that she can’t find more opportunities to ride later on in different ways. Have an honest conversation with the trainer.
But people are right that it’s not like the barn isn’t necessarily “milking” for more money (although there are certainly fair and unfair lease contracts out there and ethical and unethical barns), but to play at the higher levels in the hunters requires considerably more than what even the average upper-upper-middle-class family can afford. It’s not that tennis, cheer, and hockey aren’t costly, but if you put in a substantial chunk of change, you can play in the “big leagues” with your kid that may only get you a taste of horse showing.
Because training and maintaining an equestrian athlete–in an ethical fashion–is very costly on the part of the barn.
Years ago, even before my time, people have said it was more common to have horses in lessons jump high frequently (and all wear the same saddles, with minimal vet care and maintenance) but that wasn’t great for the horses.
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Don’t get me wrong, we’re up for increasing the budget to help her with her dream. But it has to be affordable (not crazy expensive) and we have to be confident we’re getting something in return. I’m hoping we can find a happy medium for the next year or two, then revisit again (see options in a different reply above).
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This is where I’m not quite sure you’re understanding—very, very, very few barns (if any) allow little Susie to ride more than two times a week without owning or leasing a horse. Even if you wanted to lesson 5x a week and go to every horse show on a school horse, most barns would say no to that. Their revenue, like it or not, does not come from lessons; it comes from converting serious lesson kids to kids who pursue the sport in a serious way—which as you are learning is very different. There is no “wrong” answer here for you or your family, but you need to temper your expectations. Also note that a half-lease would only be three days—one more day of riding—per week.
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Understood, thank you. At least with a half lease, we wouldn’t bear the full financial risk of unexpected issues (that we aren’t going to be able to foresee very well), she would increase her riding time by 50% per week, and she would have a really good shot at getting a good horse at a show.
Unfortunately the price of a full lease of this particular horse just feels like it’s too much for her age and for where she is right now in her progression.
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So what level are the stars at this barn competing at? What level did or does the instructor compete at? If daughter is doing two foot unrated shows, are other groups of kids heading to other shows on the regular?
I realize that all childrens sports these days are competition oriented and you get them out competing at beginner levels in every sport. I also realize it’s possible to have the full cost Top Show Horse experience at an A show jumping 2 foot 6.
When I was kid competitive jumping started at 3 feet. I still don’t see the point to pay the A show costs to jump 2 foot 6 (not sure how low rated classed go).
Does this barn send any kids out to higher jumps? Where I live there’s a pretty clear divide at about 3 feet in terms of cost of horse and quality of training and focus. Most juniors don’t go above 3 feet at our rated shows, and some can proudly claim to have been Cross Rails Champions. Then they end up as beginner instructors at lesson barns. The folks who jump 4 and 5 feet are at different shows, different trainers
So maybe scope out the full parameters of your barn. Are they getting their kids over that 3 foot mark? If they aren’t that’s not a problem for a ten year old, but it does mean that if she really is that focused and talented she needs to move to another program in her teens. Also that the program she’s in isn’t as top level as it might claim.
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I think that’s a great start! And please: ask these questions of your trainer. I know you’re asking us because you largely don’t know what to ask, but consider this like any other major transaction you’ve made in your lifetime… Nothing is too stupid or menial and your trainer, if they’re worth their salt, has heard it all before. Also remember that capitalism is the name of the game here: your trainer may have proposed a lease at $X, but if you say “We want to lease and only pay $Y,” they will find you something suitable.
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If they offer a half-lease option on the barn, I would go with that for an eleven-year-old short stirrup kid for a few months. (You didn’t say that they did, not all barns do.) But people are also right that it’s not “the same” as full leasing and owning, opportunity-wise, and yes, you can’t expect the same competitive opportunities. (Which isn’t necessarily a bad thing.)
I part-leased for years as an adult in dressage and briefly h/j, but I have zero competitive ambitions and did so on horses that were old/small/ undesirable in various ways.
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Got it. We will ask for sure. I know one of the instructors (not hers) recently won a big regional or national show with 4 and 5 foot jumps. And one of their riders does a lot of 3’3" national shows and seems to place really high regularly. But we don’t have any exposure to him/them honestly and just read about it online.
I completely agree.
Personally, I don’t see the point of paying “A” show prices to compete in Short Stirrup, unless you are in a barn where the trainer ONLY goes to “A” shows. More competitions at less prestigious shows will give you “more bang for the buck”.
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Has your daughter ever been on a trail ride? Up and down hills, through a creek, over a ditch, hopped off to open a gate and remounted from the ground? I once boarded at a barn with an Olympic team short list dressage rider instructor and floored the whole tack room full of proper equestrian ladies when I asked if there was any place on the farm where I could school my new mare on water crossing. They were literally open-mouthed and speechless until one finally stammered “why would you want your horse to cross water?”
Point is that there is way more on the path to horsewomanship than between arena rails.
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I think it’s perfectly reasonable to ask to start with a half lease and a local schedule for the next year and step up the days per week committment- maybe a half lease for 3 days (1 lesson two free rides for flatwork to practice) and an additional lesson on an additional horse on non-show weeks. I also don’t think there’s much to be gained by doing A shows instead of local shows at her current level- you can save your money if she can still get quality instruction and opportunity to practice horse showing without having to travel a long distance and pay all the extras.
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Well, sure, and internationally, there are several. I’m just pointing out the attrition rate, and how there are many, MANY very well trained horsemen in the world who will never have the elite horseflesh under them for such a venture.
The training is available. The knowledge is available. The hardwork is up to the student, of course. But without the horse, well… (and since we are talking Olympics here, it’s horseS. You have to have several in various stages of development.)
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Tangent: one of the reasons for “only X lessons/week” with a lease horse is that horses will break down if overjumped (or even overstressed on flatwork). If the barn has horses worthy of being leased for competition, they have to limit the amount of leg pounding the horse will incur with a young, enthusiastic rider who doesn’t quite have extensive judgement yet. But your daughter should be riding more, which might mean riding at both barns. Have you considered that?
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There certainly is.
My first lesson barn was a hunter barn and we had regular trail-ride lessons. They even started off with fording a creek! Included jumping downed trees.
But that was 60 years ago …
And shows had outside courses and some of the hunters actually hunted
@HeelsDown123, I will just add that you are a dream horse parent and your daughter is truly blessed. I wish you and her all joy and success!
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