Nippy gelding!

[kfrilly]

I’m in serious need of some creative ideas for my little turd of a gelding. He’s got a terrible habit of nipping and I’m at a loss of what to try that actually works for him.

The first few months I had him we never had this issue, but he’s in a pen with another gelding whose idea of ‘playing’ is biting/nipping at the others’ faces and shoulders relentlessly. My guy has now taken on this habit and is nippy with me (playful, nothing aggressive like a full on bite), which means that when I try to reprimand him for nipping he tends to think I’m playing and will just engage even more. He’s four, going on five, so still in that young and annoying gelding-type stage. What I was doing was just vigorously rubbing on his face/nose whenever he’d nip - not smacking, I don’t want a headshy horse. If we’re in the arena and he tries to nip I move his feet, but nothing seems to be working.

He’s beginning to really wear on my nerves with this. Anyone have suggestions? Someone at the barn suggested cayenne pepper, but I imagine I’d have to roll in the powder to make sure I got everything. :lol:

[Xanthoria]

I don’t know… sometimes you have to open a can on them to get the message through. I have had two horses who each bit me ONCE and never again. They were never headshy.

[Scribbler]

Handle him in a rope halter and rope lead. When he tries to nip shank him hard and send him backwards away from you as fast as possible. Move his feet. Shout. Growl. Be a big boss mare telling him he will die if he ever tried this again.

Horses can play bitey face all day and with humans they can play nip slap nip all day too.

If however you send them away hard and fast and they need to move their feet they realize it’s not a game and its one they aren’t winni g too.

Obviously set this up so its safe like do it in a paddock or round pen.

[4LeafCloverFarm]

I had a “mouthy” gelding. He never bit me or anyone else… he just liked to rest his lips on your arm. head, rear (when picking his front feet), etc. and he’d wiggle his upper lip. Obviously, not wanting this to turn into something else, and because a simple stern voice proved to be an amusement for him, a carried a bat (just a standard 18" riding crop). Every time he rested on me with his lips I’d pop him on the shoulder or if I was picking his front hooves, I’d pop him on the rear and give a very stern “No”. He’s a stubborn horse, but smart and he figured it out very quickly. He’s not repeated this weird behavior in, gosh, it has to be 14 years?

And just to note, when I say “pop” I don’t mean haul on him at full force, over head swing, in anger. I mean a normal slap with the crop to get his attention. Some horses, a stern voice and the look of death works great, on others, they just grin and smirk at you, and a bit more encouragement is required!

[CanteringCarrot]

@Scribbler

Handle him in a rope halter and rope lead. When he tries to nip shank him hard and send him backwards away from you as fast as possible. Move his feet. Shout. Growl. Be a big boss mare telling him he will die if he ever tried this again.

Horses can play bitey face all day and with humans they can play nip slap nip all day too.

If however you send them away hard and fast and they need to move their feet they realize it’s not a game and its one they aren’t winni g too.

Obviously set this up so its safe like do it in a paddock or round pen.

This.

I know of a horse that can be nippy, and still is with some, but all it took from me was a fierce turn around, hard and fast back-up, and a loud warning. My reaction to a nippy horse can be a bit “dramatic” but I never have to tell them again. I’d rather put the fear in them once and draw a hard line than just tap them on the nose and wait for the next time. They don’t become afraid of me, or head shy, but they become aware of the boundary. Said horse in my example is a little, erm, “hard headed” and I feel as though he needs a signal that is dominant, loud, and clear. My more sensitive horse doesn’t require such a hard correction if he begins to test a boundary (he doesn’t nip though).

[dog_amp_horsemom]

I agree —let your horse nip or bite and then IMMEDIATELY back your horse – back, back, back ( using a rope halter with some knots on the nose for more impact) and then go about your business like it never happened.

[merrygoround]

Do not make a move on your horse’s head or neck for nipping. Anywhere else on his body is fair game. A quick swat with a whip, accompanied by a loud command will get the point across.

You have two seconds to react! So react, and then go about your business.

Repeat as necessary.

[DressageChic2]

@merrygoround

Do not make a move on your horse’s head or neck for nipping. Anywhere else on his body is fair game. A quick swat with a whip, accompanied by a loud command will get the point across.

You have two seconds to react! So react, and then go about your business.

Repeat as necessary.

this!!!

my pony stallion can be mouthy but he would love nothing more than to play the nip/smack game…aaaaaaaaallllllllllllll day!

i almost let him do it then either pinch him hard (acrylic nails!) or give him a sharp tap on the fetlock with my boot toecap! but in a way he cant see it was me.
that gets him thinking and stops him repeating it.

he is pretty bull headed about this, its his only bad habit and he never BITES just pulls at loose clothing but the pinch really works.

[chestnutmarebeware]

As my trainer told me years ago when my young gelding took a bite out of my arm, “The next time he goes for you, you have five seconds to convince him he’s about to die. Then drop it.”

Sure enough, a day or two later he tried again and I unleashed my inner crazy person (pre-cell-phone era, thankfully!), and he never offered to bite again.

[JB]

Yes, that can has to be opened Sometimes the head is the only place you can reach or affect, but I agree, never the face. I’m not above an elbow or fist to the chin - it doesn’t look like it comes from me, it feels like they caused it.

But if you’ve got the space, then yelling and getting in their face and making them backpedal to the point of almost falling over themselves works well. If a halter and lead is on, I don’t really like shanking, as that might lead to rearing, but I do like to flip the lead rope so that the snap might bang the chin just be careful that the halter isn’t so loose that the snap may end up swinging into the eye.

And then, leave them alone. 3 seconds of unleashing on them, then drop it, give him some time to think about what just happened. This might be a few seconds, might be a few minutes, then just go back to what you were doing, no grudges, no holdover anything. That tells him it was the action, not him, that is the issue.

If he comes back for more, then you didn’t make it clear you aren’t playing a game.

[kfrilly]

Oh, wow! Thanks for all the suggestions, guys! I’ll definitely trying really rushing those feet back next time we’re in the arena. I’ve got a rope halter/lead set-up with no clips or metal on them, so thankfully no worrying about catching him with those. He’s totally the type of horse where a stern voice alone won’t bother him, that grin and smirk is exactly his reaction, hahaha.

I’ve been so cautious with not wanting to create a new issue in trying to solve this one, but I’m admittedly also a bit of a softy sometimes. Guess I’m gonna have to work on upping my boss mare attitude.

Thanks again!

[Scribbler]

I’m dealing with mares that will draw blood over being brushed, girthed, blanketed the wrong way. My own mare once waited two hours to get back at me and bite my butt after I disciplined her for biting earlier. No warning, just that one targeted bite.

Now that she’s pretty much stopped biting, she has learned to hit me across the eyes with one well timed tail swish. Mares are serious about trying to train their humans.

Geldings and colts can be constantly testing each other out, and be like two 5 year old boys play wrestling in the living room and then knocking over a lamp.

Mares bite when they are mad at you or think another horse needs discipline, and they will launch on annoying colts. They don’t seem to play nip at all.

Anyhow, I think the answer to both scenarios is be the boss mare yourself but stay safe doing it.

[chestnutmarebeware]

@Scribbler

My own mare once waited two hours to get back at me and bite my butt after I disciplined her for biting earlier. No warning, just that one targeted bite.

This cracked me up, because I had something similar happen to me. The BO at the time had a nice QH mare that she used for lower-level lessons, but the mare had started stopping at the in-gate for the kiddies and refusing to move. I got on her with a short bat and after about 10 minutes had “persuaded” her that stopping at the gate was no longer an option.

Brought her to the center of the indoor, dismounted, ran up the stirrups, etc. and then, because I’d heard a bit of clicking, picked up a foot to make sure there wasn’t a stone lodged in her shoe. Yep, one good bite, right on my butt. That mare knew exactly what she was doing, and why. :lol:

[JB]

@kfrilly

I’ve got a rope halter/lead set-up with no clips or metal on them, so thankfully no worrying about catching him with those.

If that setup has a low-hanging rope knot attaching the lead to the halter, that can end up swing up into the eye area, so that’s just something to be careful of if yours is set up that way.

He’s totally the type of horse where a stern voice alone won’t bother him, that grin and smirk is exactly his reaction, hahaha.

:lol: :lol: Oh yes, I have one of those! Grins AND smirks! He’s also the one who will face-fight with his “uncle” on a near-daily basis because it’s so entertaining. Uncle plays right back for a while, always - I mean always - wins, yet Mr Smirk comes back every day for “more please!” :lol: :rolleyes:

I’ve been so cautious with not wanting to create a new issue in trying to solve this one, but I’m admittedly also a bit of a softy sometimes. Guess I’m gonna have to work on upping my boss mare attitude.

Yep, I get it. I had my WB for long enough that I got used to the amount of effort that went into enticing him to do a lot of things, that when I got my OTTB mare, it took me a while to figure out just how little I needed to do to get a reaction out of her. Poor thing, she nearly landed in the next county when my first reaction to something was the same level of intensity as for the WB :eek:

But the nice thing is that horses really are very forgiving. She gave me a little side eye when I want to apologize, but she certainly wasn’t distrusting. Problems are created when you are not consistent with the correction, or keep “correcting” at a level that is at Play status for them, and even when the level of correction is way, way overkill for the behavior on a regular basis. I’d never start “chasing” a horse backwards for a little pawing, for example. But mouths and feet directed at me are serious serious business, they are the tools they use to push subordinate horses around, and they know the difference between playing face fights, and a more dominant horse coming at them with ears back and teeth bared.
So for me, teeth and feet coming my way is a no holds barred situation (environment taken into account), and if it was overkill for that horse (because you had to send a tracking team to find them :lol:) then you can be guaranteed they won’t do THAT again and once you retrieve them, while they may be a little wary, they will forgive and forget as long as you go back to being normal.

[candyappy]

John Lyons has a method similar to @JB. Maybe you can find it if you search the internet.
It works rather quickly.

When you rub his mouth you are actually encouraging this behavior. He probably really enjoys it and sees it as playing.

When I was 14 my yearling gelding was mouthy and never really bit either. Until the day he tried to take a chunk out of my shoulder… His biting ended that very day

Good luck.

[JB]

@candyappy

John Lyons has a method similar to @JB.

He’s exactly where I learned this many years ago :yes:

[candyappy]

@JB

He’s exactly where I learned this many years ago :yes:

I learned a lot by reading his training magazine years ago. His trailer loading is another gem!

[buck22]

I was going to chime in with the John Lyons method, but I see its already got a fan club!

OP, it works. Swift and aggressive response from you (JL would call and “attack”) - when he thinks about biting. Act aggressively anywhere but his upper neck and head (I make a ruckus with available objects so dramatically the horse backs up in terror, I personally don’t strike the horse, but biting is a huge act of aggression, striking back is understandable in that instant). Then followed up quickly with a rub on the forehead to reassure friendship.

John Lyons used to say, as he was rubbing the horse, “You see, I’m a predator, and you’re prey. I could easily kill you, but I won’t” – he wasn’t apologizing to the horse, but reaffirming the relationship.

[buck22]

@candyappy

I learned a lot by reading his training magazine years ago. His trailer loading is another gem!

His trailer loading is the bees knees!

[sascha]

@kfrilly

I’ve been so cautious with not wanting to create a new issue in trying to solve this one, but I’m admittedly also a bit of a softy sometimes. Guess I’m gonna have to work on upping my boss mare attitude.

Thanks again!

Up your attitude by reducing your tolerance to ZERO. And sticking by it every damn time. You cannot afford to let your standards slip even one time. Consistency is key. Absolute consistency will eventually teach him that he has some damn manners and he needs to mind them all the time when in the presence of humans. One of my favourite tools besides a chain shank and my rather large attitude is an aluminum sweat scraper. They make one hell of a noise and a nasty sting when delivered with intent to the shoulder area.

Most of all though, please stop worrying about creating a new issue. You already have a very serious issue. It might not seem like it now, but it absolutely is and it can develop to dangerous level in a hurry if you don’t shut it down asap.