Oh, I agree. And we all know that competitor with the tricked out pinstriped rig in their barn colors and all the matchy matchy tack who “can’t afford” lessons or clinics.
But that doesn’t change the fact the offering easy intro levels for novices or nervous ammys is a good thing to do.
You’re talking about the AECs here. The horse is not going BN for the first time. Or the second. Or the third. This is AT MINIMUM his fourth outing.
Qualifications:
Beginner Novice Horse Championship
Horse may not have completed competitions at Training or higher levels .
Rider may have completed any level.
Qualifying Results
Further to the above QR, horse and rider must have completed a total of three USEA recognized horse trials during the qualifying period. The placing requirements as noted above are included in the total of three competitions. Once the placing QRs have been met, the additional H.T.s required may be at the Novice level.
If you’re referring to my last post, I was talking about BN as a level, and I noted I was referring to BNs in my area.
I wasn’t referring to the AEC at all in that post, though I did mention up thread my thoughts about the AEC and it being a championship course.
First “course creep” CAUSES all these lower and lower levels. They are not unrelated. And course creep happens because of “perennial BN” riders and others(!) wanting XC to play a role in final placings. But in my opinion the vast majority of those riders, as well and the vast majority of lower level eventers in general, are under the mistake belief that HEIGHT = DIFFICULTY. It does not. At the lower levels it often isn’t even correlated. Wofford tells a story of how I think it was Jack Le Goff claiming that he could design a 2’6" course that would be appropriate for a tough international advance division.
What we’ve lost in the combination of creep and “dumbed downed” divisions is there are no more courses about 2’6"-3’ that are just basic inviting jumps–logs, roll tops, telephone poles–with minimal terrain issues. These are the courses we should be taking our green horses too and they don’t exist anymore. They are also the courses green riders should be riding. They are easy peasy and a rider doesn’t need to be afraid of a jump that is screaming out to their horse “come jump me!”
There is something called the “Brown Jump Theory” of training horses to run XC that I subscribe to. Horses build confidence and learn that there are banks, ditches and water and then everything else is a brown jump–regardless of what color, shape, or design it is. But you actually have to start by jumping brown/basic jumps. Once the brown jump ideology is installed in a young horse they stop looking at the silly details, like flowers or colors or weird shapes. But you actually have to jump a fences big enough to make some sort of effort over because that confidence is built with the horse moving out a good canter and even a gallop while in front of your leg–which can sometimes be hard to accomplish when jumping a 2’ fence on a 17 hand horse.
The other thing that I think is very important to point out is that most lower level riders have limited local resources to XC schooling. The courses at recognized horse trials ARE very important schooling and learning opportunities for both riders and horses–it’s not just about the show environment You can’t just say “oh, you just need to school more at home” and think that solves a problem.
I truly believe that if you want to create an upper level XC horse the base for that happens at the lower levels–and we aren’t providing the best courses to do that. If I were the Princess of Power of Eventing there would be two divisions with the same height around 2’7"-2’9". Keep your modern technical BN and make Starter the same height, but with no technically, no terrain and nothing but the most basic brown jumps. We’d be creating future world beaters. I wonder from our overseas friends if there isn’t still enough fox hunting in the UK to provide young horses this experience and is it being taken advantage of?
It seems posters here think the intro is still too hard.
Eventing is a different breed of discipline. There is a huge safety factor and it includes fences that don’t fall down.
I’m not saying there isn’t a place for these things, there certainly is. I just don’t personally think recognized events are the place for it.
Its an excuse for people to be able to event before they are really ready to event. Again my opinion only. Feel free to disagree 
I* can’t imagine future world beaters being developed from jumping simple fences on flat terrain.
Arena eventing is really popular in the UK with young horses and riders. Those are the type of events that should have basic and more technical course options.
I must be reading a different thread than you are.
If it is about safety shouldn’t we be encouraging riders to get out over terrain asap, even if it is at a trot over natural logs?
It’s obvious we aren’t going to agree. I just think there is a lot of $$$ in it for the USEA if they want to bring in the pony riders and nervous ammys. The biggest divisions at our local schooling HTs are intro/starter. To ignore a majority of riders, particularly outside of the east coast, seems like a bad business plan.
It’s all about the order you present things. How many children would think they are bad at math if we started with algebra before we covered arithmetic? I’m all for technical courses. For me historically I do well on them and win better ribbons the more technical the course. I strongly suspect my horses do well on technical courses because I insist they rock their arithmetic classes and when they get to algebra and trig and it never even occurred to them it was difficult.
So how do you manage warm up areas with riders who aren’t cantering and are nervous and scared? Warm up rings are terrifying for confident capable riders as it is.
There is more to it than the course also. The other thing is these riders often fall off, go off course, take a long time to get around the course, etc. I’m not saying this in a bad way at all, it’s just facts.
I’m saying after the experience of running 3 Short Course Events a year for years to this exact target group of riders. Having done that and learned what I have learned, I strongly believe Intro is fine and that anything smaller or easier doesn’t belong at a recognized event.
Some how they manage it every other show in the world with a group of riders that are probably even less capable if you are to believe what most people say about hunter riders.
I spend most of my volunteer time at show jumping warm up. I find the intro level riders to be the easiest to deal with, strangely enough. None of them think they own the world and that they have priority over every other person out there warming up.
I would love to do a long format but the closest venue that offers it is Rebecca Farm.
I guess I do not get what is so wrong about someone safely doing a level that the fences allow for it, at the trot.
For a group of people that pride themselves on being so open and inviting - comments like these just reek of elitism to me.
My first event was at Elementary - I had no idea what I was doing and my mare was scared of EVERYTHING.
This weekend a friend was able to catch up with a horse that was sold - he went from one fox hunting home to another and a girl who just started learning to jump rides him. He went Training level with me. He wen elementary with this girl in June and Intro (2’3") this last weekend. She had a blast and to say she shouldn’t be showing and/or shouldn’t be showing recognized to me just reeks of eliteism.
Personally, I don’t care if someone wants to spend $250 (or whatever it is now) to bounce around over logs at a recognized show - have at it. And you know what? that person is likely going to be there all day gawking at the big jumps and the fancier horses and maybe dipping a toe in at intro or elementary will create an addict and isn’t that what we all want?
Personally, I went all the way to Training at unrecognized shows because I CAN in my area and it’s half the price over the same course the recognized divisions are running over. I will cheer on every tiny tot or nervous adult ammy going around elementary.
If Devon can host a leadline class that has a points requirement to enter, then eventing can host intro/elementary if they want.
One reason I hesitate to do a Starter course is the fear that my horse won’t see the tiny jumps!
I agree. I also think the ground pole hunter classes are ridiculous. I do wish there were O/F classes at 18" and 2’ for green horses and older horses. Generally they only exist for beginning riders in my area. I was glad to qualify as a beginner when my first horse was starting out so we could do those low classes for a few years.
Which reminds me, I wish there were Maiden or Limit divisions for never winners or never-won-6-firsts. (Because a Novice Novice for non winners of 3 would be too confusing!) I’ve never placed first and it would be nice to compete with others who haven’t won their last 10 events.
Yes, but some of us (or at least me) think lead line classes at Devon are ridiculous and don’t want eventing to turn into that.
Why not have these options?
What is the point of a lead line class? It’s essentially a fashion show to show off cute kids and ponies. It’s not about riding competency.
There was a picture/article somewhere (COTH?) recently about an adorable child that fell asleep during the lead line class. Yes, the kid and pony were super cute. But what’s the point of a “competition” in what is supposedly a sport if the “competitor” can literally fall asleep during the class?
What’s the point of anything? What’s the point of peewee leagues - I watched my 5 year old nephew and niece play soccer and the kids are wandering all over the place and they don’t even play for points so it isn’t even a competition.
What I do see at peewee soccer, at big horse shows with these little classes are kids hanging out with their older siblings, getting into the sport (the 12 year old niece also plays soccer and all the matches are in the same day). I see parents with a way to focus the non-competitive kids and give them something to do, even if it is is brush the same spot on their pony so the parents can help the older kids.
I see students with a way to enjoy going to a show with their trainer who is taking 5 other, higher level students to that show but either not going to another one or would be cost prohibitive for the student to go with just the trainer. I see students/friends having fun and supporting each other. The ones at the higher level encouraging their lower level friends and the lower level friends supporting their higher level friends and often thinking of ways to get there themselves.
I see people having fun and enjoying a day out with the horses where they may otherwise be stuck at the barn.
Is Devon somehow less prestigious because some kid fell asleep in leadline or was that just a fun interlude for spectators? Not everything is about “being the best” or getting that blue ribbon or qualifying for the next level - some people just like to have fun in a way that they feel safe.
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