On one of the equine colour facebook groups, someone was trying to figure out a roan tobiano foal’s parentage, when the supposed sire had no obvious tobiano or roan and being registered AQHA could not have tobiano, and the mare (who is roan tobiano) could only contribute one or the other. Methinks the “breeder” fudged those APHA papers.
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No, I’m remembering a different one. She had a farm in a very rural area and had some pretty kooky thoughts on a lot of things. She left shortly after her “mysterious god” explanation was annihilated.
So definitely not the one I was thinking of at all! LOL The one I was thinking of was a pretty sane person who ran into problems.
I wonder if the one you’re thinking of still exists?
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I’m pretty sure she left.
I’m also not 100% sure if it was this forum or that ancient one that was attached to Fugly Horse of the Day. Yea, dating myself there.
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I meant the discussion that it was posted on, not so much the poster. Even the owner of the amazing Arabian Jumper left (talking of crazy posters).
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I sometimes wonder about what happened to the very strange ones who posted here. Not the obviously horrible mean ones, or the unqualified scam “trainers”, just the very weird ones.
The OP of “No lunging at Devon” was one of those…
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Whether or not they would still get those scores I think this misses the point of the argument people like me are making with respect to the impact of gaits on scoring.
Assume they would still get 75%, but to WIN today they need to aim for 78+%. Sit, lift, cadence, fluidity, brilliance all add those points yes, and that is not an issue on its own. I think the argument that people are making in favor of the current state of competition dressage is that we have achieved those higher highs, and perhaps higher means, through breeding without any change in the quality of the training - but in our present moment, we are also grappling with high profile examples of cruelty at the top. So how do we reconcile that? Has the emphasis on gaits contributed?
Others may have different opinions, but here is mine. Suppose we can get to 75% with correct work and “just” need to add sit, lift, cadence, brilliance to get to winning scores from there, we still have to do the work to build that “more” on what we have. More push, more power, more reach. As in all training, this means pushing the horse to and past the edge of his comfort zone and possibly past his natural talent. That is when we get resistance that we have to handle with training. How you train is a function of your philosophy, education, personal preference, skill, etc.
If “brilliance” is over-rewarded in scoring without accounting for markers that force or adversarial methods were used to create the brilliance, then competitive people will optimize for brilliance by whatever means. That is where the decision point comes for people who care more about winning than humane training. See e.g. Rollkur, which IIRC people argued was a justifiable technique because these big strong modern warmbloods were just so hot and uncontrollable without it. Philosophically, the old guard, to my knowledge, rejects that outright. You sacrifice brilliance instead. Competitive sport chose to accept it as the cost of brilliance.
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Yes. It’s ADDED TO those perfect circles. The brilliance OF THE GSITS differentiates one perfect circle from another
Why do you ALWAYS twist what I say into meaning what YOU want it to say, or twist it to make me sound like a stupid person??
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Grey is controlled by a gene. It is not a “disease”.
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I don’t know. I was told here on CoH that the dorsal stripe on my bay horse but no other buckskin or primitive markings was because of him having only one of the genes not both n
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I am sorry if and apologize you took my post that way. I replied to what was posted.
Perhaps you might think that writing with clarity enough for the local know-nothing could understand would be helpful. This is what I tell my students…when they write their term papers, write it in language clear enough so that the local simpleton can understand.
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There’s a case being discussed in a Morgan group right now of a bay stallion from chestnut parents. This was before color DNA testing. A quick look at the pedigree explained it all. The dam, registered as a flaxen chestnut, was actually a bay silver dapple. So the bay stallion got her bay gene but not her silver gene. Silver is really weird…
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And you insult me again.
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Omg. FHOTD. That takes me BACK!!
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This is as clear as mud.
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Roan linkage breaks are not unheard of. I’m not sure if that would be a possibility here?Didn’t see the post though, so could also be an ‘oops’ mating.
It is. The grey gene causes a malfunction in pigment producing cells that causes them to overproduce pigment then ‘burn out’. Lots of diseases are caused by faulty genes.
You were told wrong then, bay plus nd1 will cause a dorsal on a bay horse, and is completely unrelated to the cream gene which on a bay base would result in a buckskin.
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From a long time observer, I have seen better and worse in regards to the type of horse and training being rewarded. Could barely watch many during the “Anky years”
I have no problem with rewarding “brilliance”. My issue is when it causes fundamental training flaws to be overlooked. It is not a breeding class designed to reward the most innately gifted horse. It should be a test of the training and gymnasticizing, with brilliance being the icing on top.
There are probably a number of issues that can allow a horse with basic training flaws to score higher than a better-trained but less brilliant horse. I suspect that judges are loathe to lower scores considerably in some movements of a big moving horse. Tension and behind the vertical does not lower the score sufficiently to keep those combinations out of high placings.
I wish the judges were instructed to start with harmony and relaxation in their evaluations and to deduct serious points in every movement it is not shown. They can raise the bar and encourage harmonious rides that are also brilliant!
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That is the way it used to be (circa 2018-ish) when “Gaits” was one of 5 attributes judged in the Collective Marks in the FEI tests.
This is the current version in FEI tests
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I think many of the issues we are seeing can be attributed to the pressure of time to produce these horses. In general, we are talking about the top professionals in the sport competing at GP. The general expectation is to produce a proficient GP horse by 8. To add to that, a lot of spectators are expecting greater proficiency from these horses without realizing they are only 8 years old.
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Just to make sure I’m interpreting the cuts of the test correctly, 2018 and earlier, the collective marks were 70 points; now they are just 20? So then submission, relaxation, aids, etc have a lot less weight then before? The over all impression and correctness of training and riding has less weight now?
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