Ovary Sparing Spay--OSS

keysfins · August 12, 2020, 7:08am

Interested to know if anyone has opted for an OSS for their female dog? This is a newer procedure that retains one or both of the ovaries, removing the uterus/cervix/Fallopian tubes.

I have a breed (Rottweiler) that has a high risk of cancer, both hemangiosarcoma and osteosarcoma, as well as lymphoma. I have lost dogs to each of these cancers.

I currently have a female that is 5.5 years old. Previous females were spayed traditionally at 5-12 months of age. The one that was spayed at five months was a textbook picture of what can go wrong as a result of juvenile spaying. Her growth plates of her long bones never received the hormonal signals needed to close. Her conformation was narrow, and very tall (outside the breed standard for a female), and she had very straight angles in her hind assembly. She had cruciate ruptures on each stifle, some four years apart. She was not exactly a picture of orthopedic health.

I have a very fine female who has finished her show career, and now I am considering the OSS. Many of her relatives have reached 12-15 years, which is considered exceptional longevity in the breed. Her breeder, with whom I stay in touch, typically spays her females at five or six years, whether or not they have been bred and produced a litter.

I have done my research on the benefits (and risks) of OSS, and would love to hear from anyone who chose it for their dog. I am located in Colorado (Denver area), and will be looking for vets who have experience performing the procedure.

TIA!

Simkie · August 27, 2020, 10:45pm

I have an intact bitch and I am also considering this procedure for her, so am curious to see what response you get with this thread

Have you contacted CSU? If anyone in Colorado does it, I’d think they would. They might also have some leads on closer to Denver clinics that have experience.

keysfins · August 27, 2020, 10:45pm

[QUOTE=Simkie;8711828]
I have an intact bitch and I am also considering this procedure for her, so am curious to see what response you get with this thread

Have you contacted CSU? If anyone in Colorado does it, I’d think they would. They might also have some leads on closer to Denver clinics that have experience.[/QUOTE]

There is a group on FB, which I follow, that lists vets that offer it. I think I have found a vet within reasonable distance, and would like to have a consult.

I did think of CSU as well, since I used the Equine Repro services when I was breeding my mare. Nothing on the CSU clinic site indicated they offer alternatives to traditional spay/neuter. But I can easily give a call.

The list of vets who perform alternative spay/neuter on the Parsemus Foundation website lists a very few (3 or 4 vets?), and I plan on contacting them as well. Also did a search on Canine Theriogenologists that are local to me, and maybe that will give me a lead.

I will definitely post if I find someone, hopefully someone who has performed the surgery regularly!

csaper58 · August 27, 2020, 10:45pm

I could not find a vet who would do the OSS surgery here, so I adopted a male dog instead.(Aussie)

I was able to leave him intact long enough that his growth plates closed.

People are so used to seeing the Aussies with the loooong legs they always ask why he is so small. He is the normal size Aussie I grew up seeing.

I hope you can find a vet to do the OSS. I wish rescues would do it instead of the pediatric spay.

keysfins · August 27, 2020, 10:46pm

[QUOTE=csaper58;8711948]
I could not find a vet who would do the OSS surgery here, so I adopted a male dog instead.(Aussie)

I was able to leave him intact long enough that his growth plates closed.

People are so used to seeing the Aussies with the loooong legs they always ask why he is so small. He is the normal size Aussie I grew up seeing.

I hope you can find a vet to do the OSS. I wish rescues would do it instead of the pediatric spay.[/QUOTE]

I get it. My “tall” girl did not look like a typical Rottie. Great dog, everyone loved her, but she suffered injuries I might have been able to prevent if I had known to wait.

My hope is that OSS will become more available, as well as vasectomy for males, when the important role of hormones in youngsters is publicized more. Currently, I think most vets emphasize routine spay/neuter at a young age for prevention of accidental litters, which is understandable. But that does not fit all scenarios, especially with responsible owners who may be more informed about the alternatives.

Megaladon · August 27, 2020, 10:46pm

I have no experience with OSS. However, I would do a complete spay. My clinic altered a dog that had a vasectomy done years ago and was now having intense pain in his prostate/scrotum/testicle area. Pain meds weren’t working, so the next step was removing the testicles. They ended up being the most ugly, gross testicles I’ve ever seen pulled out of a dog. They were grey, fat and had a wierd squiggly, ropey looking thing attached to each one (think of the look of intestines but much smaller). Also, the vet struggled to get them out of the scrotum. The testicles are being sent for biopsy, because they ain’t right! So, for me personally, I would get the full spay/neuter for all my pets.

Marshfield · August 27, 2020, 10:46pm

I haven’t done it yet, but that is what I have planned for one of my retired from breeding girls who is still competing in agility. I’m past the point of altering her mammary cancer risk and I’m not going to compromise her knees by removing her ovaries

csaper58 · August 27, 2020, 10:47pm

[QUOTE=Megaladon;8712083]
I have no experience with OSS. However, I would do a complete spay. My clinic altered a dog that had a vasectomy done years ago and was now having intense pain in his prostate/scrotum/testicle area. Pain meds weren’t working, so the next step was removing the testicles. They ended up being the most ugly, gross testicles I’ve ever seen pulled out of a dog. They were grey, fat and had a wierd squiggly, ropey looking thing attached to each one (think of the look of intestines but much smaller). Also, the vet struggled to get them out of the scrotum. The testicles are being sent for biopsy, because they ain’t right! So, for me personally, I would get the full spay/neuter for all my pets.[/QUOTE]

Hmmm… So all dogs most be spayed or neutered because you saw one dog with an as yet undiagnosed condition?

IMHO each animal is an individual, and should be treated as such.

animaldoc · August 27, 2020, 10:48pm

What are the benefits to leaving the ovaries in an older female? She would still be at risk for stump pyometra, ovarian neoplasia and mammary carcinomas (and those risks are greatly reduced by just doing a more traditional OHE).

The only recognized benefit to removing only the uterus in dogs is the prevention of pregnancy, so if that’s your main goal, why not just do a tubal ligation?

Most vets I know are recommending later spay/neuter for the potential health benefits (with responsible owners). The real question gets to be when- males around/after one depending on size, females before/after the first heat. The exact timing to get most of the benefit with less of the risk is still to be determined.

None of the boarded surgeons/theriogenologists I have consulted recently are recommending hysterectomy in dogs.

Hulk · August 27, 2020, 10:48pm

[QUOTE=csaper58;8712563]
Hmmm… So all dogs most be spayed or neutered because you saw one dog with an as yet undiagnosed condition?

IMHO each animal is an individual, and should be treated as such.[/QUOTE]

Wow how did you get that conclusion from this post. By the way after working for a vet for 20 years of 5 days a week surgical assistant, I can say some of the absolute worse cases I seen that came in as medical surgery vs routine surgery were cases that things like not complete spays or neuters were done.

And yes all are very individual. Like the dog with the tumor testicle the size of my head. The cat with 1/2 a uterus that became infected, and still had heats and UTIs that all went away post 2nd surgery. The fake testicle implants that became infected. The dog that died from testicle cancer.

Yes they are all individuals, but after the stuff I have seen I agree with this poster and all mine that I own personally will get the full spay neuter.

Any one else can do whatever floats their boat with their own individuals.

jherold · August 27, 2020, 10:49pm

I guess the advantage of removing the uterus v/s just a tubal would be the elimiation of spotting during heats. For large dogs, it can be quite a mess as they are not always compliant with using pads… Plus one of mine would get crabby with the other dogs around her heat cycle.

Simkie · August 27, 2020, 10:49pm

[QUOTE=jherold;8713051]
I guess the advantage of removing the uterus v/s just a tubal would be the elimiation of spotting during heats. For large dogs, it can be quite a mess as they are not always compliant with using pads… Plus one of mine would get crabby with the other dogs around her heat cycle.[/QUOTE]

Nope. Remove the uterus, you remove the risk of a pyometra. With a tubal, you remove the risk of pregnancy, but don’t touch that pyo problem.

The risk of pyo is honestly the only reason I’m even considering spaying my bitch. The heat cycles and keeping her from being bred just aren’t that big of a deal. An emergency pyo spay sure isn’t fun, though.

animaldoc, a properly done ovary spaying spay should have no risk of stump pyo, from what I understand? It’s that “properly done” part that’s the rub…hence the query for a vet with lots of experience, I imagine!

keysfins · August 27, 2020, 10:50pm

[QUOTE=animaldoc;8712847]
What are the benefits to leaving the ovaries in an older female? She would still be at risk for stump pyometra, ovarian neoplasia and mammary carcinomas (and those risks are greatly reduced by just doing a more traditional OHE).

The only recognized benefit to removing only the uterus in dogs is the prevention of pregnancy, so if that’s your main goal, why not just do a tubal ligation?

Most vets I know are recommending later spay/neuter for the potential health benefits (with responsible owners). The real question gets to be when- males around/after one depending on size, females before/after the first heat. The exact timing to get most of the benefit with less of the risk is still to be determined.

None of the boarded surgeons/theriogenologists I have consulted recently are recommending hysterectomy in dogs.[/QUOTE]

Fair questions, for sure. As described in my first post, an Ovary Sparing Spay removes the uterus, cervix and Fallopian tubes, not “only” the uterus.

If done correctly, removing the entire uterus and cervix, there is no “stump” to develop stump pyo. (I also had a dog develop an open pyometra after her very first season, which required an immediate, traditional OHE. No argument about that being necessary; I informed the breeder, who had placed her with me as a show and potential breeding home, and she agreed.)

Main benefit that is important to me is reaching exceptional longevity, age 13 and over, in Rottweilers. Dr. Waters, supported by the the Gerald P. Murphy Cancer Foundation, developed the “Old Grey Muzzle” study, looking at Rotts (both male and female) that reach such ages. Not just reaching “old age” for the breed, but remaining healthy into old age. There is a strong association, for females, with retaining the ovaries and reaching “old age”. The “why” is not yet determined.

http://www.gpmcf.org/hro2015.html

I had the heartbreak of losing one female before she reached even 8 years. This was the one who was spayed (traditional OHE) at five months, and who also had the orthopedic issues.

I have kept my current female intact, as I was not sure if I might want a litter from her. She is actually in season right now, and I do not plan to breed her. With new (and yes, possibly controversial) information, I am willing to let this one keep her ovaries with the hope that she will reach “old age”. Following conventional wisdom/practices with my previous females did not result in any living longer than 10.5 years.

There are risks, as you point out. But ovaries are endocrine organs, and not just organs of reproduction. Letting them remain with an OSS may offer some benefit to attain old age, while removing the possibility of reproduction. I suppose I could also simply leave her intact, as I don’t really have any issue with her seasons, and she will not be exposed to any intact males during them.

My purpose in posting is to ask if others have considered OSS, have opted for an OSS for their female dog, and what they have experienced. And also, to raise the topic of OSS as an alternative to the traditional OHE spay.

Houndhill · August 27, 2020, 10:50pm

I hear you!

Have a 4 year old intact IW that I bred, trying to figure the risks/ advantages of an ovary-sparing spay vs leaving intact. Managing an intact bitch here is not a problem.

I would not consider removing an IW’s ovaries; IWs are at great risk of many types of cancer, though not mammary cancer in this line for many generations of intact bitches. I know my pedigrees very well, and would be loathe to do anything that might increase the risk of osteosarcoma or lymphoma, two types of cancer I know are in the breed, and in this line. I know them not only in the pedigree, but all sibs of those hounds in the pedigree. (I’ve had IWs for 46 years so know it pretty well).

I lost one bitch from osteosarcoma last summer, and one this fall from lymphoma- both intact, but if they had been spayed, who knows, they might have developed cancer sooner, and I would have felt terrible knowing I might have done something that contributed to their risk factors.

The risk of pyometra is much smaller in this line, and ovarian neoplasia risk is extremely small- im fact I’ve never heard of it in this line, ever.

IWs in this line are generally going to die of cancer, usually osteosarcoma or lymphoma or hemangiosarcoma- all types of cancer that have been shown by studies in Rotties, Goldens, Viszlas, and German Shepherds to be at increased risk in spayed/castrated dogs, or those neutered earlier vs later in life.

If they escape cancer, they will usually die of “old age” or going “down in the rear” in this particular line of IWs.

I would not want to do anything that might increase their chances of the types of cancer they are prone to. I’ve had one pyometra in 46 years and have heard of several more in this breed- all survived the surgery and did well. My bitch was caught very early and did great.

It pays to know your breed and your line- then you can make the best decisions for your particular animals.

If someone has chihuahuas or a small mix from a shelter where they can’t provide proper confinement/supervision for an intact animal- obviously that is a very different situation.

It is a bit inconvenient to have an intact bitch that you do performance events with- I’ve had to withdraw from one Obedience Trial but got my entry fee refunded, and went to a Tracking Seminar and just had to run the last track of the day.

Megaladon · August 27, 2020, 10:50pm

[QUOTE=csaper58;8712563]
Hmmm… So all dogs most be spayed or neutered because you saw one dog with an as yet undiagnosed condition?

IMHO each animal is an individual, and should be treated as such.[/QUOTE]

Wow! You’re extremely combative.

Simkie · August 27, 2020, 10:50pm

[QUOTE=Megaladon;8713193]
Wow! You’re extremely combative.[/QUOTE]

Are you kidding?

I’m with csaper…it’s kind of ridiculous to suggest that all dogs everywhere be spayed/neutered early because one dog once had a vasectomy and developed some weird problem with his nuts.

keysfins · August 27, 2020, 10:50pm

[QUOTE=Houndhill;8713184]
I hear you!