Just wanted to say, I truly hope everything works out for you.
[QUOTE=Quinn;8173416]
Just wanted to say, I truly hope everything works out for you.[/QUOTE]
You have my vote too.
I think one reason posters are commenting about having 3 sides to every story is because there have been at least TWO epic COTH trainwrecks where the OP posts a sad sack story and after a few days it comes to light that the OP is a complete liar/nutcase. One about a free pony, one about strangles. Although highly entertaining once the truth was told, it does make the board a little more cautious.
Me? I am throwing caution to the wind and hope the OP gets money back. Even with some details in dispute, the fact that the agent did not return the OPs calls is wrong.
From this thread I learned a great deal about contracts and best practices for sales. Wonderful info here.
[QUOTE=enjoytheride;8173250]
You might be very surprised that most of the horses I looked at were not currebt on vaccines, coggins, or even farrier care. Some sellers would not think of spending money on a horse they were going to sell, or might request a higher price to include those extras.[/QUOTE]
There are a lot of horse owners who don’t vaccinate or do coggins. If the horse doesn’t compete or come into contact with unknown horses, they just don’t see the need. Now farrier care is another matter.
I personally don’t do coggins unless I am selling a horse. No need otherwise.
[QUOTE=Angela Freda;8173327]
Speaking of assumptions, You’re assuming it wasn’t discussed in person, pre-deposit.[/QUOTE]
I have also said in a comment or two that we are only hearing a one sided “version” of what took place. So we have to make certain “assumptions” right or wrong. As a buyer and a seller I try to be fair and balanced. IME as a seller I have found a lot of buyers to be completely unreasonable, unrealistic and self-serving. Almost exclusively with horses under $5-10,000 when dealing with “non-pros”.
I have also said several times what “wasn’t discussed in person, pre-deposit” and not written, addressed in a Conditions of Purchase Contract is moot when it comes to legal action. Unless there is an unbiased “witness” to the conversation. As I have said several times, “he said, she said” is a real PITA to prove one way or another.
[QUOTE=roseymare;8173311]
Private sales are not typically exempt from requiring Coggins in states that require them for sales.[/QUOTE]
I think if you did some research you will find most states do not require a horse to have a current Coggins to be sold. It is not required in a lot of states for horses traveling “in-state”.
In Pa it is not in either case. I would not buy a horse without one. If it has lapsed I would require in my purchase contract that the horse has to be tested and the “paper” be in hand before payment and title passes. I can get a “rush” Coggins done in 2 days for an extra fee.
[QUOTE=Justa Bob;8173669]
You have my vote too.
I think one reason posters are commenting about having 3 sides to every story is because there have been at least TWO epic COTH trainwrecks where the OP posts a sad sack story and after a few days it comes to light that the OP is a complete liar/nutcase. One about a free pony, one about strangles. Although highly entertaining once the truth was told, it does make the board a little more cautious.
Me? I am throwing caution to the wind and hope the OP gets money back. Even with some details in dispute, the fact that the agent did not return the OPs calls is wrong.
From this thread I learned a great deal about contracts and best practices for sales. Wonderful info here.[/QUOTE]
Thank you both very much. This has unfortunately taught me a lot (for both seller and buyer sides of a contract).
Please do let us know the eventual outcome.
But back to the contract. If she is in one of the states that require seller to provide Coggins wouldn’t a simple bill of sale be sufficient. And there are at least 20 states that require Coggins for horses to be sold.
[QUOTE=roseymare;8174927]
But back to the contract. If she is in one of the states that require seller to provide Coggins wouldn’t a simple bill of sale be sufficient. And there are at least 20 states that require Coggins for horses to be sold.[/QUOTE]
“And there are at least 20 states that require Coggins for horses to be sold”
13 states according to this website. http://www.horsetradertricks.com/coggins--scary-facts.html
Florida
Georgia
Illinois
Maryland
Massachusetts
Michigan
Mississippi
New Jersey
New York
North Carolina
Ohio
Texas
Vermont
These states require a current Coggins for any horse shipped on public roads.
Florida
Louisiana
Mississippi
New York
Oklahoma
Texas
Edit to clarify; As I said “according to this website”. Do not rely on its accuracy. States update their rules and regs all the time. Check the state your’re doing business in and or traveling in or through.
OK you win the internet are you happy. It is apparently less than 20. But my question remains. If you are in one of these states, why would you need it in a contract that a Coggins or HC Needs to be done as it is a a requirement by law for the sale.
I am in Illinois and I pull a Coggins every year, as part of my boarding agreement. Every horse in the barn has a current Coggins. Health certificates are only good for a short time, so that would be a given you would need a vet for that for a sale.
Or transport or in some states to even have a horse.
[QUOTE=roseymare;8175057]
OK you win the internet are you happy. It is apparently less than 20. But my question remains. If you are in one of these states, why would you need it in a contract that a Coggins or HC Needs to be done as it is a a requirement by law for the sale.[/QUOTE]
I did, wow, didn’t know it was competition. What did I win?
I don’t post to boast and certainly don’t post to “one up” someone. I make my living with horses and the business of. I take the time to pass on what I have leaned and experienced so others may avoid buying “worthless T-shirts”. My comments, advice, anecdotes are based on many years of “real life adventures” in the world of horses and horse “trading”. I don’t hide behind a screen name.
By and large only work from facts. Not made up numbers and or give out advice that I head from a friend of a friend. If I am not sure of something I say so and or use IMO. A number of people in this tread have “thrown out” “most” or like you “more than” X states require a Coggins to sell a horse.
Well unlike others I decided to do some fact checking out of curiosity just how many states required a current Coggins. I knew that Maryland did, my birth state, NY, NJ and FL did because I have done horse business in those states. So now I and others know exactly what states require a Coggins as part of the transaction and they should require and write this into their Purchase Agreement. Both buyers and sellers.
I have found that a lot of people on the COTH forum don’t seem to care much about “facts” this thread is a perfect example. But there are some that do.
It would have been nice to get a “thanks” for taking the time to give “real” numbers you know facts, not a guess, instead of a snarky reply.
I have given the OP and others some very valuable information, real, factual information, based on years of horse trading. Information and advice I have been well paid for over the years.
It’s funny I rarely if ever have seen a tread that asks questions on what a person should do and or what sort of paper work they should have, give, request BEFORE buying or selling a horse.
I won’t bother to answer your question. Do the research yourself.
You seemed to be intent on proving me wrong. I did the research too and twenty states require either a Coggins every year, a Coggins for a sale or Coggins for travel on their highways. I went to each individual states statutes. Your list is 19 and if you add in Arkansas where by law every horse needs a Coggins yearly it is twenty states that require a Coggins for some form of a sale whether it be to sell the horse, to move the horse or to have the horse. I was not throwing out advice without facts.
Maybe someone else will answer the contract question since you refuse to. I feel that if it is required by law in a state then a bill of sale does not need to spell it out. Obviously it would be better if it did for all parties but I don’t think if it is not the owner of horse at the time of sale is somehow absolved from providing a Coggins in those states.
There are some additional states, like Colorado and Wyoming, where the buyer will need to have a brand inspection done, which requires a current health cert and bill of sale for the horse to be registered to buyer with the state and for some travel within the state (usually a certain number of miles of travel) and outside of the state, and the health cert requires having a Coggins #.
[QUOTE=Justa Bob;8173669]
I think one reason posters are commenting about having 3 sides to every story is because there have been at least TWO epic COTH trainwrecks where the OP posts a sad sack story and after a few days it comes to light that the OP is a complete liar/nutcase. One about a free pony, one about strangles. Although highly entertaining once the truth was told, it does make the board a little more cautious. [/QUOTE]
What was the strangles one?
Thank you skyking! 
[QUOTE=Justa Bob;8176638]
Not to detract from the topic.
^ ^ I have searched and can’t locate the thread about the horse owner getting kicked out of her barn due to possible strangles. Maybe the thread was disappeared by the Mods, but I don’t think so. The HO was claiming she was being made to move horse by BO/BM because her horse might have strangles. Another poster from her barn replied and showed how her statements were contradictory and lies. She basically failed to follow strangles protocols thereby threatening to spread strangles at the barn. And of course there was more. Liars seem to love to embellish.
A better search sleuth might have success.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=IPEsq;8175656]
There are some additional states, like Colorado and Wyoming, where the buyer will need to have a brand inspection done, which requires a current health cert and bill of sale for the horse to be registered to buyer with the state and for some travel within the state (usually a certain number of miles of travel) and outside of the state, and the health cert requires having a Coggins #.[/QUOTE]
I believe the horse was in a brand state, I think she said that somewhere?
[QUOTE=roseymare;8175057]
OK you win the internet are you happy. It is apparently less than 20. But my question remains. If you are in one of these states, why would you need it in a contract that a Coggins or HC Needs to be done as it is a a requirement by law for the sale.[/QUOTE]
Except that’s not a complete list. You have to have a current Coggins to move a horse in KY.
