Paul Valliere Ad -October 26

[cbv]

I was just struck by the irony, on the one hand, that most of the folks here could more easily forgive fraud or larceny than what we as horse lovers perceive as unconscionable cruely…but the law doesn’t recognize the latter, only the former.

At the same time, I was also struck by the irony of the double standards we apply to other livestock (and which I am as guilty of as the next person).

And which is really a subject for another thread all together, and I realized my mistake in posting my mental musings, and was going to delete my response, but it had already been ‘caught’. So I tried to explain myself, and worried the rest of the afternoon and wished that I had followed Michelle Mc’s lead and just gone riding.

[Jane]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Weatherford:
The AHSA (now USA Eq) fought him every step of the way - and it cost them a LOT of money to stand behind their decision to expell him. Even AB gives Jane Clark due credit and praise for her leadership in this expensive fight. The AHSA DID win in court, as you all know.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yup, and the little weasel filed a suit against the AHSA for $100 million!!

I still remember what was written in Hot Blood about how sweet and trusting Charisma was when Tommy Burns went to do his dirty deed…sigh…

[Glimmerglass]

>> many ads in The Chronicle tend to be self-serving <<

Regrettably this seems to be getting worse, too. It would be a very sad day when The Chronicle is nothing more than a weekly version of ‘Show Circuit’ magazine.

[Bethe_Mounce]

I saw the ad today, just got my Chronicle and had to actually look for it.

Why did he run the ad in the 1st place? To document something?

On a personal note, facts are facts and he arranged to have a horse killed for insurance money. I don’t think I want to see him hanging around at a show. I might get a bit crazy.

Many moons ago he tried to sell our family a Welsh stallion when my sister and I were children…does that tell you all something else about him? Thankfully my Mom knew what she was looking at.

[wesequest]

I too believe that we should give everyone a second chance to make things right in the horse business or in other aspects of life…However, when they move to another state or city and perform the same or similiar unprofessional acts, I wish that our governing equine body provided stricter punishments or at least provided a information base similiar to the Better Business Bureau.
Don’t you agree Bronkbuster?

[Seven]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WC YellowDog:

Rain Forest was shot - accidently. There was no “mysterious circumstances” involved. If I recall correctly, the Hunterdon grooms were playing cards in a grooming stall (Lake Placid) and a gun was fired. The horse, in an adjoining stall, was hit. It was a sad time for all.
Rain Forest was a wonderful horse!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks for clearing that up for me!

=^+^=

[dublin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Lindemann Jr went on with his life, as did the others… <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Too bad the various horses that were killed didn’t have that option…

“Of course, that’s just my opinion. I could be wrong.” - Dennis Miller
Still proud to be a UCLA Bruins football fan!

[SoEasy]

Since you choose to remain fairly anonymous yourself, most will never know what your motives might be.

If you choose to come here to post, kindly remember to be civil to fellow posters.

Thank you.

[Coreene]

Well if you’re not sticking up for him in your posts, then I guess we are all retarded for reading them and thinking just that.

[buryinghill2]

I was stabled next to GL in the old permanent barns in Palm Beach the year So Dark died. He suffered a long time while they fought it out with the insurance company. Their blacksmith at the time was George Fitzgerald and I remember he was fighting mad at the fact that they let that poor horse suffer so long. What a tragedy…

[JustJumpIt19]

Call me stupid but what exactly did this guy do before?

~Courtney~

[Quinn]

“Didn’t mean to get into trouble?” - Who does?

“Bad judgement?” - Having an innocent being killed is being referred to as BAD JUDGEMENT???

In my opinion, hurt yourself - stupid you.

Hurt someone/something else - you’re an a$$hole.

Should never again be permitted to be around animals of ANY description. IMHO.

[This message was edited by Quinn on Nov. 05, 2001 at 10:57 AM.]

[Weatherford]

What would be the chance of putting those obituaries online??

PLEASE??

[Dry_Clean_Only]

How about we get back to talking about the real villians rather than complaining about the ‘lazy kids’ that you hired?

No new news on Paul’s judging job in NH, so I assume it will still happen.

All of this happened when I first got into riding, some of my first memories of reading the Chronicle were articles talking about Marion Hulick, Barney Ward and GL’s sentencing

[jSTR]

we all make mistakes. Granted, his was an exceptionally bad one, but was a mistake, nonetheless. A lot of people hate him just because of his mistake. Paul Valliere has done a whole lot for me. I’ve cliniced with him-- he gave me a seat. He’s given me horses to ride, because he didn’t think I had enough “saddle time”, he’s stopped his lessons to compliment me if he saw me doing something right, or if he saw me doing something wrong (I’ve never “trained” with him, but my trainer used his ring). He happens to be a very nice man.
What he did he did a long time ago. He has certainly put in his dues. He is very hard working, very kind, very selfless, and very negatively affected by his mistakes. A lot of us screw up and get to walk away from it. He did not. (nor does he deserve to) If he wants to put an ad in the chronicle, let him. THIS IS HIS JOB!!! and you know what? he doesn’t have people walking up to him at the ingate after they see one of his kids go and asking “can my kid take some lessons”. He doesn’t get to have a banner full of ribbons in the front row of tents at all these major shows. The chronicle is and always will be a way to spread news. It is a form of media. If paul wants to announce that he’s giving to the animals of the sept. 11th attacks, and wants to announce where/when he’ll be giving lessons and how to contact him, let him. Who knows. I might be giving him a call.

charter memeber, Thread Killers Anonymous
(yes, this means you should yell at me when my posts are too long, and bump threads that I kill)

"People come and go in this Forest, and they say, ‘It’s only Eeyore, so it doesn’t count.’ They walk to and fro saying ‘Ha Ha!’. BUMP MY POSTS!!!

[Midge]

Weatherford,

 Sadly, Tommy Burns was the link to most of the horse killers who were tried and convicted.  Those who killed the horses themselves were smart enough to keep it to themselves, for the most part.

‘If ignorance is bliss, why aren’t more people happy?’

[thecowboyway]

Jumphigh83, that was so uncalled for. I’ve ridden with Paul off and on for the last 15 years, I too think what he did was horrible, but it a very odd way its made him a better person. I think he truly enjoys now what he’s priveledged enough to get to do for a living. He certainly doesn’t hide from his past and he is willing to openly discuss his sins. Those of us who choose to associate with him do so because we believe in him, and no not blindly.

[dublin]

James Hulick died in 1999 at age 45. Here’s the obituary from Chronicle of the Horse.

JAMES HENRY HULICK

James Henry Hulick, the winner of the 1970 AHSA Hunter Seat Medal Finals and reserve champion of the ASPCA Maclay
Finals, died on June 23 after a long battle with multiple sclerosis. He was 45.

Mr. Hulick, of Sterling, Mass., began riding as a child, excelling in the pony divisions with Neat N Tidy, the junior hunter divisions
with Happy Ending, General C, Force Of Habit, Miracle Jet, and Public Affair, among others. He then claimed several equitation
championships on Tiny�s Thought with the help of trainers Victor Hugo-Vidal and George Morris.

Mr. Hulick continued as a professional rider and trainer in both the hunter and jumper rings. In 1974, he claimed the National
Leading Rider title at the Washington International aboard J.C. Penny�s Willie Wonderful and won the Grand Prix of Ox Ridge
(Conn.).

He is survived by parents Henry F. Hulick and Marion J. Gassler of Sterling, Mass., and sister Gale M. Hulick of Winchendon,
Mass.

I had no idea that his sister had such significant health problems as well.

[Jane]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jSTR:
and you know what? he doesn’t have people walking up to him at the ingate after they see one of his kids go and asking “can my kid take some lessons”. He doesn’t get to have a banner full of ribbons in the front row of tents at all these major shows.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, and he had all that at one time. I don’t think anyone’s here to argue his ability and talent as a trainer and salesman.

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The chronicle is and always will be a way to spread news. It is a form of media. If paul wants to announce that he’s giving to the animals of the sept. 11th attacks, and wants to announce where/when he’ll be giving lessons and how to contact him, let him. Who knows. I might be giving him a call.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, I certainly am not faulting the COTH for running the ad; it’s how the magazine makes money, and P.V. is certaily entitled to run any ads, anywhere he chooses. But I think as a reader of the magazine, I am also entitled to an opinion of what I think of the ad…after all, isn’t that what advertising is about?

BTW, I’d like to clarify my previous post…when I said I’d question the motive, I meant the motive behind placing the ad announcing the donation, NOT the motive behind the donation.

[BronkBusterTX]

…since you all so vehemently have posted AGAINST Paul Valliere advertising in the COTH. What about the people who advertise FOR HIM?

For instance Missy Clark has advertised “Special thanks to Paul Valliere”. Does that mean she puts money in his pocket?

I think it is sad that some of you are negative about Pauls’ attempt to follow the terms of his suspension. He is providing proof of his benevolence of animal welfare. At least he is trying.

I don’t think any of us are going to EVER FORGET the harm that Paul, Barney, Dana, Tommy Burns, George Lindemann Jr. and others have done to our sport. However I think we should begin to forgive.