[QUOTE=barnbabe718;2660848]
I tend to avoid these threads like the plague but wanted to point out that the article referenced above is about a different barn, actually called Aces Wild but spelled Acres for whatever reason.[/QUOTE]
Yes! It was ACES wild and it was a QH barn owned and operated by a Rene Pina who is presently incarcrated for the abuse.
Who died and made you Supreme Arbiter?
I can sure as hell be picky about methods of killing horses.
So can the state.
You are delusional, dearest.
Basically, PV teaching riding and horsemanship is like Andrea Yates teaching classes on parenting.
For those of you that think he is so wonderful, surely you realize that when the horse killings happened, the trainers/owners involved were thought of as good, professional trainers. They weren’t starving or abusing their horses, and had reputations as good trainers. I’m sure those around them never would have thought that they could do something so awful. Kinda like you think of them now.
[QUOTE=Silk;2661247]
Yes! It was ACES wild and it was a QH barn owned and operated by a Rene Pina who is presently incarcrated for the abuse.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for clearing that up! I thought that was too bizarre!
WARNING…BLUNT WORDS FOLLOWING… NOT FOR THE SENSITIVE
For anyone who thinks that electrocution is an exceptable form of euthanasia you need to go over to Google and get a copy of the AVMA Guide to Euthanasia.
This quote is from that source. While electric current is used, particularly in the fur industry you can see that it is neither fast nor simple.
Edited to remove footnote reference numbers, bolding mine
I do not, for a moment, believe the case under discussion involved a one-step death
Electrocution, using alternating current, has been used as a method of euthana Electrocution induces death by cardiac fibrillation, which causes cerebral hypoxia. However, animals do not lose consciousness for 10 to 30 seconds or more after onset of cardiac fibrillation. It is imperative that animals be unconscious before being electrocuted. This can be accomplished by any acceptable means, including electrical stunning. Although an effective, 1step stunning and electrocution method has been described for use in sheep and hogs, euthanasia by electrocution in most species remains a 2-stepprocedure.
Advantages—(1) [B]Electrocution is humane if the animal is first rendered unconscious.[/B] (2) It does not chemically contaminate tissues. (3) It is economical.
Disadvantages—(1) Electrocution may be hazardous to personnel. (2) When conventional single-animal probes are used, it may not be a useful method for mass euthanasia because so much time is required per animal. (3) It is not a useful method for dangerous, intractable animals. (4) It is aesthetically objectionable because of violent extension and stiffening of the limbs, head, and neck. (5) It may not result in death in small animals (< 5 kg) because ventricular fibrillation and circulatory collapse do not always persist after cessation of current flow. [B]Recommendations—Euthanasia by electrocution requires special skills and equipment that will ensure passage of sufficient current through the brain to induce loss of consciousness and cardiac fibrillation in the 1-step method for sheep and hogs, or cardiac fibrillation in the unconscious animal when the 2-step procedure is used.[/B] Although the method is conditionally acceptable if the aforementioned requirements are met, its disadvantages far outweigh its advantages in most applications. Techniques that apply electric current from head to tail, head to foot, or head to moistened metal plates on which the animal is standing are unacceptable.Call me crazy, but I would be scared as hell that he was doing his own night checks…
Uhhhh, me too. Yikes.
Hoopoe, I’m sure it’s not an easy thing to do… sometimes humane euthanasia can go wrong… thats why the cowards involved in all this hired someone to do it for them…lets not forget that there was a woman who was killed in all this also… I know PV wasnt directly involved with Helen Brach, but we will suffice to say that if PV wasnt found out, who knows what else he was capable of!
Hey…did anybody else see the news story on the old Brach family candy factory building burning down over the weekend or late last week?
Odd, I just saw that a couple of days ago and now this thing pops back up for another rehash.
Look. Nobody who has thought out their position on PV, pro or con, is going to change their mind.
Ummh, admitted, I have not read this entire thread…but, perhaps Mr. Paul should burn in hell with Michael Vick. The man should not be allowed anywhere near a horse, or any other animal.
Yes, those involved with the death of my stallion just “keep on and on” and even after a guilty verdict… in FEDERAL Court People!!! Since then, they been honored with distinction in the industry and the USEF (our governing body!). The events leading to Saber’s death happened at a sanctioned horse show! They did not act in the best interest of the welfare of the horse or me as the owner and certainly did not act as directed by the vet on the PREVIOUS DAY! He died the next day after enduring several hours in a hot van to go to the time/clinic/vet of their choice.
In the death of Grande Saber…
The “regulars” were found GUILTY by UNANIMOUS VERDICT by a jury of their peers. After a 21/2 week civil trial before the presiding judge, the Honorable Anne E. Thompson, of Federal Court of New Jersey. October 2003; trial ended. The case is : Action Number 00-6258 (AET); United States District Court of New Jersey…
The charge…NEGLIGENCE in the Death of Grande Saber. He died a hedious death! The details are beyond description.
[INDENT]One defendant was named Horseman of the Year that SAME year! [/INDENT]These people went on to the Olympics, other World events and business as usual without a sideways glance from the USEF. Perhaps the governing body could learn from the NFL …who took care of VicK’s future due to his actions off the field. They don’t seem to have any trouble culling a “star quarterback”!
I didn’t realise that this was not general knowledge. Again, here is the link:http://hometown.aol.com/__121b_izhHAQRy79eJoTLS9+jvNCVJp4lijC+znHA5d/XYv2w=
[QUOTE=xegeba;2661009]
Yes, he does… and so does every other person that makes money in that world. Trainers, vets, grooms, braiders, shoers, owners… the horses are expendable. [/QUOTE]
Just who the f**k do you think you are??? Why does making a living as a braider, which I do, mean I think the horses are expendable?? The horses are certainly NOT expendable, becuase if they are not there, I am not making money.
I don’t know why you always think you have the be all to end all answers, but obviously you have no idea what you are talking about.
[QUOTE=Midge;2661468]
Just who the f**k do you think you are??? Why does making a living as a braider, which I do, mean I think the horses are expendable?? The horses are certainly NOT expendable, becuase if they are not there, I am not making money.
I don’t know why you always think you have the be all to end all answers, but obviously you have no idea what you are talking about.[/QUOTE]
I have to agree…even Xegeba’s posts do not make sense.
I do love some of the late nite posts on here. All this time I thought xegeba actually owned a horse and was a pro trainer on some level. Guess not since she claims all in those categories treat horses as expendable and would not state that if she actually owned or trained since that would include her.
Far as the other situation…sad but not paying to kill one then lying to collect insurance.
[QUOTE=HorseShowMama;2661133]
I can’t see how this proves that he cares about the welfare of horses. He could have had the vet out BEFORE having someone jump her around when the leg was already swollen. The strain may not have been HUGE when he first got the horse. It sounds to me like didn’t want to wait for her to heal, he wanted to sell her before anyone realized she was going to be out for a while. Note that he was still talking about what a great match it was when it was clear she was out. And by the way, if the horse was on consignment, he wasn’t paying for that expensive stall himself anyway.
(edited to say that I’m not saying he necessarily did anything wrong in this story about selling the horse, I’m just saying it doesn’t sound like solid proof that he’s a great horseman.)[/QUOTE]
You clearly didn’t read my post fully. He warned us BEFORE I rode the horse that there might be something going on but it might be just from scratches (she had those too and wasn’t lame on it), LOWERED the price significantly, and then LOWERED it by half. If he just wanted to get rid of the horse and let somebody else find out I think he would have been smart enough to just say that the swelling was from the scratches don’t you think? The horse wasn’t on consignment, it was imported by him.
Motocross deserves better.
dahlin’ - I hate to say this, but he was still trying to sell you a lame horse. Probably a lame, overpriced horse… :rolleyes:
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
[QUOTE=alterbecauseimacoward;2659346]
He didn’t do it to someone else’s horse…he did it to his own horse because he was financially struggling. It’s not like he runs around with alligator clips killing random horses.
All of those besides the sleeping with your employee/employer are ACCIDENTS, which are different than MISTAKES.
From dictionary.com[/QUOTE]
And here’s the poster that the English word “pillock” was invented for!
Whoops what a silly mistake… Something anyone could easily have done. Went and electrocuted the horse by mistake and then by mistake submitted a fraudulent claim for $75,000 to the Insurance company and then whoops another mistake.
GOT CAUGHT, GOT BANNED
So not a little mistake as in a slight error of judgement. Rather a deliberate act undertaken with malicious intent to profit and which was cruel and criminal.
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