Pinto Warmblood Pedigree Help!!!

[nthesaddle33]

Sorry for the long post! Need some help with where to find more info

So I purchased my 2007 gelding about 2.5 years ago. I was told he was a supposed paint/tb. His dam was originally purchased in foal with him and to use for breeding. He was born, sat in a field for the first couple years and then quickly broke and sold. When I got him I knew he was definitely not fitting the paint type. He is very hot, gets stressed quite easily, has gorgeous movement, tracks up well, etc. People kept questioning me if he was a warmblood. I finally did the DNA test through Texas A&M and got the results back that the 3 most dominant breeds that showed up were 1) Trakehener 2) Holsteiner and 3) Hanoverian. Literally no paint or tb results. I’m just trying to figure out where to go next. I want to find out more info on him and am having zero luck. Can’t find any info on his dam or sire and am very curious about the breed results (which I know are not always entirely accurate). Okay enough ranting. Help anyone???

Pics:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4624850354680&l=7ca954197e

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4418283990650&l=294735afc0

[beowulf]

[QUOTE=nthesaddle33;8703462]
Sorry for the long post! Need some help with where to find more info

So I purchased my 2007 gelding about 2.5 years ago. I was told he was a supposed paint/tb. His dam was originally purchased in foal with him and to use for breeding. He was born, sat in a field for the first couple years and then quickly broke and sold. When I got him I knew he was definitely not fitting the paint type. He is very hot, gets stressed quite easily, has gorgeous movement, tracks up well, etc. People kept questioning me if he was a warmblood. I finally did the DNA test through Texas A&M and got the results back that the 3 most dominant breeds that showed up were 1) Trakehener 2) Holsteiner and 3) Hanoverian. Literally no paint or tb results. I’m just trying to figure out where to go next. I want to find out more info on him and am having zero luck. Can’t find any info on his dam or sire and am very curious about the breed results (which I know are not always entirely accurate). Okay enough ranting. Help anyone???

Pics:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4624850354680&l=7ca954197e

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4418283990650&l=294735afc0[/QUOTE]
For posterity…

I wasn’t aware that HOL and HAN could show up individually on breed tests… how does that work?

[cloudyandcallie]

???
Warmbloods are registries in europe. Only in America do people think they are breeds. Even the closed book Trakehners have lots of Arab blood in them.

European WBs have TB and Arab blood.

I’d be skeptical of any DNA test that said Cloudy is “part Dutch” or
part Oldenburger, etc. He’s 1/2 TB and 20% Arab, and was branded premium in the then Hessen registry.

One of Cloudy’s ancestors close up was born “French Anglo-Arabian TB”" but was purchased by the burgermeister of Oldenburg and admitted to the oldenburg stud. If that showed up on a DNA test, I’d demand my money back. I’ve only used DNA for criminal trial matching, not for determining anything else…

[nthesaddle33]

I contacted Texas A&M and they said that his DNA matched most similarly to these 3 breeds, however since they are all European and somewhat similar that it was not possible to determine the exact amounts or which was more dominant than the others. I’m just trying to figure out what to call him and if I can find out more info on where to go from here haha!

[Highflyer]

Your best bet if you know his sire and dam’s names is to try to track down them/ track down his breeder and get information that way.

[beowulf]

[QUOTE=nthesaddle33;8703517]
I contacted Texas A&M and they said that his DNA matched most similarly to these 3 breeds, however since they are all European and somewhat similar that it was not possible to determine the exact amounts or which was more dominant than the others. I’m just trying to figure out what to call him and if I can find out more info on where to go from here haha![/QUOTE]Assuming/giving OP benefit of the doubt…

Someone can correct me if I am wrong, since I have not done a test with Texas A&M but IIRC, the tests don’t come back with specific WB breeds or registries, rather, they come back with something like “western/eastern warmblood” or some other variant - and if that’s the case, arabian and thoroughbred should at the very least be present with any warmblood percentage.

Genetically, I cannot imagine how you could distinguish between breed registries that interbreed with each other like HOL, HAN, GOV. They wouldn’t have enough markers to do it.

[Nootka]

Those 3 breeds 2 of which do not have Pinto in them.

Trakehner … maybe (very unlikely because even in that breed it is very rare)… where Pinto came from

I wouldn’t believe the DNA results. They are more for “fun” not definite. Wish I could see the pics but I can’t see FB and my phone is broken so can’t see them there.

Is he branded? look on left “thigh”

If he is “WB” it is most likely through Samber or Ico. That is about as close as you can get. I would call him a Pinto and you could register with that color registry.

[beowulf]

[QUOTE=Nootka;8703535]
Those 3 breeds 2 of which do not have Pinto in them.

Trakehner … maybe… where Pinto came from

I wouldn’t believe the DNA results. They are more for “fun” not definite. Wish I could see the pics but I can’t see FB and my phone is broken so can’t see them there.

Is he branded? look on left “thigh”[/QUOTE]

Hmm… I think there are pinto HAN stallions, at the very least… There’s a lot of color in KPWN too.

[Nootka]

In those 3 registries there is NO pinto Hanoverian and Holst and very very few Trak. (as in Tobiano)

Oldenburg yes. There are still few KWPN. Samber was the first KWPN and there still haven’t been that many APPROVED after him.

There have been a few Pinto Oldenburgs approved

[nthesaddle33]

[QUOTE=Highflyer;8703528]
Your best bet if you know his sire and dam’s names is to try to track down them/ track down his breeder and get information that way.[/QUOTE]

I unfortunately don’t have that info and I don’t believe they were even registered.

[nthesaddle33]

[QUOTE=beowulf;8703531]
Assuming/giving OP benefit of the doubt…

Someone can correct me if I am wrong, since I have not done a test with Texas A&M but IIRC, the tests don’t come back with specific WB breeds or registries, rather, they come back with something like “western/eastern warmblood” or some other variant - and if that’s the case, arabian and thoroughbred should at the very least be present with any warmblood percentage.

Genetically, I cannot imagine how you could distinguish between breed registries that interbreed with each other like HOL, HAN, GOV. They wouldn’t have enough markers to do it.[/QUOTE]

I have the results on paper. They do specify between breeds as which are most dominant according to the DNA however they cannot distinguish between them very well, which is why he is some sort of European warmblood apparently. I’m just confused as to how he is a buckskin pinto. He may have TB in him just not the most dominant breed, according to Texas A&M

[nthesaddle33]

[QUOTE=Nootka;8703535]
Those 3 breeds 2 of which do not have Pinto in them.

Trakehner … maybe (very unlikely because even in that breed it is very rare)… where Pinto came from

I wouldn’t believe the DNA results. They are more for “fun” not definite. Wish I could see the pics but I can’t see FB and my phone is broken so can’t see them there.

Is he branded? look on left “thigh”

If he is “WB” it is most likely through Samber or Ico. That is about as close as you can get. I would call him a Pinto and you could register with that color registry.[/QUOTE]

He is not branded. The girl I bought him from thought he was paint with some tb but I was very skeptical because of his temperament and movement. I grew up with a full paint and have had tons of experience with them and he definitely is not very quarter horse like! hahaha

[nthesaddle33]

[QUOTE=Nootka;8703555]
In those 3 registries there is NO pinto Hanoverian and Holst and very very few Trak. (as in Tobiano)

Oldenburg yes. There are still few KWPN. Samber was the first KWPN and there still haven’t been that many APPROVED after him.

There have been a few Pinto Oldenburgs approved[/QUOTE]

I know he is not full anything, definitely has to have a combo of things but I’m just trying to figure out where to go with this info. What breed to I call him? Haha

[Nootka]

Information about Samber and Ico

Very unlikely for you to find out bloodlines or registry with such little information

Samber bloodline http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?z=DL6XV-&d=samber&x=0&y=0

[nthesaddle33]

[QUOTE=Nootka;8703574]
Information about Samber and Ico

Very unlikely for you to find out bloodlines or registry with such little information

Samber bloodline http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?z=DL6XV-&d=samber&x=0&y=0[/QUOTE]

That’s what I figured. What do I call him then? Is he a German Warmblood since they are all very close to that? I don’t know much about warmbloods as you can tell other than the fact I never thought I’d be able to afford one lol

[Nootka]

Really can’t call him anything but grade Pinto.

You could get him registered with AWS so you get award if you compete … then American Warmblood Society registered

Then, you can call him an American warmblood.

Here is a good start on Warmblood education

[Huntin_Pony]

Don’t sell TB x Paint (or pinto) short.

I’d be proud of my horse (as the captions on your photos suggest that you are) and call him a STAR!

[Nootka]

I just noticed you said Buckskin Pinto.

No dilution in Han or Holst. Trak dilution just very very recently happened. Your dude may be a Paint x with WB. Not unheard of. He may also be a TB x Paint with those colors. Maybe the TB was related to Euro blood and that is how the results came up. Unfortunately, you won’t ever know I just wouldn’t trust the DNA results. Do a search on COTH feature, there have been some reporting back the results. Not something to count on.

[DMK]

eh, you are in the Mid Atlantic and Silverwood Farm is in the Mid Atlantic, chances are he is down through one of her pinto WBs (Samber line). But that’s just a guess, and that’s probably as good as it gets.

[Action42]

I, too, can’t imagine how a DNA test can sort out the difference between HOLST, HAN and OLD. In fact, my yearling is registered OLD, but has both HAN and HOLST blood. How would he test??

DNA testing for breeds is much more for entertainment purposes than for actual fact.