Quick question about a hoof injury! (UPDATE from good vet)

[NinaL_aka_Chrissy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Chanda:

NinaL, that is interesting! I am curious to see whether there really are hormones in his system. I pray that he does not have a retained testicle, that sounds like a nightmare. Since his ultrasound will not be for another month I am going to wait until then to do the blood test. His behaviour is not really a problem in the situation that he is in now. He basically just sits in his paddock all day and plays kissy-face with his friends. No one really handles him much so he should be fine until next month. They are also quite used to dealing with difficult animals there. Right now they have this little crooked legged Arab stallion that stands straight up on his hind legs and tries to clobber you with is front legs. Luckily Chase doesn’t do anything like that!

If it is all behavioural then I will have to deal with it. There is a girl at the farm where he is at that is great with difficult horses. She really likes Chase and wants to help me work with him. She will teach me how to be the leader and help me teach Chase that he must respect me. I am very excited to have met such a wonderful and giving person. She also wants to ride him when he is all healed and told her she is more than welcome to.

Hopefully everything will turn out OK.

Bowed tendon: 62 days down, minimum 28 days to go. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

One good thing about an injury is it gives you plenty of time to think about the other things you want to do with your horse!

“Studdy” behaviour is not uncommon in geldings especially if they were gelded late or did not learn the niceties of horse-y social behavior. Also, more aggressive geldings tend to act more studdy than submissive ones.

Interesting story about the Arab stallion - I had a friend who had one that acted just like that. Gelding him did the trick. You have to wonder why something with crooked legs and a bad temperament is still a stallion .

Good luck with Chase and keep us posted!

Nina

[I]“We who choose to surround ourselves with lives even more temporary than our own, live within a fragile circle, easily and often breached. Unable to accept its awful gaps, we still would live no other way. We cherish memory as the only certain immortality, never fully understanding the necessary plan.”

Irving Townsend. [/I]

[Chanda]

I will have a vet look at it today since there is one coming out (not my regular). I guess this is just one of those things that you have to deal with when boarding, kind of no ones fault. I sure wish I could get the barn to pay for it though, ug. Darn!

Bowed tendon: 41 days down, minimum 19 days to go.

[Chanda]

Now I am pissed. My horse is out there with a swollen leg and a hole in the bottom of his hoof standing in his dirty paddock and I can’t do anything about it until tomorrow. What is wrong with this vet?!? He didn’t even recommend soaking it or anything. I hope the fact that it is unwrapped and dirty doesn’t make things worse and cost me more money for something that is not even my fault in the first place and never would have happened at home.

The vet did say that he was not lame on it at all. I guess that was his excuse for not doing anything. He said if he becomes tender that he would put him on antibiotics. Does this sound normal, do nothing until it hurts?

Bowed tendon: 41 days down, minimum 19 days to go.

[Chanda]

I forgot to mention that I don’t think I am even being charged for the first vet. I wouldn’t just not pay and not tell anyone or say anything. I would just call them and tell them that I really didn’t feel comfortable with what he did and he didn’t really do anything at all so it is not like I am not paying him for supplies or things that he used on my horse. Seriously, all he did was pick up a dirty hoof pick that was laying on the ground, pick up the foot, poke at it twice, watch him trot and turn to me to ask me what I thought. He did say anything about how sound he looked or anything. Then he just said, ‘wait and see’. That is it. It took less that 2 minutes which is about the amount of time that it took to bring the original horse he was coming to see out of it’s stall and walk it over for him to look at.

I will pay half of the farm call (which I am not sure I am even being charge for) but I will not pay more than that. Sorry, but I feel like putting him back in the paddock with no protection was wrong. I didn’t feel comfortable doing it and now my horse may have abcessed and had it burst out through his heel. I am not happy about that.

Bowed tendon: 42 days down, minimum 18 days to go.

[Chanda]

I didn’t have wrapping supplies because I thought the VET would be wrapping it. That is why I had the vet look at my horse, to make sure that he was OK and to wrap and give him the tetnus shot. When the vet did nothing I went straight home and called my regular vet. She didn’t call me back until the next morning because she didn’t think it was an emergency. I picked up the supplies right away and drove straight out to take care of my horse.

I am not sure what you wanted me to do? I don’t think you can buy icthamol at the grocery store. Besides, the first vet that looked at Chase is a VERY prominant vet in this area, he has a very large and well known pratice and is supposed to be one of the best vets in CA. Am I really not supposed to think even for one minute that he might know what he is talking about? Yes, I didn’t agree and yes, it should have been wrapped and yes, I called my other vet to take care of it but I can’t believe that you are telling me that ‘I’ was wrong. Wasn’t it the ‘vet’ that was wrong? I did everything I could do to fix the situation.

It is a great idea to have a first aid kit in the car since my horse is so far from home but since I was meeting the vet I really thought ‘I’ wouldn’t need equipment, that is why they drive trucks full of stuff like bandages, shots and icthamol. I really did think I could depend on a VET for my veterinary needs.

I do have a basic first aid kit at home for my horse, it does not however contain banamine. When my horse gets sick I call the vet immediately and let them take care of administering any medication. My vet will come out immediately for emergencies like colic. Her and her practice is actually very close to me so it doesn’t take her long to get here (Chase got bit by a spider and had a strange reaction and she was here FAST).

So since you all think I am a horrible horse owner and completely unprepared do deal with any medical situation should I just leave or what? I personally feel like I did a pretty good job under the circumstances and the second vet actually told me that I did a great job and complimented me twice on how I dealt with the situation and my wonderful wrapping skills. Why is it that everyone in ‘real’ life is saying I did great and you guys are the only ones that are trying to make me feel bad.

You guys are making it seem like I did nothing and didn’t care. Personally I feel like, noticing the damn thing in the first place was good, and not pulling it out was good (the barn manager did though before I could stop her), and wrapping it was good and having the vet look at it was good, and not trusting what he said was good , and calling my regular vet right away was good, and getting supplies from her was good, and soaking it and wrapping it was good, and having another vet out to look at him was good, and getting his tetnus vaccine taken care of was good, and keeping it soaked and wrapped some more was good. So all that I did that was bad was not carry wrapping supplies to a VET appointment?

This is too much. I am a person that is knowledgable enough to know when to call the vet and not try and take care of things myself. That is what I have always done in my almost 20 years of horse experience. When it comes to my horses health, I call the vet. That is what I do, I have a special savings account JUST for things like this and I NEVER touch that money except for veterinary things. I don’t feel like that is a bad thing at all. They are the professionals and I would rather pay them to take care of my horse than possibly diagnose something wrong and treat it myself. I was also a veterinary technician and learned that the Dr. is the one with knowledge and I am the one who carries out the tasks. That is how I still feel. The Dr. can tell me what is wrong and how to treat it and I carry out that treatment.

So what is the deal, are you guys just sick of me or what? If you are just say so and I will leave and get out of your hair. Like I said twice already, I am sorry that I vented and said I didn’t want to pay the first vet. I was just angry. The guy is not charging me at all anyway and I am gladly paying the second vet that came out and really took care of my horse.

I know that you have my horse best interest at heart but I do to. Until you are standing right next to me you can’t possibly know what is really going on and what was really going on is that I was making the best of a bad situation. If my horse was at home this never would have happened so I was a little taken by surprise. I am allowed to be surprised and then deal with it. My horse really is in no danger of going without veterinary care. I am obsessive about that kind of thing. I even call the vet when there is nothing wrong with my horse, just for peace of mind that a little swelling is nothing. I am the one who noticed my horse rebowed his tendon when he was not in the lease bit lame and 2 different vets said he was fine until I insisted on an ultrasound which showed a tiny bit of damage (how many people can know that something is wrong with there horse that only an ultrasound can show?) That is why I posted on this board asking questions and ended up having two vets look at my horse. Please stop making me feel bad about that. My horse is in no danger from having me as his owner.

Bowed tendon: 44 days down, minimum 16 days to go.

[This message was edited by Chanda on Mar. 08, 2002 at 10:44 AM.]

[MeanderCreek]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by lilblackhorse:

LOLOL-it IS life. That’s why God made horse insurance

"/QUOTE]

and prozac!!!

www.meandercreekstable.com

[findeight]

Chanda I didn’t say anything about the injury or your reaction. I wasn’t there and did not see it.
I just said please pay the first vet. Even if you disagreed. Don’t read anything else into that statement.
I have no doubts that you are trying to do the best for your horse.

“I am drunk…and you’re crazy. Tomorrow I’ll be sober, you’ll be crazy for the rest of your life”. W.C. Fields in “It’s a Gift”

[daytimedrama]

Chanda- I am so glad to here Chase is going to be okay. I hope this doesn’t set back his return to work, what’s left? just a few weeks?

I can totally understand how you feel, there are some vets who i know that seem like they are on crack and it goes against everything that you know as a horse owner to listen to them.

I don’t know who the original vet you were talking about is but I think I know who your normal vet works for and he is awesome, if it’s the one I thinking of. I actually had him look at George’s x-rays as the vet check before I bought George.

These type of experiences are hard because you know how your horse should be treated and doing nothing is the hardest thing. Unfortuantly you had to try and listen to someone you didn’t trust, no one knows how it would have turned out if you didn’t get a second opinion.

Chase is very lucky to have you, but just don’t give your self a heart attack! He is fine , you are fine, everything is fine now!!! Breath and smile!!! He’ll be back to you soon, where you can see him more often and make sure his every need is met!!!

~Christina~
“I don’t patronize bunny rabbits!” -Heathers
Nothing is foolproof to a talented fool.

[Royal_Blue]

Have they ever checked to see if he is a ridgling (sp). My old TB was very studly, he would go afer other horses & could not be turned out next to any mare in heat unless I put vics in his nose. Vet checked to see if he had a retained testicle but it ended up that he was proud cut & still full of hormones. He was even worse than the 2 breeding stallions in the barn.

[findeight]

I would wait for the results of the tests before making any decisions. And hormones can only smooth the rough spots not eliminate holes in the training or other soundness issues.

“I am drunk…and you’re crazy. Tomorrow I’ll be sober, you’ll be crazy for the rest of your life”. W.C. Fields in “It’s a Gift”

[Quinn]

If you are at all able, I would try using a small syringe to “squirt” either some betadine or even peroxide (only once) into the puncture. Otherwise, a warm epsom salt soak followed up by a repeat of the treatment you’ve already done should suffice.

[This message was edited by Quinn on Mar. 05, 2002 at 08:08 AM.]

[Flash44]

I got my horse and gelded him as he was turning 5. It took YEARS for MOST of the studdish behavior to disappear. We tested him and his testosterone level was well within normal even though he was still a little studdish and ignorant in the spring and around mares. He is 12 now, and this is probably the easiest spring yet. knock on wood.

I’ll tell you once more before I get off the floor don’t bring me down…

[findeight]

Not necessarily just boarding. Horses seem to find things to get into regardless, sometimes I think a paper bag is good enough to cause a 6 week lay up for some.
At any rate concur with advice to get the vet out. Soak in epsom salts and poultice/wrap for a few days. Watch for a spike in temperature to indicate infection and abcess. If you are careful it does not sound like it went in so deep as to cause anything beyond this.

A good reputation taking thousands of years to build can be destroyed in a few hours.

[elizabeth]

Chanda, why don’t you call the vet that saw him?

Seriously, I think it is TOTALLY reasonable for you to call that vet - maybe even have him paged if you think you need to - and just say “I am really nervous b/c his leg is swollen. Could we try antibiotics just as a precaution?”

Good luck.

[jcotton]

Back to your question of how much epsom salts and water… I use about 1/4 -1/3 of a carton of the epsom salts that come in the 1/2 gallon size. Then put enough water into a deep black rubber feed tub to cover the hoof up to the coronary band. This deep rubber feed tub can be designated as your foot soaking tub.The water should be as hot as you can tolerate before you put the epsom salts in it. The epsom salts will cool it down alot.After soaking and drying off with a towel, I then put the icthamol on a gauze 4X4 on the hoof and then the diaper, and begin wrapping. Good luck and lots of patience. You may need to sit on a bucket with a good book to make sure the hoof stays in the epsom salts.

[Sandbarhorse]

I have a quick comment that I think is important (but of course, you be the judge)

Bat girl said:
“but soaking and wrapping certainly wouldn’t have done any harm even if the vet said it was not neccesary”.

I had an interesting experience about 2 years ago that may show this isn’t true. My horse caught his front foot just above the coronary bad getting up from a good roll. He had done this before in the 16 years I had him (though I had never seen how before) so I figured “no big deal”, I’ll soak, put some anibiotic salve on it and WRAP it (thought that since I had caught it before it got filthy I was in good shape). After a few days went by and it didn’t look as good as I thought it should (horse still limping, too) I called my vet who said that “I know you know what your’re doing, and I hate to tell you this, but wrapping it when it’s this warm out (early fall) has actually caused it to get infected”. He put the horse on antibiotics and said soak, but leave open with salve and coat with heavy fly spray.

I think harder about wrapping these days (and have made quite a few silly calls to the vet since). I don’t know that I can say what Chanda did was wrong, given the vet’s advice and that she did call her own vet right away.

[Chanda]

Well, luckily this valley has more horses than humans and because of this there are many vets availiable in this area. My regular vets practice alone has 4 great vets. I doubt that I will even have to be forced to use that first vet.

I will definitely take the advice given on this board (which is why I post on here) and get a better first aid kit for home and travel. Even if I had had one with me that day I am still not sure I would have gone against a professionals opinion without being able to consult another professional, which is exactly what I did when I got home.

I don’t know why I feel like I have to defend what I did or did not do on this board or why I feel like I must try and make everyone understand. Maybe because this board is more to me that it may be to most of you. As most of you know I live on a farm where I have little or no contact with anyone other than my non-horsey husband. I really have no real friends because I am so isolated. I really think of you guys as my friends even though I don’t actually know you all personally. Most people will feel hurt when their friends are a bit hard on them and will try and defend themselves and try and make their friend understand their situation so that their friends will go on liking them. This may sound lame and sad but that is just how my situation is and I am ok with it.

I just feel like a lot of the times when I ask questions about my horse I get people really being hard on me and I am not sure why. The questions that I ask start out being simple non-specific questions and end up being more personal and negative with me trying desperately to explain and make people understand me and failing to do that. I usually feel so possitive at first and in the end I feel like everyone is being pretty negative and it is affecting me. I am sure it must be something that I am doing or saying or that I am not able to explain things properly but I just wish I could learn how to stop this from happening. I don’t want to feel bad anymore and I want you all to understand me because you are an important part of my life and I could really use the advice and help I get from all of you.

Bowed tendon: 44 days down, minimum 16 days to go.

[Chanda]

First of all, #2 I meant, wouldn’t be nice if the stable payed for this because they are the ones that left a piece of wire in his paddock. I obviously know that they are not officially responsible but it sure is frustrating.

#5, Like I said, I was frustrated and venting. I didn’t like the fact that I had hired this man to come out and help my horse and he refused to do anything at all. That is not something I want to pay for. I don’t want to pay someone to do something and have them do nothing. The reason he didn’t do anything was because he already knew that he was not going to charge me (I didn’t know this) and therefore wasn’t going to make an effort. If he would have told me that he was doing this for free and didn’t really care in the beginning I would have not even had him look and would have called my own vet. So the guy was not/ is not charging me because he didn’t do anything. I already appologized THREE times for being upset about this.

Well, if the first vets course of action (no action) was followed, everyone on this board would have had my head on a platter. That is not why I called my regular vet or did the wrapping but am I not right here? Everyone seems so upset that I was not wrapping and now you are saying that I should have just done nothing?

Yeah, why do you think I was having an attack? I was worried. I thought that wrapping was the right thing to do and so did everyobody on this board but the vet didn’t want to do anything. I think I have a right to be concerned and try and get ahold of my regular vet. I didn’t want to do the wrong thing and listening to the first vet seemed like the wrong thing to me.

I didn’t just sit here whining on the computer. I called my regular vet and took a course of action. How would you even know if I was just sitting here not doing anything? Do you have some secret camera that follows me around? I certainly am not blaming anyone (other than the darn piece of wire). And, like I have said the first vet did not perform any services and is not charging me. I have already appologised what, four times now for saying what I said.

I really don’t feel like I am blaming anyone or making excuses. I am just trying to EXPLAIN what was going on and getting a little frustrated at the same time. I am not making things seem like they are SO hard or anything. Like I said I have a special savings set up for vet emergencies so I am not complaining about having to spend money. I just originally thought that the vet that did nothing was going to charge me when all along he knew he was not and, not only didn’t tell me that, but didn’t do anything.

I don’t understand why I am not allowed to try and explain my situation in order to get more accurate help. Would you rather that I just sit here and say ‘mmh’ when you are giving me advice that doesn’t make sense in my situation and wait around until someone hits the nail on the head? That might take a while. I would rather try and help people understand so I can get the help I need.

I guess I was wrong though. Apparently I am a bad horse owner and now I am a terrible person for being worried about my horse, having a mild freak out and not knowing what to do and trying to get help. Great. I feel much better now.

Bowed tendon: 44 days down, minimum 16 days to go.

[elizabeth]

Chanda:
(1) How is Chase? Fully recovered?
(2) Did he ever go lame? (Meaning, has he continued not to take a bad step on the hoof that the wire went into?)

Hopefully things are all better!

[Chanda]

Thanks guys. Chase is doing extra fine now after his new dentist went to work. He definitely needed his teeth done even though my regular vet didn’t see any problems. The dentist let me stick my hand WAY into his mouth and feel the edges of his back teeth. They definitely had sharp points on them. Poor guy! I am so pleased with my whole dentist experience and I am sure Chase is too. I am sure he feels so much better, he already has a kinder look in his eyes. He will now be on the schedual every year for this woman to take care of him (she checks every 6 months). It wasn’t even that expensive at all either. I feel so much better knowing that there is just one more thing getting us back on the road to recovery!

Bowed tendon: 48 days down, minimum 12 days to go.